WoodIsGood
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Re: Had the Liquid Spring Suspension Installed - WOW!
RedRollingRoadblock wrote: How was dealing with them when you went back? It happened that they had an empty bay, so they got to work on it right away. They were apologetic, but provided no explanation as to how or why the rig left their shop with so many problems.834Views0likes0CommentsRe: Had the Liquid Spring Suspension Installed - WOW!
Oregon Auto Spring (OAS) is a LS dealer/installer. They do a ton of E450 LS conversions for an ambulance builder, and had just finished a front+rear install on an F53 coach before doing mine. No idea why my install was so shoddy. For all I know it could have been a mechanic who was pissed at the boss and was out to cause problems? Some of the problems with the install by OAS in the order discovered by me: - Rear anti-sway bar end link nut loose with more than an inch of threads showing. - ABS sensor wiring (and several other wires) left dangling with factory provided hold-downs not attached. - Differential breather tube left dangling. - Stand-offs for rear brake lines left dangling (unsupported rigid brake lines are prone to work hardening and eventual failure) - Brake reservoir extremely low on fluid (reservoir was full when delivered to OAS - I had recently done a fluid flush). - After seeing all the other untightened/unsecured items I decided to do a spot check of bolt torque before heading out of town. I started with the bolts for the heavy brackets that attach the rear axle trailing arms to the frame. Of the 6 bolts I checked, 1 was only finger tight, 4 were way below torque spec, and 1 was at (or beyond?) spec. At this point I drove back to OAS and had them go end-to-end with a torque wrench and paint pen to make witness marks as they checked every bolt. - When I removed the wheel covers to retorque the lug nuts after the first couple hours of driving I discovered a lug nut that was at the end of its stud. LS hadn't designed the brackets necessary to fit all the tanks in the more limited frame rail length on a shorter chassis like mine; LS gets all the blame for the delays, frustrations, and extra work for OAS caused by this. But that doesn't excuse OAS for any of the problems listed above. Fortunately I am mechanically inclined and inspected things before anything catastrophic had a chance to happen. I am disappointed that LS didn't have all their ducks in a row and did some of their R&D on my and OAS's time. But, the system performs so well that I'm glad I had it installed and I'll never own another F53 based coach without it.833Views0likes0CommentsHad the Liquid Spring Suspension Installed - WOW!
The short version: A little over a year ago I had the front and rear Liquid Spring (LS) suspension installed on my 30’, 2012, Newmar Baystar to address the harsh ride characteristics of the Ford F53 chassis. I am THRILLED with the ride and handling improvements! One clearly quantifiable before-and-after difference: I use a magnetic mount to hold my phone for navigation; my phone used to regularly get shaken off the magnetic mount from rough roads, but in the 9,000 miles I've driven since the LS upgrade my phone hasn't moved at all! The coach is MUCH quieter now with rattles and squeaks significantly reduced. The installation was done by Oregon Auto Springs and was extremely poorly executed. As delivered the coach was, frankly, a wreck waiting to happen. All of the deficiencies were eventually addressed and my install is now in very good order; LS was very helpful in getting this resolved. The installation took more than a month, in large part because LS hadn’t developed all the necessary mounting brackets that worked with a shorter wheelbase coach like mine. The really, really, long version: I had previously installed Koni shocks, a homemade rear track bar, SumoSprings Solos in the rear, and done the “Cheap Handling Fix” in the front. With these upgrades the handling had improved to where I didn’t feel anything more needed to be done, but the lousy pavement on so many of our roads was still shaking and jarring the coach and its contents far more than I wanted. The reality is that none of these improvements hold a candle to what LS has done. The prior upgrades all had to be removed for the LS install. I was satisfied with my coach’s road handling manners after the above listed upgrades, but LS improved handling beyond what I thought possible. The way the coach handles speed bumps and driveway approaches - in particular the angled hits that used to toss the coach side-to-side - is almost magical. I was dissatisfied with the rough ride of my coach. Prior to LS, the magnetic mount I use for my phone was no match for stretches of bad pavement. The phone would gradually get shaken off the mount if I didn’t reposition it regularly. Sometimes a single, big bump would send my phone crashing to the floor. I’ve driven over 9,000 miles since the LS install and haven’t had to touch my phone! Same phone, same magnetic mount, same tires; the only change is the LS install. The LS suspension does not turn the coach into a hovercraft; every bump in the road is still there. But the magnitude of the hits, in particular on the larger bumps, is very diminished. Potholes and pavement drops and heaves that used to jar the coach so hard I’d cringe are now relatively mild. The improvements here alone were worth the upgrade cost in my book. I flat tow a 4-door Jeep Wrangler. My DIY rear trackbar significantly reduced the tail-wagging-the-dog condition. The LS suspension all but eliminated it. I find myself glancing at the rear-view camera more frequently now to verify that the Jeep is still back there because I don’t feel it like I used to. The ability to raise and lower the coach when stopped or at slow speeds has been useful in less level camping spots and steep driveway approaches. I’m still training myself to remember to turn off the LS controller before deploying the leveling jacks; otherwise the two systems