RV Antifreeze

[PapaRomeo]

I just came from an RV repair place and the owner warned me not to use RV antifreeze containing alcohol because it deteriorates the rubber seals. He then went into a sales pitch for his own rv antifreeze containing propylene glycol. He then said his rv antifreeze imparts a bad odor to the system, but he had another chemical treatment that reverses the odor.

Now for years I have used the standard rv antifreeze (contains ethanol) and have never had a problem with rubber seals except now in the toilet and THAT IS AFTER 19 YEARS OF SERVICE!!!! I really can't argue with 19 years of trouble free toilet function.

Soooo. Does anyone have some input on rv antifreeze - ethanol or propylene glycol? I am aware of the "combustion" possibility of ethanol. Others have said ethanol causes "bad taste." I never drink camper water only bottled water. What about bad odor that needs to be eliminated with something else? Is what he said all sales hype?

Any thoughts and experience would be welcomed.

PapaRomeo

[BarneyS]

wa8xym wrote:
Drain anything in the fresh water tank (Not easy on my rig)

What about setting your rig to draw from the fresh tank, open the low point cold water valve and the tank drain valve, and turn on the water pump? That's the way I do it and it pumps out the fresh tank pretty quickly compared to letting it just gravity drain.

Also, in the Spring, I just run water through all the lines till they run clear and the smell is gone (only takes a few minutes), sanitize and everything is good to go. Not a hassle at all! :):C
Barney

[wa8yxm]

For the fresh water system there is an even better "Anti-Freeze" AIR yes AIR Now the truth is air can freeze (If I recall correctly -273C) but if it does you won't care about it (or for that matter anything else)

Open all valves in including low point drains,
Cycle the ice maker to gravity drain those lines. (manually cycle)
Drain and bypass the water heater on atwood disconnect a wire from the ECO
Drain anything in the fresh water tank (Not easy on my rig)

Lay a towel under the water pump inlet strainer and open it up and drain it. Run pump for oh say a minute dry (all valves including low point drains open)
Turn off pump
Hook up air compressor (i use a six gallon job) via a blow out adapter plug (any RV store or the proper shelf at Wallmart and blow grabial blow.

With a six gallon I run out of air let it recharge and blow again and again about 10 times.

Close valves

Put pink stuff in the toilets and drains
Empty waste tanks if you have a dump station (Else do that at the last park you visit) and then add another quart to one sink per gray tank and dump what's in toilet and replace it. Job done.

Come spring with the wet method you gotta flush all that **** out of the fresh system.
With the Dry system you just re-fill with bleach water (you do this anyway) flush all lines Then drain and fill with soda water. Flush all lines, Then drain and fill with fresh water. Flush all lines) in the course of flushing all the pink went to the waste tanks and from there you know where it goes.

Way way way easier than flushing the pink out of the fresh lines.

[Gregoria_B_Dela]

Camco RV is my favoreite. Camco-RV comes half-full and requires dilution. But it offers up to -50 degrees Fahrenheit. Yes, Splash also offers -50 degrees, but the Camco-RV is biodegradable. Thus, making Camco-RV safer. Another plus for the Camco-RV is the versatility and functionalities.

[suprz]

DrewE wrote:

suprz wrote:

DrewE wrote:

A gallon down each drain? Exactly how large are the P traps in your RV?

A cup or so is sufficient in nearly all cases.

Yes, cause there's always something left in the holding tanks too, no matter how long you drain them for.

At least on my motorhome, there is precious little left in the holding tanks after letting them drain for awhile provided the RV is level or tilted towards the drain (driver's) side. The outlet is molded in even with the bottom of the tanks, and so they would drain as fully as a bathtub. The teeny bit of water left in the holding tanks has plenty of room to expand. The piping between the tanks and the drain valves are the main place there to be wary of, and they do get empty--or close enough to call it empty for any practical purpose--with a good drain.

A cup or so down each drains is sufficient. A gallon down each drain is overkill. It won't harm anything, but it's unnecessary extravagance.

But not an unnecessary "extravagance" for me. YMMV

[markchengr]

JMHO but why worry about P-trap freeze. There is adequate diameter and plenty of room for expansion in both directions. My traps have frozen many,many times with no damage.

[MFL]

JaxDad wrote:


Just out of curiosity though, all my sinks go into my grey water tank. How many extra gallons are you saying should be poured down the toilet to protect the black tank?

Since my black tank lever pulls the hardest, during regular season use, I always make sure to add a gallon of Prestone RV to the black tank at season end. While not worried about freezing residual contents of black tank, this brand does a good job of lubing the valve seal. It pulls very easy in Springs first use.

I also blow my lines before using anti-freeze, so what comes out the taps & low points while running through, is fairly pure. This is what I pour in toilet, usually about a gal. I still dump pure in the traps.

Jerry

[DrewE]

suprz wrote:

DrewE wrote:

A gallon down each drain? Exactly how large are the P traps in your RV?

A cup or so is sufficient in nearly all cases.

Yes, cause there's always something left in the holding tanks too, no matter how long you drain them for.

At least on my motorhome, there is precious little left in the holding tanks after letting them drain for awhile provided the RV is level or tilted towards the drain (driver's) side. The outlet is molded in even with the bottom of the tanks, and so they would drain as fully as a bathtub. The teeny bit of water left in the holding tanks has plenty of room to expand. The piping between the tanks and the drain valves are the main place there to be wary of, and they do get empty--or close enough to call it empty for any practical purpose--with a good drain.

A cup or so down each drains is sufficient. A gallon down each drain is overkill. It won't harm anything, but it's unnecessary extravagance.

[Dusty_R]

We had a 1988 21' Mallard and used only 1 gal. of RV antifreeze in it.

