Building a Dodge, oops, Ford TV

Bobbo wrote:
Sigh. I wish Ford had offered the Max Payload Package on the truck I have ordered. I would have jumped on that with both feet.

I tried for a year to order one with the max payload package and finally gave in when I realized that Ford just didn't want to build the truck that I wanted to buy. I still wish that I had it but to be honest the truck I have is doing the job and is doing it better than I expected. If anyone from Ford is paying attention I want them to know that Ford left quite a bit of money on the table by not being willing to build what I wanted. It sound like they left some on the table in your case as well.

It is pretty devious of Ford to run so many commercials bragging about their superior payload in the half ton trucks without telling you that it is practically impossible to purchase a truck with that rating.

The reason why makers offer a heavy half and a max tow package with slightly higher payloads, is that people use these trucks as "daily drivers".

I was all ready to buy a F250 but was stopped in my tracks when I found that the 2016 F250 Screw 4WD 6.2L w/3.73 Locking differential was only getting 10 mpg city, 15/16 mpg Expressway and 12 mpg mixed. I simply can't afford to drive a truck with that bad of fuel economy as my work commuting truck.

My 2016 F150 Screw 4WD 5.0L w/3.73 locking differential is getting 18.5/19 mpg mixed and 22 mpg expressway. I don't drive city but I'm thinking around 16 mpg.

When you add in the HD payload package you lose about 1.5 mpg due to the extra weight of Ford's thicker F150 frame, the other components and the heavier LT tires. Still much better fuel economy than the F250. Plus with any of the engines, the 5.0L or 3.5L Ecboost or 2.7L Ecoboost, you'll get a much more powerful truck as the 6.2L just doesn't offer the power for such a heavy F250 truck.

The F150 heavy Duty Payload package truck doesn't have the tow capacity, or hitch rating that a F250 has, and doesn't have the variable snow plow compatibility that the F250 has, but for people who want "1" vehicle, the heavy half ton does great.

Even so, my truck without the heavy duty payload of around 2300 lbs, has 1890 lbs which is enough for any of the trailers I would ever purchase for my family. So I stopped looking for Heavy Duty Payload trucks that I was going to order. My truck pulls my trailer good even without LT tires but if I towed more, I'd definitely get those LT tires.

My truck is about $2K less than the F250 I was looking at but since there were few with my needed options, the F250 was slightly better options to account for the extra money where MSRP is concerned. The F250 also didn't have the rebates that the F150 did so it's total cost was about $4K more.

Now when you consider apples to apples, and put a Ecoboost with Max Tow package in my truck, along with the Heavy duty package and match them closely in option, their final costs after rebates and X-plans were within a few hundred dollars of each other.

But the F250 still came out much more expensive in operating costs per month especially with fuel.

The F150 that's optioned right with good payload is hard to beat. The new Chevy Silverados are also very close in towing and payload to the Ford F150s.

Sigh. I wish Ford had offered the Max Payload Package on the truck I have ordered. I would have jumped on that with both feet.

Perrysburg Dodgeboy wrote:
The issue with a HD 150/1500 is they are still running the same frame that a true 150/1500 runs. Then factor in the cost of the up graded parts, six lug axles bigger springs and you are paying the same price for a lessor truck. The only reason I bought the Ecodiesel is for the fuel mileage and ride.

We no longer have a RV and do not plan on getting one until we are two to three years from retirement. Then it will be a smaller 7500# GVW trailer. In the mean time this truck tows my 6800# boat with ease and gets great mileage doing it. Plus it rides as good or close to my dads Caddy and that was out of his mouth!

If we decide to get into a larger trailer I will sell this and go back into a 2500. But at the cost of these new 150/1500 HD trucks I don't see me ever buying a want-to-be 2500. But then I said I would never own a short bed truck either so who knows.

Don

I am not sure that you get the idea that the frames are the same. The F150 Max Payload package includes a different frame that is thicker and heavier (about 200lbs). Even with the standard frame my 2016 F150 is so much sturdier than my 1991 F250 there is no comparison. You nailed the reasons that I dropped from a 250 to a 150 and I fully agree that you don't need a 3/4 ton truck for your boat. I don't understand why getting a camper a few hundred pounds heavier would make you go from "this truck is great" to "this truck just won't do". I suggest that you try it before you trade. All levels of trucks in all brands are much sturdier than they were 15 to 20 years ago and can pull much more than traditional knowledge allows. Some of the same goes for 6 lug tires. The bolt circle and bolt size are important too and some have increased over the years. Ford used to put 7 lugs on the max payload package but determined that the new trucks can haul just as much with only 6 lugs. It was not a flippant decision.

tragusa3 wrote:
All over the forum I hear this argument that half tons cost the same as three quarter tons. I didn't see that when I shopped. There was roughly a 10-12k difference. Either I got a great deal on my half ton or you all get great deals on your three quarter.

