Forum Discussion

Explorer II

Jul 13, 2015

We want to buy our 1st coach and eventually go full time

The research begins, the long journey of figuring out our needs and wants, and finding the best rig for our lifestyle and if course our budget.
Our plans are to sell everything including our home, and travel the US and Canada for a few years then figure out where we'd like to settle down or continue to full time for a longer period of time. We own a 5th wheel now and were transient for a number of years before becoming seasonal for the last 4 years. We have even thought of hanging on to the seasonal site and staying their in the summer months and traveling for the winter months. The site is in New Hampshire in the White Mountains which we love, and enjoy the hiking and kayaking, and the site is very reasonably priced.
I have so many thoughts and questions and thought the best way for me to educate myself would be to start a thread and lay them out and get peoples opinions and experiences.

We are not quite sure if we want to buy new or used. If we do buy used I wouldn't want to go more than 4 or 5 years old but would prefer even newer if possible. One of the things we have done to prepare ourselves for purchasing used is to have a half dozen or so rigs we think are in our price range that we like all picked out. What we do is attend the Hersey RV show almost every year and crawl through the motor homes there, talk with the dealers and manufacturers, grab the brochures and MSRP and show discounted price and note these and other noteworthy information on the brochures so when we start our search for a used rig we are already somewhat familiar with it, crawled through it, etc. As far as general information about the pros and cons of going full time, and the needs and wants of a rig that your in full time, I've started to have long conversations and pick the minds of people who visit the campground that we are seasonal at. Love to chat about their experiences, how they like their rig, is their anything they would do differently etc.

The other option of course is buying new, taking the depreciation hit and living with it for a few years. We plan on keeping the rig for quite a few years, even when we are no longer full time it will still be a 6 months out, 6 month home type of lifestyle wherever we decide to settle. We are trying to decide on length of rig, will a 36' diesel with all the amenities we want be enough, or should we go with a 40' coach. We are thinking 36-38 to give us more flexibility in campground choice and national parks, maneuverability, going to some of the more remote places up in Alaska, and the lower 48, little bit less on fuel consumption on the smaller rig etc. Or maybe we are just thinking about it the wrong way. 40' gives us more room, more storage, more tank storage for longer times dry camping, and larger fuel tank for longer time in-between fill ups, or maybe the difference in fuel mileage in the smaller unit becomes a wash.

I have a few years and I am thinking about 2 different approaches. One is buy a rig now in the coming year or so and tool around in it to get to know what I want and need 1st hand and then buy the "real" rig for full timing in a couple of years. Or wait 2 or 3 years and buy the full time rig right off the bat, be weekend warriors in it for a few years before going out full time. We won't be full time for 5 years so I do have options, thus the posting now.

We both have similar likes as far as layout and wants/needs inside the rig.

King size bed with night table/shelves on both sides. This may not be an option on the smaller rigs.

Decent countertop space in the kitchen as I am the cook and love to practice my hobby, all though the main ingredient will most likely be done on the grill, I love tinkering with side dishes and sauces etc.

TV placement is important to us, I hate the way many of the layouts have the TV placed behind the kitchen table in the kitchen so if anybody is working in the kitchen or sitting at the kitchen table your view can be obstructed. We also prefer not to have it above the dash over the windshield so you have to look up to watch it.

There are only the 2 of us and we never foresee the need to have to accommodate sleeping for more than 2 or need to have the privacy as if there will be others sharing the rig.

Nice big refrigerator with large freezer.

Convection microwave and probably not an oven. I have used the oven in the 5th wheel but on very rare occasions and think I could get along without it.

Small kitchen table with expansion capability for the occasions when hosting if weather forces us inside.

Good size TV in the bedroom

Pullout couch if by chance we do have a sleepover

A desk corner for computer and printer

AC in both main cabin and bedroom

Double sink in kitchen.

Auto leveling.

50 amp service

Some of the things we are not sure of and maybe are purely a luxury and not practical are a dishwasher and washer/drier. They take up storage space but is the convenience worth it?

That's a start, as far as outside the coach, I definitely want a diesel pusher, would love some sort of entertainment center outside. I don't like awnings that are attached to the main body of the coach and then loose half their space to a glide out but may have to settle on that. Lots of underneath storage.

Well that's the start of this thread, I'm hoping people will commit and add. Tell me where my thinking is wrong or lacking. Add your ideas and experiences of what you have found while on your adventures. What you would do differently etc.

Thanks to all

Class A

ncrowley
Explorer II
Jan 05, 2016
You can have a pretty good idea of how the coach was cared for by looking at the maintenance records. If there are no records, then just walk away.
Quint_Da_Man
Explorer II
Jan 05, 2016
Snowman9000 wrote:
Quint, I'm going to be blunt. But it's free advice, worth what you are paying for it! :)

Your financial idea is all wrong. UNLESS you are going to use it enough before you retire to make it worth having. Which sounds unlikely to me. Otherwise you are pee-ing away a fortune just to have an 8 year old coach when you retire. Because, you can simply buy the same coach, 8 years old, 8 years from now. Instead of paying 220K plus a lot of interest, insurance, tags, maintenance & repairs over the course of 8 years, you can wait 8 years and pay for or finance a coach worth what, 70K?

