New power outlet question

[plasticmaster]

I'd like to install a new power outlet to use primarily for my toaster oven. The only circuit that I can tie in to is the circuit that the water heater plugs in to. Are other outlets typically tied into this circuit and would it be safe for me to tie into this circuit for another outlet? Would I be constantly tripping the breaker if toaster oven and water heater on electric were both on at same time?

[myredracer]

If using the 30 and 20 amp receptacles in a 30 amp pedestal, just be aware that you run the risk of increasing voltage drop, especially in older CGs. Code does not provide for a simultaneous demand on both the 20 and 30 amp recepts. and you could be drawing up to 50 amps (at 120V) on 30 amp rated wire. It would be a good idea to monitor the voltage if doing that, but that's a good idea in general anyway.

[BarneyS]

deltabravo wrote:

BarneyS wrote:
we needed a way to run our electric heater without going through the trailers electrical system.

Why did you need a way o run the heater separate from the RV service panel?

We usually run our water heater on electric. My wife also likes to use an electric fry pan for much of her cooking rather than the hot gas stove. In addition, we usually have the coffee pot going and use the microwave regularly. When it is warm outside, we run the air conditioner all the time.

All of these things run through the trailers 30amp system so in the winter, we run the heater off the extension cord. In the summer we will usually run the elec fry pan off it. We have never blown the trailers breaker since we started doing this. Still have to be carefull with the air conditioner, microwave, coffee pot, water heater combination though. Can only do three of the four at the same time or often the trailers breaker will trip.
Barney

[gmw_photos]

enblethen wrote:
You could use one of these if you want to have GFCI protection.
adapter

Yes sir, I was going to post that and you beat me to it.

[gmw_photos]

deltabravo wrote:

BarneyS wrote:
we needed a way to run our electric heater without going through the trailers electrical system.

Why did you need a way o run the heater separate from the RV service panel?

I'm not Barney ( ! ) but the reason I ran a sep circuit for my heater was twofold.

1. I like my own work and outlets better than what cruiser RV provided in the trailer from new.

2. I wanted to be able to have access to all of the 30A from the trailer system for "everything else".
By having it's own circuit, the heater can pull right from the CG pedestal and the trailer power panel never even knows it's there.

[deltabravo]

BarneyS wrote:
we needed a way to run our electric heater without going through the trailers electrical system.

Why did you need a way o run the heater separate from the RV service panel?

[deltabravo]

plasticmaster wrote:
Would I be constantly tripping the breaker if toaster oven and water heater on electric were both on at same time?

Very likely

[drsteve]

LVJJJ wrote:
always thought GFCI outlets were overkill, the breaker in the box will trip if there is a short. Somebody is making lots of money off of that one. (Now I'm going to get it from the code talkers, but most of the houses I've lived in never had GFCI, I'm still here bugging people)

GFCIs are different than breakers in that they trip when they sense current flowing to ground along an unintended path, such as through a human. They are not there to protect against a short, which is what a breaker does.

If an appliance is working properly, all electricity that the appliance uses will flow from hot to neutral. A GFCI monitors the amount of current flowing from hot to neutral. If there is any imbalance, it trips the circuit. It is able to sense a mismatch as small as 4 or 5 milliamps, and it can react as quickly as one-thirtieth of a second.

"I'm still alive so safety measures are unnecessary" is not a strong argument.

[LVJJJ]

always thought GFCI outlets were overkill, the breaker in the box will trip if there is a short. Somebody is making lots of money off of that one. (Now I'm going to get it from the code talkers, but most of the houses I've lived in never had GFCI, I'm still here bugging people)

[enblethen]

You could use one of these if you want to have GFCI protection.
adapter

[enblethen]

Microwave had a dedicated appliance circuit and does not need to have GFCI protection. Once the outlet is changed to duplex and plug strip installed it should.
I am just saying be careful, not to change it out.
If you want to change it out and gain receptacle, use a box extension have a GFCI receptacle and a microwave circuit not on GFCI.

[gmw_photos]

drsteve wrote:

enblethen wrote:
Remember that the plug strip is not GFCI protected.

I would expect (hope) the microwave outlet is downstream from a GFCI, as it's in the kitchen area. If it's not, I would replace it with a GFCI.

Actually the M/Wave is not on the GFCI circuit. That circuit powers the outlet at the galley, the bathroom, the outdoor outlet and one other outlet inside at the back of the trailer.

The M/Wave has it's own 15A breaker. You're likely quite right, since I can stand in one spot there and be touching the M/Wave with one hand and the sink/faucet with the other, it should be on a GFI.

Code ? We don't need no stinkin' code.....we're Indiana RV makers....

[westend]

gmw photos wrote:
That stuff is some scary-azz business.

You really haven't had much fun until you power the welder that you recently wired and it dances across the floor. :B

I'd urge anyone that decides to alter their 120V electrical system in an RV to make sure they either know exactly what they are doing or to seek some help/guidance.

FWIW, a few years back I had a customer that thought he could figure out electrical problems with the help of his 90 yr old step Dad. These two clowns had powered an exterior light post through the ground lead. Fortunately there was enough breakage in the wire run so that they didn't short much to ground.

[drsteve]

enblethen wrote:
Remember that the plug strip is not GFCI protected.

I would expect (hope) the microwave outlet is downstream from a GFCI, as it's in the kitchen area. If it's not, I would replace it with a GFCI.

[gmw_photos]

enblethen wrote:
Remember that the plug strip is not GFCI protected.

good point. Not to code !