Millennials and RVs

[shelbyfv]

Several threads recently have shown there are lots of elderly among us. Here's an article from USA Today regarding RVs and the youngsters. Link

[jplante4]

Well, it's been fun solving the nations's retirement problems...

CLOSED

[pnichols]

CFerguson wrote:

pnichols wrote:
....SS/Medicare/etc. for us will be WELL WORTH IT ...

You are, of course, entitled to your opinion.

It's way beyond an opinion.

Given that SS and Medicare are government managed and taxpayer funded insurance plans - it's how it actuarily works out for the DW and myself and probably millions of others.

It takes around a one million dollar well run investment to safely return (such that the principal amount doesn't decline so you always have it providing income) what our SS income provides per year.

And as for medical bills that Medicare pays for - good luck amassing a large enough well run investment to safely cover (such that the principal amount doesn't decline so you always have large sums of money available) what our Medicare may wind up paying for before we die.

The only substitute for a comprehensive insurance plan with a huge pay-in base is ... large personal wealth.

[shelbyfv]

Again, this is an incorrect perspective. When figuring investment returns you can only use "no risk" such as bank CDs to have comparable security. Before you could invest the amount of your FICA taxes each year you would have to deduct the cost of comparable disability and survivors insurance. In a nutshell, you would be "investing" much less at lower returns than you might imagine. There are other similar gotchas as winnietrey has pointed out. This is not new, people have had these misconceptions since the program started. Show some math that gets you to an age 120 "break even" and someone will undoubtedly be able to show you where you went wrong. Since we didn't have a choice as to whether we contributed or not, you'd think folks would be happy to learn that it turned out well.

[mich800]

CFerguson wrote:

shelbyfv wrote:
I don't think this is correct, maybe you could post your math.

I understand why you would ask, but it would result in my revealing my financial history and status which is no ones business. The math is correct, but everyone else's will be different. Often vastly different. fwiw, I have advanced degrees and worked a long time + was compensated accordingly.

For me, SS/Medicare/etc was/is theft. For people that don't/wont work, its found money.

CFerguson is correct. To put it in perspective. Assuming one begins solid earnings around 30 or at least early thirties. That puts your "ss investment" in the $1million range by retirement age base on historical investment returns. Maximum ss benefits is in the $30k range per year. So yes, it would take that long to draw down that investment based on the annual withdrawals.

And if that does not make sense go back and study why it is important to start saving in your 401k or other long term investments.

[winnietrey]

Others math, may vary of course. But in our case we will receive about 70k per year in Medicare, and social security benefits. (50K plus per year SS, and Medicare about 20k per year cheaper, than if we had to buy private insurance with the same benefits.

If we were to buy, a life time annuity, with a cola, that type of annuity would be about a mil and a half. To get that kind of return

We were pretty good savers, and have money in the bank. But I wonder, if we would have had the will power to save an additional 1.5 mil. Short answer I doubt it. And I think that would apply to most Americans.

I paid max social security and Medicare, for most of our 40 years in business, But I very much doubt, the total is more than 700k.

The other thing not mentioned is wealth transfer. How many of us had parents, that because of SS and Medicare, were able to stay in their own homes? Which when they passed us kids sold and made quite a profit. And they did not end up living with us for years.

So I don't know, I just think there are a lot of different ways to look at this

[CFerguson]

pnichols wrote:
....SS/Medicare/etc. for us will be WELL WORTH IT ...

You are, of course, entitled to your opinion.

[pnichols]

CFerguson wrote:

shelbyfv wrote:
I don't think this is correct, maybe you could post your math.

I understand why you would ask, but it would result in my revealing my financial history and status which is no ones business. The math is correct, but everyone else's will be different. Often vastly different. fwiw, I have advanced degrees and worked a long time + was compensated accordingly.

For me, SS/Medicare/etc was/is theft. For people that don't/wont work, its found money.

My partial resume reads about the same as your partial description above.

My DW never worked and I retired at 60 years old from a long and hectic industry career at one single company with no pension plan other than a self-directed IRA and some stock options.

SS/Medicare/etc. for us will be WELL WORTH IT ... and we're sure fortunate that the U.S. has these programs in place. However, there are even better programs in place in other countries.

For instance, the way our medical expenses have been going plus our SS income (being adjusted per an inflation index ever so often) - if we both live a few more years we will have indeed received condiserably more than we paid in.

I consider SS and Medicare for retirees as simply being based on the mathmatics of a nationwide insurance program in which an ever increasing employed base, paid in accordance with inflation, pays into such that an ever increasing retired base can reap the society-benefitting paybacks from.

