How to understand Fifth wheels/Weights/ and my Truck

GAWR front 5200lbs + GAWR rear 6000lbs = GVWR 9900LBS in pickup math.

If you will read the fine print on the towing ratings, it notes something to the effect that NONE of the trucks ratings, GCWR, GVWR or GAWR are to be exceeded. It doe snot say you have the option of choosing which of the three numbers you meet or which of them you ignore.

Like I have said before, weigh the truck and then make the calculations and decide if you are comfortable or can justify in your mind exceeding the ratings. Again, there is no safety in numbers when more willingly exceed the ratings.

Ken

If the RAWR wasn't important then why have it on the door sticker? And why do RAWR'ings change and the payload doesn't? The payload doesn't change because it's limited by the GVW. The RAWR is only limited by tires and the axle manufacturers rating. It's funny that they change the RAWR and not the GVW when higher rated tires are used. That right there tells me that 3/4 tons are capable of hauling more and the GVW is only a number that's there to help conform with registration, ins or whatever some other dubious reason a state legislature has dumped on the users state.

TXiceman wrote:
And the 3/4 ton truck users continue to gather in little flocks seeking safety in number and burying their heads in the sand.

Not a thing wrong with a 3/4 ton truck or for that matter a 1/2 ton truck, provided you use it within the manufacturers ratings.

Ken

I understand what you're saying, but riddle me this; My 2012 Crew Cab, 4X4 F250 has a GVWR of 10,000lbs. I weighed the truck by itself when I first got it and it weighed over 7,000lbs. According to the towing guide, the maximum loaded 5th wheel trailer weight that it can haul is 15,200lbs. Using the oft used kingpin weight ratio of 20% of total trailer weight, that's 3,040lbs. Which would put the vehicle weight over the GVWR before a driver and passenger even got in the truck. So, which manufacturers rating do you follow? The GVWR or maximum loaded 5th wheel trailer weight? Gather around my little flock.

And the 3/4 ton truck users continue to gather in little flocks seeking safety in number and burying their heads in the sand.

Not a thing wrong with a 3/4 ton truck or for that matter a 1/2 ton truck, provided you use it within the manufacturers ratings.

Ken

drillagent wrote:
Here is my 2 cents worth. I'm sure I'll get blown in place, but here it goes. After doing all the recommended weigh ins, truck unloaded, truck loaded, and truck loaded with dry weight trailer, I've come to the conclusion that there is NO possible way my truck (located in signature) can tow a 5th wheel and meet the 10,000lbs weight rating, let alone tow the max amount of trailer weight.

That being said, I've done a lot of research and found that the only difference between a F250 and a F350 is the number of leaf springs (fixed with airbags) and the size/weight ratings of the tires. (fixed by replacing stock 17" tires with 18" tires) everything else is the same. (Engine, axles, brakes) Does making the changes make towing with a F250 any safer? Maybe not. Does that mean everyone towing with a F250 is wrong? I'll leave that up to your own personal risk assessment. But here's the thing. Do you think Ford ( or any other manufacturer) would publish a max towable trailer weight rating if they didn't think the vehicle could safely tow it? That would open them up for any number of lawsuits.

I don't have a clue if it's right or wrong but I have seen stated several times the reason for the F250. It seems some states base registration fees on GVWR and anything over 10k is considered a commercial vehicle with the much higher fees. Ergo, F250 under 10k and F350 over 10k, basically same truck.

I think it's called playing the government game.

Screw all that legal mumbo gumbo internet myth malarkey about being over weight. Anyone with the slightest bit of common sense can figure out that the only difference between a 3/4 ton and 1 ton is rear spring packs. 2013 and up Rams are the exception to the rule. A 3/4 ton with the proper rear suspension up grade and a good set of 18" wheels and tires will tow every bit as well as a stock 1 ton. In fact IMO an upgraded 3/4 ton is probably better than a stock 1 ton. Just looking at the payload numbers for my 12 Ram 2500 (2176lbs) and comparing them to a 3500 (2700) you only gain 430lbs of payload. I can get more of an increase with bags, springs or Timbrens.

Everyone has to determine their own risk factors. Is it a risk worth taking? For me it's not a risk. It's common sense.

drillagent wrote:
Here is my 2 cents worth. I'm sure I'll get blown in place, but here it goes. After doing all the recommended weigh ins, truck unloaded, truck loaded, and truck loaded with dry weight trailer, I've come to the conclusion that there is NO possible way my truck (located in signature) can tow a 5th wheel and meet the 10,000lbs weight rating, let alone tow the max amount of trailer weight.

That being said, I've done a lot of research and found that the only difference between a F250 and a F350 is the number of leaf springs (fixed with airbags) and the size/weight ratings of the tires. (fixed by replacing stock 17" tires with 18" tires) everything else is the same. (Engine, axles, brakes) Does making the changes make towing with a F250 any safer? Maybe not. Does that mean everyone towing with a F250 is wrong? I'll leave that up to your own personal risk assessment. But here's the thing. Do you think Ford ( or any other manufacturer) would publish a max towable trailer weight rating if they didn't think the vehicle could safely tow it? That would open them up for any number of lawsuits.

I find very interesting your statement on the tire size! I was looking at taking my 2001 RAM to 3rd Gen 17" wheels from the current 16" wheels so I could put larger front rotors on.
If I did this my tire weight rating (optional 265/75-16E) would go from 3,415 per tire DOWN to 3,195# per tire that is a loss of 880# of tire capacity for the truck!!!
I can improve the brakes in other ways when the time comes (they really do the job now) while I would still be well within the tire rating, I like having the 880# of EXTRA head room on the capacity. No worries with 13,660# of tire capacity.

Here is my 2 cents worth. I'm sure I'll get blown in place, but here it goes. After doing all the recommended weigh ins, truck unloaded, truck loaded, and truck loaded with dry weight trailer, I've come to the conclusion that there is NO possible way my truck (located in signature) can tow a 5th wheel and meet the 10,000lbs weight rating, let alone tow the max amount of trailer weight.

That being said, I've done a lot of research and found that the only difference between a F250 and a F350 is the number of leaf springs (fixed with airbags) and the size/weight ratings of the tires. (fixed by replacing stock 17" tires with 18" tires) everything else is the same. (Engine, axles, brakes) Does making the changes make towing with a F250 any safer? Maybe not. Does that mean everyone towing with a F250 is wrong? I'll leave that up to your own personal risk assessment. But here's the thing. Do you think Ford ( or any other manufacturer) would publish a max towable trailer weight rating if they didn't think the vehicle could safely tow it? That would open them up for any number of lawsuits.

I don't mean to barge into the conversation, but my question relates to this topic. I apologize beforehand if I should've started a new thread.

Here goes: I have a 2014 Ram 3500 SRW with a GVWR of 11,700. We recently purchased a 42' fifth wheel that is within weights (per weight station); however, something is odd. On my unloaded weigh-in the truck was 8580 (front/steer 5120, rear/drive 3460); with 5th wheel it was 23,100 (front 7260, rear 3800, trailer 12,040). Why would the scale show only 340 lbs added to the rear axle and 2140 to the front? GVWR, GCWR are fine, but my only concern is the huge jump exceeds my front GAWR by 1000lbs... I'm thinking I dorked up the weigh-in somehow.