First time tower - multiple questions

[Raife]

Good afternoon. I have read many posts regarding towing and am looking for some additional help. Sorry for the dissertation…

First – context:
Vehicle and weights:
- 2015 Durango, Citadel, V8 Hemi, factory installed tow package, technology group (not sure this matters)
- Curb Weight – 5770 pounds (measured on certified scales, full tank, minus my weight)
- Family weight – 610 pounds (me, wife, 3 kids, and dog)
“Remaining“ cargo weight – GVWR of 7,100 minus 5770 curb weight minus 610 family equals 720 pounds (which I imagine most will be taken up by tongue weight)

Trips – I am planning for 2 trips:
- Trial trip in prep for 2nd trip: long weekend locally (250 miles away here in central Texas) in the next couple of weeks
- Long trip over 2.5 weeks: drive from home to Albuquerque and pick up trailer there. Then poke through midwest/west attractions (Petrified Forest, Grand Canyon, onto California for quick visit with in-laws, then back through Zion, Bryce, Four Corners, drop off trailer in Albuquerque, and drive home)

So in looking through Outdoorsey and corresponding with several owners (i.e. asking for the trailers Gross Vehicle Weight Rating and Tongue Weight) I am norming around low-20 footers to rent.

However, I still have several questions:
1) Electronic brake controller: I understand I should use an electronic brake controller – the Tekonsha P3 showed up today and I plan on installing it this coming weekend (I have installed my hardwired dash/rear cam and I have watched the videos on installing the brake controller to the plug on the D, so I am comfortable doing it myself).
- Given I will be towing infrequently where should I mount it? I was thinking instead of using the screws or bracket, I might use some industrial Velcro and stick it in front of my right knee or on top of the dash to the left of the instrument hood. Has anyone done this? How did it work out? I would be working against central Texas summer heat in the car.

2) Tow weight: I have not gotten a good sense of how much I should/could actually tow. I have had some people say, 7,200 pounds is the tow limit so you can go to 7,200 pounds. I also read about an 80% guideline, etc.
- If I take the Gross Combined Weight Rating (GCWR) of 13,100 pounds and subtract out the curb weight of the Durango (5770lbs), the family weight (610lbs), and the tongue weight (max 720lbs for calculation sake), I end up at 6,000 remaining pounds. To me (if I understand everything correctly) that would be the max Gross Trailer Weight (GTW) I can pull. I would assume it is better to stay under this. This assumes all our cargo (clothes, food, camp chairs, bikes, etc.) goes in the trailer since once I factor in the tongue weight, I don’t have any remaining cargo weight in the Durango.

3) Weight distributing hitch: I read several articles and several of the owners referenced a weight distributing hitch (the manual referenced this as mandatory for anything over 5,000 pounds). One owner alluded to the WDH as a way to go above the 720 pound tongue weight limit. That doesn’t seem right to me. I would assume the WDH provides greater safety and control, not a means to exceed the rated tongue weight.

4) Sway bars: I understand these can be integrated into the WDH, but do I need specific ones based on the trailer weight?

5) Tow mirrors: I am assuming the stock side mirrors are not going to be “out” far enough. I have read several posts that reference most add-on mirrors are junk (my words and maybe some of the poster’s words as well). What is a good option?

6) Trailer weight: I have asked all the owners of trailers I am considering the GVWR for their trailer. Most initially give a rough number or the dry weight. I then generally clarify that I want the actual GVWR and what is printed on the sticker. Is this the right number to ask for? I figure this would be the max the trailer would ever weigh.

Any help is greatly appreciated. I think I covered my questions for now.

Thank you in advance!

[Raife]

falconbrother wrote:
What I would do (what I did). I'm towing with a Chevrolet Suburban. I bought it with a travel trailer in mind. Then, I purchased my WD hitch. Lastly we went to the dealership and picked out a trailer that was well under the weight rating. Our limit is 7200. The dry weight of the trailer is 5800. Once we bought it the dealership set up the hitch for free (yea, right).

Is 7,200 the towing spec according to the manufacturer or the tow limit you calculated.

My Durango has a 7,200 limit according to the manufacturer, but after I factored in the tow vehicle weight, the family weight, and the tongue weight - the trailer GVW becomes 6,000, so dry I am looking at much less than that.

[TomG2]

BackOfThePack wrote:

The tests are simple. Why haven’t you performed them?
“Dumb” means incapable of speaking. Shoe fit?

What test are you talking about? That travel trailers become "airborne" when traveling down the highway? I do that test every day and the results are negative, like so many of the other comments.

People that resort to name calling when making an argument should look in the mirror. It is the most common and ineffective way of making a point. Watch out for those flying travel trailers!

[BackOfThePack]

Grit dog wrote:
Some good albeit some debatable info from slowmover.
But don’t overthink it. Keep it to around a 5klb x24’ long trailer and you’re good.
Pump your rear tires up to max, let the self leveling suspension do it’s thing. I’d test that first to see what it’s good for.
Adjust the trailer brakes and wdh once you get the trailer on and go.
One tricky thing is you can’t just adjust wdh by height as the self leveling won’t let the rest squat.