From my shopping experience, with equivalent options and configurations a half ton may cost slightly less than a heavy duty gasser or $4-6k less than a heavy duty diesel. To me that's not a very material difference in the scheme of what you'll spend on a truck with everything factored in (up front cost, fuel, insurance, maintenance, tires, etc).

My Ram is a basic model and cost less than most crew cab 4x4 half tons despite the Cummins.

tragusa3 wrote:
All over the forum I hear this argument that half tons cost the same as three quarter tons. I didn't see that when I shopped. There was roughly a 10-12k difference. Either I got a great deal on my half ton or you all get great deals on your three quarter.

It depends on how they are optioned. My 17 dodge 2500HD had a lower msrp than my 15 Silverado 1500 did, my Silverado was a highly optioned LT, my dodge is a tradesman.

I don't mind though. I'm a simple country hick. I don't miss the 7" touch screen, heated leather seats or any of that stuff.

Honestly, my dodge is 3xs the truck that Chevy was. I'd trade the increased capacity for all the fancy stuff again in a heartbeat. But that's just me and what works for me. YMMV.

All over the forum I hear this argument that half tons cost the same as three quarter tons. I didn't see that when I shopped. There was roughly a 10-12k difference. Either I got a great deal on my half ton or you all get great deals on your three quarter.

The issue with a HD 150/1500 is they are still running the same frame that a true 150/1500 runs. Then factor in the cost of the up graded parts, six lug axles bigger springs and you are paying the same price for a lessor truck. The only reason I bought the Ecodiesel is for the fuel mileage and ride.

We no longer have a RV and do not plan on getting one until we are two to three years from retirement. Then it will be a smaller 7500# GVW trailer. In the mean time this truck tows my 6800# boat with ease and gets great mileage doing it. Plus it rides as good or close to my dads Caddy and that was out of his mouth!

If we decide to get into a larger trailer I will sell this and go back into a 2500. But at the cost of these new 150/1500 HD trucks I don't see me ever buying a want-to-be 2500. But then I said I would never own a short bed truck either so who knows.

Don

Perrysburg Dodgeboy wrote:
............
As for the paylaod comments, Ram will be playing the "HD half ton" game coming 2018. Never understood why anyone would buy a want-to-be 2500 for more or the same money? But the manufactures love selling sub par trucks to people that have too much money.

Don

Don,

There is probably a number of us wanting a heavier half, or lighter 3/4ton or 15/25 series truck. I've noticed an equal to my 2000, 90's body style GM, that an equal 2500 has gone from my base weight of 4800 lbs empty, to close to 6000 lbs for a base reg cab rwd truck. Yeah the gvwr is up from 8600 to 9900 lbs.....so I gain all of 100 lbs net of the 1300 gvwr lbs I gained too! I can see where a 4500-5000 lbs tare truck, be it badged a 15 or 25, a rated gvwr in the 7700-8400 range, carry upwards of 4000 lbs, have the ability to order some of the 3.x-4L V6 forced induction motors producing 250-300 hp, torque in the 300-400 lb ft relm, with the current 6, 8, 10 sp auto transmissions, correct gearing, you would have a truck capable of mid 20 mpg empty, due to the epa mandates, smaller powerful motors that could move a truck that weighs 8000lbs well, along with tote an 8-10K trailer with relative ease. No it will not keep up the the 6.x L TD motors....but the owner does not expect it too either. I would consider trading my current truck on something like this frankly. This is a market that has been left alone. Its the, not all hammers fit the same hand, nail job etc.....One does not use a 6lb sledge to drive brads and tacks into things! Like wise, using a 4oz tack hammer to drive a 12" spike into something is rather useless too.

Marty

Congrats on your purchase! I'm sure it'll be a great truck.

One suggestion. Please think long and hard about not getting the factory trailer tow mirrors. That was one of the major reasons I traded in my 15 Silverado on this ram. The slip on Longview trailer tow mirrors were terrible. Virtually no visibility out of the right mirror and the left was not great either. Chevy dealer wanted $1200 to put them on. Crazy!

I towed my tt for the first time with the ram on Sunday and it was wonderful. The ram has the factory trailer tow mirrors and they worked great.

Just something to think about before its too late. If your going to tow a lot, I'd give up the BLIS for the trailer tow mirrors in a heartbeat. Good luck.