fight each other. Months prior to the LS install I installed new carpet in the cab area. While doing this I addressed engine noise and heat intrusion issues by installing Dynamat, Dynapad, and Hoodliner, and sealing up various air gaps (wish I’d done this years ago!). Engine and road noises were so reduced that the creaks and rattles of the house and its contents became even more apparent. After the LS install the ride is so much smoother that these noises are also dramatically reduced. The smoother ride I feel can’t help but be easier on the coach itself, and should reduce wear and tear. I drive over 100 miles of washboard dirt roads each year getting to favorite camping spots. LS made some improvement here, but it wasn’t as dramatic. Doing this again I’d likely plan a trip around the drive to the LS shop in Indiana for the install. I’m sure there are very competent authorized installers available, but the installation as delivered from Oregon Auto Springs was totally unacceptable. There were loose bolts, missing brackets, poorly routed and secured hoses, poorly routed and secured wiring, brake line stand-offs not attached, and too many more problems to list them all. All of these deficiencies have been addressed and my install is now in very good order; LS was particularly helpful in getting this done. My coach was the first shorter wheelbase coach that had both front and rear LS installed. There were space issues that LS hadn’t thought about that had to be overcome; specifically, new front volume tank brackets had to be designed and built. It was frustrating having my coach out of commission for so long, but I’m still glad I had the LS suspension installed. There have been countless patches of road in the past 9,000 miles that have caused either my wife or I to exclaim “I’m sure glad we have the new suspension!” I have no affiliation with LS and I paid market price for their system.2.5KViews0likes5CommentsPSA - cracked wheel on 2012 F53
While doing a lugnut torque check I discovered a crack in the hub-plate of a rear wheel. The wheel has been replaced and the rest of my wheels checked for cracks. I filed a report with the NHTSA. Glad I didn't find it the hard way as the wheel failed!2.3KViews0likes9CommentsQuad stacker/lift
Needed to fit a RZR 1000XP and 2 YFZ450Rs in an 8'x16' box trailer. This is what I built to make it work. Once the lower quad is in place the cross brace is installed with lock pins and the ramp lowered so there is no load on the winch and cable. Yes, I strap the quads down before travel.2.3KViews0likes2CommentsRe: Tire pressure (temperature) increase while driving
All I could afford wrote: Please double check your weights, weight distribution and pressures... Something just doesn't seem right there. I checked axle weights on a certified CAT truck scale that day and the rear axle was 12,820. Later in the trip I encountered an unmanned weigh station scale in Idaho. I drove across 3 times (stopping for each weight to register properly) and checked right, left, and axle; rear axle weight was exactly the same at 12,820 and read 150lbs. different right to left. In case anyone is wondering, the rear tires wear fine. There is no cupping, rivering, odd wear patterns, or premature wear, so it isn't an alignment problem (and yes, the alignment was checked at a heavy truck shop a while back). Front tires I have no problem with; just the rears that heat up and increase dramatically in pressure.483Views0likes0CommentsRe: Tire pressure (temperature) increase while driving
Tyler0215 wrote: Why did you add more air to the tires? If the Michelin chart says 85 psi for the weight you are carrying, thats the pressure you should run. Don't be adjusting the pressure when the tires are hot. I added air as I believed (and still believe) that they were heating up excessively and didn't want to overheat and damage $2K worth of brand new tires. Michelin's chart lists the minimum pressure for a given carry capacity. Adding 10 psi just made the volume of air in the tires roughly the same as if I'd started the trip at 95 psi (the sidewall listed max cold pressure). By the time I was rolling down the highway again the pressures were all at or below what they were when I stopped (because the tires had cooled down some). And they continued to drop slightly until settling in at about 108-110psi. In the morning they were all within 2psi of 95psi (verifying my above claim about air volume). I equalized pressures to 95 before resuming my trip. Thermodynamics is a pretty solid science. At 80-95psi a 10* increase in temperature results in a roughly 2psi increase in tire pressure (at 30-35 psi starting pressure the same 10* increase in temperature results in a roughly 1psi increase in tire pressure). Since the hubs and brakes weren't heating the wheels (yes, I checked them for excess heat) the source of the heat for the air inside the tires had to be from the rubber. And the rubber had to be at least as hot as, if not hotter than, the air inside the tires. And based on the applicable thermodynamic equations, the air was around 250*. That just sounds too darned hot to me.483Views0likes0CommentsRe: Tire pressure (temperature) increase while driving
Chum lee wrote: 30 psi pressure rise seems excessive. Has anyone put some type of "goop" in the tires attempting to fix a flat or balance them out? What does the air inside the tire smell like when you bleed the tires with excess pressure? Chum lee No "goop" in the tires. I never bleed air as that would only exacerbate the problem. Started my last trip with the brand new Michelins at 85psi. On I5 crossing the CA desert at 105* the pressure increased to 115psi. Stopped at a truck stop and added 10psi to each tire (gauged each tire and added 10psi since pressures were dropping as the tires cooled off as I worked my way around the rig). Continued the drive and pressures settled around 110psi. The next morning pressures were 95+/-psi at 75*.193Views0likes0Comments
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