De-Chipped my 7.3

[adamis]

I was having problems with my TS 6 Position performance chip for my 7.3 in that it wasn't starting about 60 percent of the time. I would have to cycle the keys before the chip would successfully work and the truck would start. Other than a bit of annoyance, the performance gains were well worth the hassle but my storage yard wasn't excited about having a truck that was difficult to start so the chip had to go until the problem is fixed.

I'm in the process of shipping the chip back to have it reprogrammed and tested. In the meantime I had to drive my truck, camper and cargo trailer back to the storage yard. It had been quite a while since I drove the truck without the chip and I was shocked at how much slower it was. At one point I was going up just a small incline after a stop light and found myself maxed out at 40mph! Throttle response was nearly non-existent either, having to mash the pedal to the metal to get rolling. My estimate is between the truck, camper and trailer I was moving ~15,000lbs so it stands to reason the 7.3 in stock form isn't going to be winning any drag races. It is also impressive at just how much performance can be unleashed with a simple chip mod I bought for $160 on Amazon. Even with all of that weight, driving it was no problem.

Needless to say, I'm hoping to get the chip back and everything working correctly as soon as possible!

[adamis]

Vinsil wrote:

Airstreamer67 wrote:
Quote about the 1996 7.3L Ford diesel: "...Not saying they don’t do work, they do and it is a fine engine. It doesn’t mod well until you get into the 99-03 model years with the learger and intercooled turbos and larger injectors, it also got a power bump to 250/525 those years."

Since your post was to set the record straight, I might note that the 7.3 Powerstrokes from '94.5 to '99 were supplied from the factory with forged rods that allowed the engines to be souped-up to the 600-650 RWHP range without other bottom-end work. Of course, the top end would need mods as you noted: chips, larger injectors, intercoolers, turbos, and other "stuff" the big-power crowd likes to put.

In contrast, it was the later 7.3s that could not be boosted that high without big bottom end work in addition to the requisite top-end work due to the powdered metal rods the factory chose to equip them with. Those poor guys can only get to around 500 RWHP without fear of a rod letting loose. I feel for them. 🙂

True. The PMI rods were a source of weakness. Let me clarify..they don’t mod well in terms of easy or cheap power, like modern high pressure injection can get with simple cheap and effective methods of modding. But having done this with all my diesels, adding power is expensive. You can’t have a true 7.3 600 rwhp that tows 30k up hills either without it being kept cool we the egt’s getting nuts. A short burst, sure. Hold it to the floor up hills...nope.

That's one of the frustrating experiences in my opinion of the 7.3. With the chip and mods I have, I've never had an issue with having enough power, it's always been keeping the EGTs in check. Many a long climb under load I'm sitting at half throttle watching the EGT gauge like a hawk. I'm sure there are plenty of options available to keep those EGTs in check but my money and time are focused elsewhere right now.

[Vinsil]

Airstreamer67 wrote:
Quote about the 1996 7.3L Ford diesel: "...Not saying they don’t do work, they do and it is a fine engine. It doesn’t mod well until you get into the 99-03 model years with the learger and intercooled turbos and larger injectors, it also got a power bump to 250/525 those years."

Since your post was to set the record straight, I might note that the 7.3 Powerstrokes from '94.5 to '99 were supplied from the factory with forged rods that allowed the engines to be souped-up to the 600-650 RWHP range without other bottom-end work. Of course, the top end would need mods as you noted: chips, larger injectors, intercoolers, turbos, and other "stuff" the big-power crowd likes to put.

In contrast, it was the later 7.3s that could not be boosted that high without big bottom end work in addition to the requisite top-end work due to the powdered metal rods the factory chose to equip them with. Those poor guys can only get to around 500 RWHP without fear of a rod letting loose. I feel for them. 🙂

True. The PMI rods were a source of weakness. Let me clarify..they don’t mod well in terms of easy or cheap power, like modern high pressure injection can get with simple cheap and effective methods of modding. But having done this with all my diesels, adding power is expensive. You can’t have a true 7.3 600 rwhp that tows 30k up hills either without it being kept cool we the egt’s getting nuts. A short burst, sure. Hold it to the floor up hills...nope.