I learned a long time ago that most people are cash flow thinkers. The finance industry loves cash flow thinkers. Don't be a cash flow thinker; think about the $200,000 you're going to pee away while waiting to retire and really use the MH. Wouldn't you rather retire and have the 200K??? Start a savings fund and put the money into it instead of a MH. Then buy a used MH.

OK, lecture over.
:)

Not a lecture at all snowman, it's exactly the type of feedback I was looking for.

So my rebuttal is yes I can put the money away and buy it used in 8 years but who knows how it was taken care of. So I end up with a used rig owned by somebody else I don't know, how the lived, how they cared for the rig, etc. If I've been the owner then I know all of the above.

But the other side of the coin is I could put the money away in a RV fund and possibly pay cash or close to it in eight years depending on how expensive a comparable rig is at that time.
Ivylog
Explorer III
Jan 01, 2016
OutdoorPhotographer wrote:

Is it easier to get spots for 40 footers in NP's if you dry camp, say Yellowstone? I realize that is the only option in some NP's anyway.

Yes it's easier and less expensive. I have friends with similar size MH's that worry if they do not have 50 amps every night. The beauty of a big MH is how well you can dry camp for 5-7 days without cutting back on anything. In Ystone my 42' becomes a 40'... max for some CGs and I've never been measured.
We do three months out West without reservations and only a general idea of the areas we want to visit. 12 years ago it took a fair amount of pre-planning, but today with more web sites, smart phones and better coverage... it's fairly easy especially if you arrive late Sunday or early Monday when the local's have gone home. In those three months we will boondock the majority of the time BUT we camp at higher elevations and in the trees (we are not desert people) where you do not have to run the generator for AC. Most days we are in the car exploring/sightseeing.

Back to the OP's situation. Now that we know it 8 years to retirement and he already has a 5er... A large DP is the nicest and most expensive way to see the USA, OK and Canada. I agree with the above posts to keep what you have, save a lot of money and then buy a slightly used DP when you retire. My criteria was until I could use a RV 100+ days/year I should keep the price below $60K... $75K in today's dollars. Even paying cash, this is not a cheap sport... For 11 years my depreciation has been $14K/year, insurance $1200/year, 1000 gallons fuel/year ($2-3000)... at 100 days/year that's $160/day for it to just move down the road... even at 180 days/year that's $90/day and well worth it. :B
* Not sure I really wanted to know this.:h If I divide it by 2 pewople that's only $45/day/person. Somewhat better.:B
Snowman9000
Explorer
Dec 31, 2015
Quint, I'm going to be blunt. But it's free advice, worth what you are paying for it! :)

Your financial idea is all wrong. UNLESS you are going to use it enough before you retire to make it worth having. Which sounds unlikely to me. Otherwise you are pee-ing away a fortune just to have an 8 year old coach when you retire. Because, you can simply buy the same coach, 8 years old, 8 years from now. Instead of paying 220K plus a lot of interest, insurance, tags, maintenance & repairs over the course of 8 years, you can wait 8 years and pay for or finance a coach worth what, 70K?

I learned a long time ago that most people are cash flow thinkers. The finance industry loves cash flow thinkers. Don't be a cash flow thinker; think about the $200,000 you're going to pee away while waiting to retire and really use the MH. Wouldn't you rather retire and have the 200K??? Start a savings fund and put the money into it instead of a MH. Then buy a used MH.

OK, lecture over.
:)
OutdoorPhotogra
Explorer
Dec 31, 2015
2gypsies wrote:
OutdoorPhotographer wrote:
Is it easier to get spots for 40 footers in NP's if you dry camp, say Yellowstone? I realize that is the only option in some NP's anyway.

In our experience over 16 years of using public parks, yes, a 40' will fit in many, many parks - not all, naturally. We have stayed in Yellowstone at Mammoth, Madison and Bridge Bay. We've stayed in Grand Teton at Colter and Gros Ventre campgrounds. We've stayed in Glacier, Zion, Bryce, and many others. We've also used many state parks along with Corp of Engineers, county and city parks. National forest campgrounds are always a favorite. You just have to do your research.

Thanks! I know there are places you would eliminate yourself but it nice to know you fit more than expected. Yellowstone is a key park because of its size. I would love to visit multiple times and prefer staying in the park for early morning photography. Bridge Bay is a great location.
Mr_Mark1
Explorer
Dec 31, 2015
Quint da Man, I'll just throw this out. If you are not going to retire until eight years from now, why not just keep what you have and SAVE, SAVE, SAVE...........pay cash for a new/used unit at retirement.

