Class A Gas or Diesel

I am not concerned about how fast my coach can accelerate. I am concerned about the ride and the weight it can hold and the quality of the manufacturer and lots of other things. One thing I really like about the diesel is the exhaust brake. It takes the stress out of going downhill. I go downhill at the same speed I made it up the hill if the grade is the same on both sides, and it works well.

I think this subject has been beaten to death in lots and lots and lots of threads. The best thing to do is read all those threads and decide which one will work for YOU!

anyhow my opinion as the OP asked go diesel pusher if your serious about RVing in a A MH series to any degree and u can afford the 06-12 your talking

willald wrote:


Right, because diesel burns slower than gas, and as a result, a diesel engine will struggle to accelerate as quickly as a gasser can. A gasser can drop down a gear, briefly turn 5000 RPMs and really get you accelerating quickly. That is something a diesel will never be able to do.

That depends on engineering.
Diesels operate with higher pressures, so need for heavier parts makes them turning slower than comparable gassers.
That doesn't mean you can't build 20,000 rpm diesel. (how fast turn those used in Formula 1 ?)
Good sample are 1995-1997 Mercedes 3 liter diesels.
They have peak HP at 5000 rpm. I used to drive one and it was quite annoying. But hard to beat 35 mpg on almost 2-ton car.
Coming back to my first suggestion.
Formula 1 diesels don't win the race becouse they are faster at start.
They win it becouse they can skip fueling the gassers do.

donfrump wrote:

willald wrote:

donfrump wrote:
Heres one thing I have noticed over my entire lifetime.When a person simply can not afford a certain product and has to settle for a lessor they simply hate the one they cant afford and will find umpteen reasons they would never buy such a item.

Very true, Don, I've seen same thing many times. Tis human nature, I suppose, the ol' fox and sour grapes thing.

HOWEVER, my previous post relating my experience, opinion on a diesel pusher, is NOT AT ALL related to what I can or can't afford. The unit I was looking at was within our reach financially. $$ didn't really enter into it much this time. The extreme sluggish feel and lack of throttle response when hitting the accelerator, did. :)

Also, the flip-side to your point is also true, Don: Those that spend significantly more $$ on one choise over another, will religiously defend their choice to the very end, swear its the best thing since sliced bread, to justify in their own head why they chose to spend so much more $$. Not ALWAYS the case, but again, it is human nature.

Will

on the flip side of the flip side.You may beat my 450ISL off the line but going up a long 5-6% grade I will leave u in the dust

..Possibly, but all depends on a lot of factors. Not the least of which is, who is loading down the heaviest, and just how hard each of us is willing to push it.

When my V10 drops down several gears and starts 'roaring' at 'bout 6,000 RPMs....It can pull us up long, steep grades every bit as fast as I want it to. :)

but mine is not sluggish off the line? not sure what your test drive one was up to

I wondered same thing, if one I was driving may have had something wrong with it. But, I kept thinking, surely a brand new Cummins ISL 380 HP/1150 torque diesel shouldn't already have something wrong with it, robbing it of any horsepower?? I'd hope not!

I just kept thinking, man, with 380 horsepower, thats all the umph its got?! Good gracious, this sluggishness would drive me insane, haha. :)

Will

willald wrote:

donfrump wrote:
Heres one thing I have noticed over my entire lifetime.When a person simply can not afford a certain product and has to settle for a lessor they simply hate the one they cant afford and will find umpteen reasons they would never buy such a item.

Very true, Don, I've seen same thing many times. Tis human nature, I suppose, the ol' fox and sour grapes thing.

HOWEVER, my previous post relating my experience, opinion on a diesel pusher, is NOT AT ALL related to what I can or can't afford. The unit I was looking at was within our reach financially. $$ didn't really enter into it much this time. The extreme sluggish feel and lack of throttle response when hitting the accelerator, did. :)

Also, the flip-side to your point is also true, Don: Those that spend significantly more $$ on one choise over another, will religiously defend their choice to the very end, swear its the best thing since sliced bread, to justify in their own head why they chose to spend so much more $$. Not ALWAYS the case, but again, it is human nature.

Will

on the flip side of the flip side.You may beat my 450ISL off the line but going up a long 5-6% grade I will leave u in the dust
but mine is not sluggish off the line? not sure what your test drive one was up to

Kayteg1 wrote:

donfrump wrote:


how does that help to decide on a gas or diesel unit ??
they both get about 7.5 MPG

You should educate yourself about engines a bit.
Diesel engines are reaching 50% thermal efficiency.
Gasoline engines about 30%, while 70% goes into heat.
So technically gasoline engines are heaters. HP is sideproduct.

so what? they both get 7.5MPG they both use fuel? one fires on compression one fires on electricty(spark)
If the fuel was the same price and its close in some places it would cost the same to drive one or the other
I really don't understand what your trying to say? what does that have to do with buying a gas or a diesel?