Numbers are the baseline.
Why is that difficult?

The entire decision tree is predicated on acquired REAL numbers from a certified scale. Check them across the continent or three years from now.
Problems arise, components wear, etc.
The scale is first-step. A control.

The formulas for prediction (engineering) appear intimidating.
They aren’t, yet it’s easier to just make sentences of them.

The WD Hitch WILL spread TW force across three-points. How well it does so gets down to the last bit of finesse. (Trailer dead-level; that’s where most need help as unequal axle loading is a HUGE trailer-braking and sway-contribution problem).

There is range of what works. It’s not much of a spread.
But it must be discovered.

The narrowed range is now THE range. Other numbers fall away.

Set the baseline. Formula.
Drive, and adjust.

For WDH & Tires.
Work together.

All else hangs on this.

(And NEVER over-inflate tires past load requirements, ESPECIALLY on the Drive Axle (rear axle; scale nomenclature). Those tires losing contact with the roadway IS the definition of what happens in a loss-of-control accident.)

The tow vehicle rear axle TIRE CONTACT PATCH is what’s at stake for resisting trailer side-sway. Stiff springs (more than what’s required) and over-inflated rear tires (past load required) . . . is the dangerous advice given to the ex-brother-in-law you truly hate.

Resisting side-sway WORKS when ALL tires are involved. (WDH “equalization”).

Auto-adjust rear suspensions need to be disabled (fuse, if no switch) before setting WD. See manufacturer instructions.

The weigh scale is ALSO a control for this.


.

[BackOfThePack]

TomG2 wrote:
You can always tell a fake expert when they resort to calling other people "Stupid" or "Dumb". Some might question how many travel trailers actually take flight when going down the freeway. "gets airborne at the stern due to wind forces building (unable to escape)." I have seen a lot of trailers on the highway, but none became airborne from the lift involved at ordinary speeds.

When it comes to undocumented claims about mileage etc. I have one too. Our 1951 Nash Statesman got 34 mpg since it had an overdrive transmission.

The tests are simple. Why haven’t you performed them?
“Dumb” means incapable of speaking. Shoe fit?

Nature’s winds are one form of the problem. Traffic passing too closely is the other.
Install a roll cage and whatever else you think appropriate and I’ll overtake you in a tractor-trailer rig to pass far too closely and watch you roll over in my mirrors.

Or have another rig follow me too closely (illegally) on a two-lane in the opposing direction. High-speed instantaneous wind direction reversals. An even uglier wreck.

That you haven’t seen it mightn’t mean much. I’ve seen it several dozen times. YouTube videos are available. RV or tractor-trailer.

The greatest vulnerability to winds is downslope on a mountain. What spacing do you maintain and at what speed? As you’ll need to accelerate using MAXIMUM engine throttle & MAXIMUM trailer brake together to have any hope of recovery.

Stick with being thought dumb versus undeniable testimony.
Ordinary ignorance has a cure. Willful ignorance doesn’t.

At 45-mph on level ground does your combined rig come to a complete stop faster than the tow vehicle, solo, (otherwise both loaded for camping with pax aboard?)

Why not?

The engineering prediction is for the combined rig.

Get the numbers. Test. Adjust.

.

[Grit_dog]

On second read, slowmovers post is, um, quite out to lunch on many points. Not unlike most of his posts. But on the upside, according to him, your Durango is “better” than a real truck for towing. Lol.
You head from one person who said the auto level payload sucks. Which I mentioned checking 4 pages ago, but rather you’re posting for sale adds to see if we like the RV. And every page the RV grows another 2’ ! Lol
Prioritize what you need to do. Thought you had a trip in like a week now? You’re fuqed for that one.

[Grit_dog]

lane hog wrote:

Raife wrote:
Not sure what constitutes a short wheelbase but the Durango is 119.8"

120" is considered by a lot of us as short for towing. There's a calculation which says 20' is the limit for a 120" wheelbase.

I towed a 26' ball to bumper trailer with a Durango for a while. It worked, but we weren't going any bigger than that without a new truck.

It’s not a formula or calculation.....

[Mickeyfan0805]

lane hog wrote:

There's a calculation which says 20' is the limit for a 120" wheelbase.

This is the second thread where this conversation is emerging right now. This formula is cited all the time, but I've never seen any manufacturer of any trailer or vehicle publish any wheelbase ratios.

Wheelbase most certainly makes a difference, but I would not use a random ratio that has become popular on the internet as a basis for my purchasing decisions.

[lane_hog]

Raife wrote:
Not sure what constitutes a short wheelbase but the Durango is 119.8"

120" is considered by a lot of us as short for towing. There's a calculation which says 20' is the limit for a 120" wheelbase.