At that time, you will probably have a very good idea what you would like to full-time in. You never know, things could change over the years and you may decide not RV anymore.

I know it's not always in the cards, but having 'payments' on anything after retirement is best to avoid. Let ALL the money be for you as you can control your spending depending on incoming funds.

Good luck,
MM.
2gypsies1
Explorer III
Dec 31, 2015
OutdoorPhotographer wrote:
Is it easier to get spots for 40 footers in NP's if you dry camp, say Yellowstone? I realize that is the only option in some NP's anyway.

In our experience over 16 years of using public parks, yes, a 40' will fit in many, many parks - not all, naturally. We have stayed in Yellowstone at Mammoth, Madison and Bridge Bay. We've stayed in Grand Teton at Colter and Gros Ventre campgrounds. We've stayed in Glacier, Zion, Bryce, and many others. We've also used many state parks along with Corp of Engineers, county and city parks. National forest campgrounds are always a favorite. You just have to do your research.
xctraveler
Explorer
Dec 31, 2015
On the subject of financing, Interest rates today are as low as we are likely to see in the near term. My current rate is 3.95% before tax and I am doing better than that in the market. Fed is starting to RAISE interest rates for the first time in many years. It won't be long before rates for MoHo loans start to rise. Thus waiting 8 years could result in substantially higher payments both for interest and for higher prices.

IF you are going to use the coach today, and not let it rot in the drive, consider buying what you want today, especially if diesel.

Size is very personal. We are full time in a 36 with 4 slides and Queen bed and we have room in the cupboards and storage areas, even with a 16 year old grandson visiting. Others would feel cramped in 45 ft. We are 3000 lbs UNDER our GVWR at last weigh in. As I have mentioned elsewhere we are size limited by our younger son's driveway. 36 ft takes up to 30 minutes to get turned and situated, any longer and I doubt we could do it.
OutdoorPhotogra
Explorer
Dec 31, 2015
Ivylog wrote:
I somewhat agree with 2gypsies post of 36' East and 40' West, but I would include CA to the East BUT I'd add 2' to his max. We grew up in the SE traveling more in the East. Now we have gone west 8 of the last 10 summer s and Fla in the winter as half timers in our 42'. I marvel at those that can FT in 36' and there is nothing on their counters. It's a good thing we had 9,000 lbs of CCC as we have used a lot of it.

Since the OP is in MA I'll guess that they will travel more in the West than in the East. Out West we boondock over half the time, usually Monday-Friday (easier to find a big rig site) and then resupply and travel on the weekends when the locals go to the woods. I made the mistake of starting with a used 36' DP because of posts that's the biggest for SP, NP, USFS, Coe .... did not take long to realize that was not true so traded for a 40' and not long after our 42'. I now always post "Buy more RV than you think you need... ONE TIME. This was a fairly expensive education.

Maybe you will not have the same education... GOOD LUCK.

Is it easier to get spots for 40 footers in NP's if you dry camp, say Yellowstone? I realize that is the only option in some NP's anyway.
OutdoorPhotogra
Explorer
Dec 31, 2015
Quint Da Man wrote:
So a few have said that buying now is too early for reasons such as warranty issues ect.

I'll be devils advocate and list reasons I think are valid as to why it might be a better idea to buy now than to wait. But I'll set up some conditions. This is not meant to disagree it's just campfire chat here and maybe my logic is completely flawed.

Conditions: wife is 7 years younger than me and wants me to wait until I'm 65 to retire so lets go with that. That makes it 8 years away before full time.

Rig MSRP is $320,000, 30% off makes it around $220,000 plus or minus.
put $100,000 down finance the rest for 20 years but set up bi-monthly which makes it actually 18 yrs.

We are both working and can afford to actually do double payments for the 8 years until we retire so we will have only about 2 or three years left to pay when we finally retire.

If we wait until we retire to buy a new rig it may not be possible and if we do we are facing 20 years of payments so we would most likely have to go used. Also I'm hedging my bet that interest rates are not going to get lower in 8 years but a good chance they are higher, maybe much higher. Also units are not going to get cheaper either.

So used might be more practical, how old, who knows 3, 5 years and buying from somebody we don't know and don't truly know the history. Yes there are many success stories, but many disasters as well. Our rig will be 8 years old, all the bugs are worked out of it, and I know the owners really well :) and know they took care of it.

Yes warranties are long gone but if something failed I've already taken care of it. When warranties expire 5 years after retirement I still have to pay for them out of pocket. Would rather have done that when still working.

So now I'm 68 unit is completely paid off and we have no payments to worry about it's only 10 or 11 years old, has been taken care of and should last another 10 years if we chose to continue if not we sell and put the cash in the bank.

I'll bite. Part of it depends on how much you'll use it during those 8 years. If you have a paid off rig for those 8 years, you can put the same double payments in the bank for a bigger down payment. If you are getting substantial use, didn't have a paid for camper in the drive already, and could have the new RV paid in full at retirement, I can see your logic.