DSDP Don wrote:
Wow.....this thread is really all over the place. "donfrump" brings up a good point about people making disparaging remarks about something they can't afford. This really makes their opinion useless because it's so slanted.

Agreed, but as I just noted to Don, what I described was not 'slanted' really at all, 'cause I was able to afford the diesel pusher we were looking at. This was a 2015 unit that was just about to turn a year old, had been a demo unit, so they just knocked over $100k off the price. It was within our reach, financially, but it ain't in our driveway, 'cause I don't like that lack of throttle response. :)

Large displacement diesels in motor homes and semi's are not designed to have the "pedal put to the floor". When you do that with a diesel, it will fall on it's face.

Yep, indeed they will, which is why I prefer my V10 gasser, and the 'roar' and immediate throttle response I get when I put the pedal down on it. I like knowing that the engine can do that, and can get the unit moving quickly, if I need it to. Really exasperating to me to push down on the pedal and nothing really happens but a lot of grunting.

I realize, these are massive RVs and not meant to be drag racers. However, I still prefer an engine with some throttle response that can get things moving quickly if the need arises (like, merging onto a freeway, getting out of someone's way that isn't paying attention, etc).

They're designed to have the power rolled on. If you roll it on slowly, it will accelerate like other motor homes.

Right, because diesel burns slower than gas, and as a result, a diesel engine will struggle to accelerate as quickly as a gasser can. A gasser can drop down a gear, briefly turn 5000 RPMs and really get you accelerating quickly. That is something a diesel will never be able to do. It can't downshift, all it can do is grunt and grind along in high gear, low RPMs. Results in better mileage and longer life, possibly, but takes away ability to accelerate quickly like a gasser can.

If you drive down a smooth highway at 65 mph, both a gas motor home and a diesel will ride smoothly. If the road is full of potholes, both a gasser and a diesel will ride roughly. The diesel may absorb the shock a little better because of the size and weight, but you'll still feel it.

I had a gas motor home with the 8.1 Workhorse and it was a diesel eater. I could blow by most diesels on any grade. Now, the noise was horrendous in the cab, even after adding a lot of installation, but you only climb grades during about 5% of your travels, so not a big deal.

A diesel is more complicated to operate and maintain, but can haul and tow more weight. You need to decide what you want to do your coach, how often you'll use it and do you have a need for a diesel. Modern day gassers are very capable and probably the best choice for those who don't do more than 8-10K in miles every year.

My sister just took delivery of a new Fleetwood Southwind today. They were done dealing with the complexity of a diesel pusher. It's actually 4" longer than the diesel they sold and is just as nicely outfitted.

Good luck on your search. The lines between a diesel and a gasser have really been blurred so it's a tough choice.

..With all that, I agree. Especially how the lines between the two have really blurred and made the choice tougher. :)

Will

donfrump wrote:
Heres one thing I have noticed over my entire lifetime.When a person simply can not afford a certain product and has to settle for a lessor they simply hate the one they cant afford and will find umpteen reasons they would never buy such a item.

Very true, Don, I've seen same thing many times. Tis human nature, I suppose, the ol' fox and sour grapes thing.

HOWEVER, my previous post relating my experience, opinion on a diesel pusher, is NOT AT ALL related to what I can or can't afford. The unit I was looking at was within our reach financially. $$ didn't really enter into it much this time. The extreme sluggish feel and lack of throttle response when hitting the accelerator, did. :)

Also, the flip-side to your point is also true, Don: Those that spend significantly more $$ on one choise over another, will religiously defend their choice to the very end, swear its the best thing since sliced bread, to justify in their own head why they chose to spend so much more $$. Not ALWAYS the case, but again, it is human nature.

Will

donfrump wrote:


how does that help to decide on a gas or diesel unit ??
they both get about 7.5 MPG

You should educate yourself about engines a bit.
Diesel engines are reaching 50% thermal efficiency.
Gasoline engines about 30%, while 70% goes into heat.
So technically gasoline engines are heaters. HP is sideproduct.

I'll pass along the story my coach's previous owner told me about why he bought a DP (now mine). He and his wife were out west driving their gasser in the mountains. On a steep and long descent, they lost their brakes to heat. They could not slow down, let alone stop. They were convinced they were going to die and had called their children to say goodbye. They did make it down obviously. He then drove his gasser to a large RV dealer; took the keys inside and told the salesman he was not going to drive the gas unit one more foot...it was their's. He wanted air brakes and an exhaust brake. He then bought the Dutch Star which I now have. I do not doubt one word of his story. I'm sure there are new and better gas units and that they are safer. But..I am glad I have my DP with the air brakes and the exhaust brakes. It performs great climbing and descending the steepest grades pulling a Jeep.