I towed a 26' ball to bumper trailer with a Durango for a while. It worked, but we weren't going any bigger than that without a new truck.

[teamru]

Not apples to apples, but I towed a 23' enclosed cargo trailer a few thousand miles with a recently traded in '17 R/T with factory tow package. The trailer is ~2000lbs empty and I loaded it up with 3000+lbs of stuff many times. These were trips with the wife and 3 kids in the car, all cargo except some essentials in the trailer.

Power wise the Durango will pull a trailer in the 20-25ft range and ~5000ish pound ballpark no problem. Braking was confident with a P3 controller and brakes on both trailer axles. The biggest issue is really the suspension, the rear squats without much tongue weight at all. The load leveling shocks don't seem to do much after a few hundred pounds. I did not run a weight distribution hitch with the cargo trailer and the experience suffered because of it. One is definitely needed to get weight back on the steer axle. As our family grew and we started going up and up in the amount of **** to haul around, I definitely felt I was pushing the limits.

We were also originally planning a similar sized camper purchase, but ended up with a 37' bunkhouse so the Durango is gone and was replaced with a 1 ton truck. Based on my experience I do not agree with the folks on the Durango forums saying a 30'+/6500lbs+ camper is doable. However, if you keep the size of the camper reasonable (which seems you are) and run a properly set WD w/ sway control hitch I think you'll be fine and will have a fun experience with the family. There is a lot of good advice in this thread. Don't expect to be going 65mph+ and max the tire pressure out as others have suggested.

[TomG2]

Raife wrote:


Not sure what constitutes a short wheelbase but the Durango is 119.8"

Thank you again.

A Ford Ranger has a wheelbase of 126.8" if you want a comparison.

[Grit_dog]

4 pages ago, you we’re going g to rent one for a bit....
What You purchase and when depends on your budget and gullibility.
If you’re going budget minded then keep your eye out for a suitable wdh and trailer and buy them in whichever order they appear , to get the best deal.
If you are a walk into the RV dealer and leave with everything including a complimentary bag of ice, then it doesn’t matter if you get wdh first.

Ideally, find someone you know who knows how to tow and will help you, as it will steepen the learning curve.

[Raife]

Thank you everyone. More good insights. If I end up purchasing, I like the idea of getting the WDH (with sway) before the trailer so someone can help me set it up.

Not sure what constitutes a short wheelbase but the Durango is 119.8"

Thank you again.

[falconbrother]

What I would do (what I did). I'm towing with a Chevrolet Suburban. I bought it with a travel trailer in mind. Then, I purchased my WD hitch. Lastly we went to the dealership and picked out a trailer that was well under the weight rating. Our limit is 7200. The dry weight of the trailer is 5800. Once we bought it the dealership set up the hitch for free (yea, right).

Lessons: Let a pro set up your hitch for you. I bought the anti sway but, in 4 years of regular towing haven't had any issues that required it. Years ago, before the motorhome, we towed and did have occasional sway issues. Now, none.. Getting the hitch right will solve a lot of problems. Also, I added SumoSupersprings to the burb so it rides flat. I see people towing with their noses pointing up. Boost up that rear suspension. The Sumos are a cheap and easy fix.

When you load up the trailer effort to even out the weight distribution but, really avoid going too heavy on the backside of the trailer. Having a trailer loaded heavy on the back end can really give you some sway grief.

Get use to doing walk arounds. Better safe than sorry. Even if you think you know that you got it all right, walk around before you drive, every time. Here's a biggie.. If you're in the process of hooking up the trailer and you get sidetracked for any reason, mentally start the process over when you get back to it so you don't miss a step. I learned this from pulling a toad behind a motorhome. Big things can go real bad. Double checking as a habit is quick, cheap and easy. I had a buddy whose son hooked his toad up to the motorhome and off he went. When he got to his destination the toad was gone, MIA. He had no idea where he lost it. It was later found by the sheriff down in some woods off of the interstate. Lots of issues there but, the lesson is never trust anyone. Verify for yourself.

The Durango is a short wheel base. Consider in your long range plan getting something with a longer wheel base. Keep your speed down. I see people blowing me off the road towing travel trailers well over the speed limit. My personal limit is 65. I'll get there, I won't have met any troopers, I won't go over the speed limits of my tires, and my bowels will be normal. Just relax. If you can't relax when RVing then when can you?

Have fun with the process. It's exciting to buy a new RV. Don't over expect, as Andy Griffith would say. These things just are what they are. We love RVing. It's all about the lifestyle, not nearly as much about the hardware. The RV gives us a level of freedom we wouldn't otherwise have. In that respect it's worth every penny.

[rbpru]

Your set up sounds similar to mine. I have a Blue Ox WD hitch which includes the anti-sway in the design.

We have towed over 40,000 miles in the last 5 years all over the country with very few towing issues.

I do believe that heavy towing at or near the max truck limits does take a toll on tires, shocks, suspension and brakes; as does heavy farm or construction use.

Doing the number ahead of time is smart idea.