[Airstreamer67]

Quote about the 1996 7.3L Ford diesel: "...Not saying they don’t do work, they do and it is a fine engine. It doesn’t mod well until you get into the 99-03 model years with the learger and intercooled turbos and larger injectors, it also got a power bump to 250/525 those years."

Since your post was to set the record straight, I might note that the 7.3 Powerstrokes from '94.5 to '99 were supplied from the factory with forged rods that allowed the engines to be souped-up to the 600-650 RWHP range without other bottom-end work. Of course, the top end would need mods as you noted: chips, larger injectors, intercoolers, turbos, and other "stuff" the big-power crowd likes to put.

In contrast, it was the later 7.3s that could not be boosted that high without big bottom end work in addition to the requisite top-end work due to the powdered metal rods the factory chose to equip them with. Those poor guys can only get to around 500 RWHP without fear of a rod letting loose. I feel for them. 🙂

[burningman]

The reason I own an older model Dodge is the easy to work on, reliable straight-six Cummins engine.
For those of you who can swing buying a new diesel one ton every couple years, new ones are great. I don’t want to lose that much money on a pickup truck.
I’m not content with the original 215 HP and 420 ft/lbs torque but it’s SO easy to make twice that.
You don’t have to leave it the way the factory did it.

[Kayteg1]

Bay Area never will be cheap on fuel, even next to refineries.
Living there I was finding cheap fuel at Bonfire in Concord, but DW did not like me to stop there becouse of neighborhood.
That is why driving the truck I was taking gas cans and filled them up at truck stops.
Chase in Coalinga charges today $3.25 for B20, than you have Joe's close to 505/5 intersection.
Lot of cheaper diesel along I-80 before you reach Sacramento.
Vegas to my knowledge uses California fuel, yet it is significantly cheaper here.

[adamis]

Kayteg1 wrote:

SidecarFlip wrote:


Guess that's why our 'vintage' trucks are appreciating in value. Informed people know that the 'new breed' of trucks will be money pits down the road.

It is not just trucks, looks like diesel vehicles got appreciated this year.
My 2008 diesel Mercedes seems to be worth double what I paid for it 2 years ago (I got good deal).
Part of that might be that diesel fuel was cheap this year, at least before hurricanes messed it up. I hold the receipt for $1.99/g fill up this July.
Other thing is that 500 000 of diesel VW were removed from US market and once diesel owner, will not go easy to gasoline engine.
It is what it is and I don't complain 😉

Wish I could say the same about the cost of diesel fuel in "Utopian" California but our legislative critters decided a 36 cents a gallon tax for diesel fuel was in our best interests... Overnight we went from paying $3.09 in the Bay Area to $3.45. This increase is in addition to the taxes already paid so now the total amount of taxes on a gallon of fuel is ~76 cents. The sad irony about "big oil" is that the entity that makes the most "obscene profits" is the great state of California...

My 2001 Jetta TDI with 321k miles is still cheaper to drive than most vehicles today (getting close to 50mpg) but the 7.3 with camper and trailer in tow at 11mpg (downhill with a tailwind) is another story. I can't wait to start taking longer trips outside of the state and seeing some new country!

[Vinsil]

Here is a link to 7.3 specs. Having owned one and modding it, I see misinformation sometimes and some people are just misinformed.

The OBS body style, 94-97 made 215 horsepower and 425 ft of torque.

http://www.powerstrokehub.com/7.3-power-stroke.html

Not saying they don’t do work, they do and it is a fine engine. It doesn’t mod well until you get into the 99-03 model years with the learger and intercooled turbos and larger injectors, it also got a power bump to 250/525 those years.

[Kayteg1]

SidecarFlip wrote:


Guess that's why our 'vintage' trucks are appreciating in value. Informed people know that the 'new breed' of trucks will be money pits down the road.

It is not just trucks, looks like diesel vehicles got appreciated this year.
My 2008 diesel Mercedes seems to be worth double what I paid for it 2 years ago (I got good deal).
Part of that might be that diesel fuel was cheap this year, at least before hurricanes messed it up. I hold the receipt for $1.99/g fill up this July.
Other thing is that 500 000 of diesel VW were removed from US market and once diesel owner, will not go easy to gasoline engine.
It is what it is and I don't complain 😉

[SidecarFlip]

Kayteg1 wrote:

adamis wrote:
there is a movement called the "Right to Repair" movement that is attempting to enact legislation that will require manufacturers to allow their products to be serviced by owners.