Now ... if only we can keep those politicians from negatively messing with the math of what a self-sustaining insurance program requires ... that would be great. I'm all for the government keeping these programs fully in place, constantly improved, and properly funded from working folks' paycheck withholdings and employers' matching fees. 🙂

[CFerguson]

shelbyfv wrote:
Sorry, I can't figure this being the case even with maximum taxable earnings for 40 years. We'll just have to disagree, but folks can easily compute their own numbers. I just wanted to make it clear that most people get back far more than they contribute. FWIW, everyone who receives Social Security worked for it, with the exception of dependent spouses and children. In those cases, their benefits were part of the deal with the spouse or parent who worked. Now if you want to talk about a Social Security scam, look at the Disability program!

I really don't care if anyone believes me. I was trying to be polite.

[GHop]

For some, I believe it is the price of RV's, storage or the RV and the cost of parks.

[shelbyfv]

Sorry, I can't figure this being the case even with maximum taxable earnings for 40 years. We'll just have to disagree, but folks can easily compute their own numbers. I just wanted to make it clear that most people get back far more than they contribute. FWIW, everyone who receives Social Security worked for it, with the exception of dependent spouses and children. In those cases, their benefits were part of the deal with the spouse or parent who worked. Now if you want to talk about a Social Security scam, look at the Disability program!

[CFerguson]

shelbyfv wrote:
I don't think this is correct, maybe you could post your math.

I understand why you would ask, but it would result in my revealing my financial history and status which is no ones business. The math is correct, but everyone else's will be different. Often vastly different. fwiw, I have advanced degrees and worked a long time + was compensated accordingly.

For me, SS/Medicare/etc was/is theft. For people that don't/wont work, its found money.

[colliehauler]

twodownzero wrote:

colliehauler wrote:

twodownzero wrote:
Born 1983. Watched my generation fight the longest wars in American history. Served myself as well. Not sure if I'm a millennial or not, but it sure is easy to criticize my generation's struggle after the boomers clawed their way to the top with our money ($20 Trillion of it) and then pulled the ladder up on their way to retirement.

That said, I love camping, don't mind dumping my black tank, and I do all of my own car maintenance; been working on cars since I was 12 years old even though I wear a suit to work now.

Dude you weren't around when I earned my money. Despite the fact I don't have kids 50 percent of my KS tax money went towards education of your generation. I put in many 100 hr weeks during my career scrimped and saved for my retirement always living below my means. If you want to see the problem you better look in the mirror on who you elected that added to that dept. So far I've paid taxes for 40 years and not received one penny back. It's up to people like you and future generations to vote for people who do not add to that dept and try to reduce it, choose wisely!

My generation hasn't elected anybody. Young people don't vote. Old people are who decide elections. Sadly I think we're going the wrong way, continuing to elect people who will borrow and spend away the income of future generations for political gain. As I age, I wonder where the tipping point is of where I should just become selfish and stop caring; we're already 20 trillion in the hole with no end to that in sight and no incentive to fix it. Of course I talk to my friends and neighbors and all of you guys about it and have for at least a decade, but if nobody will listen, the problem will just continue.

I don't have kids either and I continue to pay taxes to support other people's offspring. My state is dead last in education as well.

I believe it's about 23 trillion now. I hope you don't stop caring. I think you are intelligent and get it with your statement (( Sadly I think we're going the wrong way, continuing to elect people who borrow and spend the income of future generations for political gain)). Sadly not enough people realize this. Nothing the government provides is free. To lump all boomers or millennials into a category is wrong.

[twodownzero]

colliehauler wrote:

twodownzero wrote:
Born 1983. Watched my generation fight the longest wars in American history. Served myself as well. Not sure if I'm a millennial or not, but it sure is easy to criticize my generation's struggle after the boomers clawed their way to the top with our money ($20 Trillion of it) and then pulled the ladder up on their way to retirement.

That said, I love camping, don't mind dumping my black tank, and I do all of my own car maintenance; been working on cars since I was 12 years old even though I wear a suit to work now.

Dude you weren't around when I earned my money. Despite the fact I don't have kids 50 percent of my KS tax money went towards education of your generation. I put in many 100 hr weeks during my career scrimped and saved for my retirement always living below my means. If you want to see the problem you better look in the mirror on who you elected that added to that dept. So far I've paid taxes for 40 years and not received one penny back. It's up to people like you and future generations to vote for people who do not add to that dept and try to reduce it, choose wisely!

My generation hasn't elected anybody. Young people don't vote. Old people are who decide elections. Sadly I think we're going the wrong way, continuing to elect people who will borrow and spend away the income of future generations for political gain. As I age, I wonder where the tipping point is of where I should just become selfish and stop caring; we're already 20 trillion in the hole with no end to that in sight and no incentive to fix it. Of course I talk to my friends and neighbors and all of you guys about it and have for at least a decade, but if nobody will listen, the problem will just continue.

I don't have kids either and I continue to pay taxes to support other people's offspring. My state is dead last in education as well.

[2012Coleman]

Maybe the millennial's will not treat their younger generation with such contempt and the world will be a better place.