Dusty

[JaxDad]

suprz wrote:

DrewE wrote:

suprz wrote:
Use compressed air and blow the lines out, (make sure all faucets are open, and air is regulated to 30lbs psi, no need to get crazy) have hot water heater open, via anode rod or drain plug, THEN, pump RV antifreeze in like usual. Don't forget tank flushes and outside shower too. open faucets to relieve pressure once finished. And at least a gallon down each drain, and the toilet.

A gallon down each drain? Exactly how large are the P traps in your RV?

A cup or so is sufficient in nearly all cases.

Yes, cause there's always something left in the holding tanks too, no matter how long you drain them for.

So, IF I used antifreeze in my water system, it would take 2 gallons to protect the entire system but you’re saying I need to pour in another 3 gallons anyways?

Just out of curiosity though, all my sinks go into my grey water tank. How many extra gallons are you saying should be poured down the toilet to protect the black tank?

[WVcampground]

suprz wrote:

DrewE wrote:

suprz wrote:
Use compressed air and blow the lines out, (make sure all faucets are open, and air is regulated to 30lbs psi, no need to get crazy) have hot water heater open, via anode rod or drain plug, THEN, pump RV antifreeze in like usual. Don't forget tank flushes and outside shower too. open faucets to relieve pressure once finished. And at least a gallon down each drain, and the toilet.

A gallon down each drain? Exactly how large are the P traps in your RV?

A cup or so is sufficient in nearly all cases.

Yes, cause there's always something left in the holding tanks too, no matter how long you drain them for.

Better dump a gallon or two in the fresh water tank, as there'll be some water left in those also.

That little bit of residual water freezing in a large space will hurt nothing as long as it has room to expand, even if you have a gallon or two against the blade valve.

[suprz]

DrewE wrote:

suprz wrote:
Use compressed air and blow the lines out, (make sure all faucets are open, and air is regulated to 30lbs psi, no need to get crazy) have hot water heater open, via anode rod or drain plug, THEN, pump RV antifreeze in like usual. Don't forget tank flushes and outside shower too. open faucets to relieve pressure once finished. And at least a gallon down each drain, and the toilet.

A gallon down each drain? Exactly how large are the P traps in your RV?

A cup or so is sufficient in nearly all cases.

Yes, cause there's always something left in the holding tanks too, no matter how long you drain them for.

[DrewE]

suprz wrote:
Use compressed air and blow the lines out, (make sure all faucets are open, and air is regulated to 30lbs psi, no need to get crazy) have hot water heater open, via anode rod or drain plug, THEN, pump RV antifreeze in like usual. Don't forget tank flushes and outside shower too. open faucets to relieve pressure once finished. And at least a gallon down each drain, and the toilet.

A gallon down each drain? Exactly how large are the P traps in your RV?

A cup or so is sufficient in nearly all cases.

[suprz]

Use compressed air and blow the lines out, (make sure all faucets are open, and air is regulated to 30lbs psi, no need to get crazy) have hot water heater open, via anode rod or drain plug, THEN, pump RV antifreeze in like usual. Don't forget tank flushes and outside shower too. open faucets to relieve pressure once finished. And at least a gallon down each drain, and the toilet.

[dougrainer]

jseyfert3 wrote:

dougrainer wrote:
1. RV antifreeze is REQUIRED if you have a AquaHot type system. Blowing out is not enough per Aqua Hot.
2. RV antifreeze is NOT a good idea for Icemaker molds. Kind of leaves a slime and takes a good flush and cleaning out to remove it.
3. RV antifreeze is REQUIRED to be installed in P traps. You have to have something in there to prevent freezing
4. propylene based or regular RV antifreeze--- makes no difference.
5. Gravity draining is NOT a good way to drain. I like it tho. It makes me good money in the spring when the people that gravity drain have those frozen broken parts.
6. Gravity draining will NOT get rid of the water in the Black Tank Flush Check valve
7. Gravity draining will NOT get rid of the water in the Water solenoids of Icemakers(RV or Residential) and Water thru the door solenoids.
8. Gravity draining will not get rid of the water in various types of onboard water filters and their housings.
9. AS others have noted, Gravity does not get rid of water in a standard RV toilet water valve
10. Gravity draining will NOT get rid of water in the solenoid of a Macerator toilet or its Macerator Pump
11. Gravity draining will not get rid of the water in an external Macerator drain pump.
LAST, do what you want. If you do not do it correctly, you either pay for new parts or pay ME to replace the parts with Labor and cost of parts. Doug

Well, I will continue to gravity drain, as except for the toilet (which I learned the hard way), I had no issues gravity draining. Probably because except for the toilet I have none of the things you say gravity draining won't get rid of water. 😄 (and the main water filter, but you have to remove that even if doing an anti-freeze flush, so it doesn't really count)

Suppose it wouldn't be hard to do a compressed air flush though, especially as I already own a compressor so I'd just need some adapters. That would ensure everything was good, and if I remember the toilet manual correctly you can do a compressed air flush and not have to disconnect the line or run antifreeze. I'll double check that before winter gets here. I'm certainly not going to do an anti-freeze flush as we plan on camping at least once a month through the winter, with water. Not going to put anti-freeze in the water system and flush it out every month for 5 months!

You can do what you are comfortable with. BUT, for every 1 like you, the odds are there will be 99 that will have something freeze trying to gravity drain. I live in North Texas and we do NOT have the very low temps you have in Wisconsin. But, next spring I will fix about 15 to 20 RV's that the RV'er attempted to gravity drain and missed something. One thing you need to do is pull the Water Heater drain plug, not to drain for winterizing but to get rid of the Mineral deposits that accumulate. THIS is one thing winterization is good for, to do an annual drain of the water heater. ESPECIALLY if you have a Suburban with a ANODE rod. Doug