I registered and send the letters.
Hopefully it will get us somewhere as just yesterday I was forced to approve $300 for sensor coding.
Thanks for posting. I will spread the link.

Sucks to be you.....:p

[SidecarFlip]

Airstreamer67 wrote:
QUOTE: "1996 diesel? Was it like 170 HP? That must be hog with camper?"

You'll need to define "hog" for me to answer that part.

If you're referring to acceleration, I don't know what my '96 7.3L's 0-60 mph performance is. I do know that I accelerate and climb mountains at partial throttle even though the F250 is maxed out GVWR- and GVCWR-wise rigged for camping, so I've never felt under-powered. This is probably because I realize I'm driving a house on wheels, and I don't expect it to perform like the Z-28 I used to own that could do 0-60 in less than five seconds and reach 150 mph or more. I expect my RV to perform closer to the 18-wheeler that manages to haul the freight for a million miles but can't accelerate with the small vehicles.

As far as my horsepower, it's rated by the factory at 215, which was the leader-of-the-pack in 1996. Measured at the wheels, it very well could be near 170. And today, it very well may be considered a "hog" acceleration-wise compared with the new 400 hp diesels being put out on the market. But it's not a hog when considering what it "eats": an average of about 15 mpg on the long runs I make. Without the RV, I achieve 23 mpg at 55 mph and 21 mpg at 70, as calculated by miles driven and fuel pumped.

Besides the normal consumables, the only mechanical pieces I've had to change on my rig so far are the radiator and water pump. So far, my ole F250 has been a stellar investment when considering the overall financial outlay of purchase and maintenance. I can't think of a rig that would have given me more for the buck. So I can't consider it a hog in that regard either.

Well, I've beat that hog to death, so I'll stop now.

No problem with me in as much as I too have a vintage Ford Diesel and I like mine just fine.

People dwell on horsepower but in reality with a diesel it's the torque that moves you down the road, not the horsepower. I don't care about horsepower at all. Means nothing to me. Torque and Torque rise is what is important and your old 7.3 and mine produce a lot of torque, around 600 pounds feet. Thats what moves you.

Also why I have no desire to get a new truck. One, I don't want the complexities of the emissions components and two, I want to be able to perform the necessary maintenance and replacement of parts myself and not have to rely on a dealer with sophisticated computer diagnostics to do that.

My '97 7.3 is stone simple and for me. it's perfect because I'm a driveway mechanic.

In the spring I have to pull the valve covers and install new glo plugs and injector harnesses, no big deal. I replaced the water pump a few years back as well. Again, no big deal.

I don't get quite the mileage you get but mine has been modified a bit. It has an aftermarket turbo and straight exhaust and low restriction intake and it might not be a rocket ship compared to the new ones but it's paid for and if it does break down, it can be repaired without breaking my wallet at the same time.

Looking down the road, when the new generation of emissions compliant, electronics laden diesel pickups get some age and mileage on them, I'm thinking that it will be a nightmare for the owners, especially out of warranty when parts start failing and they are at the mercy of a dealer that charges 130 bucks an hour shop time as well as the stupid cost of the replacement parts.

Guess that's why our 'vintage' trucks are appreciating in value. Informed people know that the 'new breed' of trucks will be money pits down the road.

My 97 'sleeps' all winter with my RV. Never has seen snow or corrosion making salt and I plan on running it another decade at least and the selling it for what I paid for it...and I probably will get that price. Here in Michigan, 5 more years an I can plate it as a 'Historical Vehicle'.

[Kayteg1]

adamis wrote:
there is a movement called the "Right to Repair" movement that is attempting to enact legislation that will require manufacturers to allow their products to be serviced by owners.

I registered and send the letters.
Hopefully it will get us somewhere as just yesterday I was forced to approve $300 for sensor coding.
Thanks for posting. I will spread the link.

[Airstreamer67]

QUOTE: "1996 diesel? Was it like 170 HP? That must be hog with camper?"

You'll need to define "hog" for me to answer that part.

If you're referring to acceleration, I don't know what my '96 7.3L's 0-60 mph performance is. I do know that I accelerate and climb mountains at partial throttle even though the F250 is maxed out GVWR- and GVCWR-wise rigged for camping, so I've never felt under-powered. This is probably because I realize I'm driving a house on wheels, and I don't expect it to perform like the Z-28 I used to own that could do 0-60 in less than five seconds and reach 150 mph or more. I expect my RV to perform closer to the 18-wheeler that manages to haul the freight for a million miles but can't accelerate with the small vehicles.

As far as my horsepower, it's rated by the factory at 215, which was the leader-of-the-pack in 1996. Measured at the wheels, it very well could be near 170. And today, it very well may be considered a "hog" acceleration-wise compared with the new 400 hp diesels being put out on the market. But it's not a hog when considering what it "eats": an average of about 15 mpg on the long runs I make. Without the RV, I achieve 23 mpg at 55 mph and 21 mpg at 70, as calculated by miles driven and fuel pumped.

Besides the normal consumables, the only mechanical pieces I've had to change on my rig so far are the radiator and water pump. So far, my ole F250 has been a stellar investment when considering the overall financial outlay of purchase and maintenance. I can't think of a rig that would have given me more for the buck. So I can't consider it a hog in that regard either.

Well, I've beat that hog to death, so I'll stop now.

[Vinsil]

Or...keyteg1...get forscan and do your own work. After the warranty is up, delete the emissions and enjoy. The new trucks are complicated and yes, they won’t run on used veggie oil and be fixed by the guy down the street with a tv repairman for a father (if you get that reference that’s awesome). But have no fear, they can be fixed and diagnosed pretty easy just gotta change with the times! For me, I took my boat fishing today. It was nice cruising to the lake talking to my wife and not hear the old diesel rattling away. I? used to love that sound and this is the first truck that won’t be straight piped, modded and run like a sports car. I’m over it, love the tech and have fully embraced it!

[adamis]

Kayteg1 wrote:
I have mixed feeling about new technology.
When I like new engines for way better performance (my 4-banger 2.1 l diesel has the same power what famous Cheby 454 (7.4l)from 1980's), manufacturers are playing hard ball with DIY owners.
I had Ox sensor failed. Not only local dealer wants $580+ tax for sensor ($320 on the net) but software require new sensor coding/adaptation and that is possible only with brand scanners and internet subscription.
So even I DIY sensor replacement I have to take the car to dealer and pay them min $150 for few minutes on keyboard.
To top it the car software gave me 10 start-ups to fix the issue or the car becomes a brick.
Good thing the count activates at speed and I could roll the car around the garage without loosing the number.
Bottom line, aren't we talking conspiracy theory?

It is sad to say but what you have described is what happens when the bean counting pinheads with MBA degrees take over the corporate world. It's the razor and blade business model just scaled up. It is sad that as a society, we have bought into the lie that to be successful, one must go to college. The trades unfortunately are taking a beating and with that the skills, tribal knowledge, "brotherhood" of fellow craftsmen and independence such skills make.

Back in day's of old when men where men and settled disputes with swords, who was the safest person on the battlefield? I'd argue the blacksmith... It's easy to find someone willing to stick the pointy thing in your enemy, those guys are a dime a dozen but to find someone who knows how to make the pointy thing? It takes years to make a blacksmith...

Yes, it's a bit of a stretch on the analogy but more to the point, there is a movement called the "Right to Repair" movement that is attempting to enact legislation that will require manufacturers to allow their products to be serviced by owners. This in part is a result of all companies good and wholesome in America, John Deere that started bricking tractors when Farmers tried to field repair them (like Farmers for generations have done for decades). It's one thing to endure highway robbery just to purchase the part that a bean counter determined should fail just months outside it's warranty period but it's another to have spend hundreds of dollars to pay the John Deere "repair guy" to come out and hook up his computer to the tractor and push a couple of buttons so the part now works with the tractor.

When the zombie apocalypse begins, I nominate MBAs to be second in line after lawyer's to be pushed out of camp to fend for themselves. Payback for all their greed that society was forced to pay for...

Yes, said with a bit of dry irony and it's only 2pm and I haven't had a drink yet... Now get off my lawn!!!