Is my Ready Brake Always on going downhill?

Will,
I thank you for your ideas and precautionary advice. And, I do understand the issues that could happen if, a short were to occur. I guess I'm just one of those guys that doesn't worry about things like that. When I do my work, I set it up so the possibility of a short, i.e. cut wire, chaffing, dangling, tight stretches or corners, little to no protection for exposed wires, etc. are all taken into account when I do the work. Nobodies perfect, and I certainly don't claim to be. I just have always taken maximum precautions in all my wiring jobs.

You, and I, and many others out there, have seen "shawdy" wiring jobs time and time again, and, even from "Companies" that were paid big dollars for their work. That system I described and, the answer to multiple issues, has worked flawlessly for over 7 years without so much as a hiccup.

But, I also certainly understand that newer and more modern vehicles have more complicated wiring systems, i.e. "Can-Buss" systems that absolutely cannot be wired using my method. And, if and when I encounter those, I will then move to a "Plug and Play" type alternative. Thanks again for your concern, it is duly legitimate.
Scott

FIRE UP wrote:
..A very simple solution. No diodes in this section. All I did was, cut the brake switch output wire from the toads brake switch. I then routed it to a tiny, double throw, toggle switch located almost in the door jamb of the Jeep. I ran that wire to the center post of that toggle. Then, I ran another wire, right back to the cut wire on the brake light switch. I tied those together. Now, I ran another wire from the other side of that toggle switch, to the front of the toad, through the pig tail, and all the way to an LED light on the dash of the coach....

Scott,
Your approach is definitely simple, but the problem with it is that you're tapping directly into the electrical system of your toad, and running its 12V power through the wires going to your dash indicator. If there's ever an issue (short) with the wires going to your dash indicator, you could do damage to your toad's electrical system. On something simple like a Jeep that may not be a huge concern, but on newer vehicles with their ever complicated (and expensive to work on!) electrical systems, it would be a concern.

I guess you could alleviate a lot of that risk by installing a fuse on that wire going to the dash indicator. You'd want to put the fuse as close as possible to the wire you ran from the toad's brake switch. If you haven't done such, I would highly recommend you do.

OTOH, if you use a trailer wiring kit like I alluded to, you keep the wiring for your dash indicator almost completely isolated from the toad's electrical system. Pretty much removes the risk of electrical shorts or other problems with your dash indicator wiring from ever harming your toad.

Will

Just Lee,
Well Sir, you've been given lots of explanations of how things work and, how to change/alter things to accomplish your purpose. I'll give you one more.

First, I installed a Ready Brake when they first came out, somewhere around 10 + years ago. My Ready Brake was installed way different than the factory install instructions. My R/B is not connected to the toad brake pedal 24/7 like they would have you do. I set it up with clip mechanism that takes around, 3-4 seconds to hook up. That way, the R/B cable system is not being used and wearing on that cable housing etc. for no reason at all. Then, instead of that hideous cable adjustment system of looping the cables and using "cable clamps" for adjusting the tension for the link cable, I use a stainless steel turn buckle which works flawlessly.

Anyway, the primary reason (as has somewhat been explained) that your toads brakes ARE NOT CONSISTANTLY APPLIED WHILE YOU'RE DECENDING A HILL/GRADE is because of the spring loaded actuator of the R/B. That spring is a seriously strong spring. Now, it will not overcome the force of the toads weight as it surges forward while the brakes are applied in the coach. That's not its intent. However, what it is intended for is to overcome the "drift" or, "coasting" weight as you decend a grade.

In that, once the brakes are applied, the inertia of the toad is pressed against the actuator and, therefore, the action of it, will over come that strong spring and apply the brakes in the toad. But, as you back off on the brakes in the coach, that spring takes over and actually "backs off" the toad enough that the actuation of the brake pedal is released but, as you most likely know, the brake switch on the toad is normally adjusted in such a manor that, it closes the circuit even when the brake arm in the toad is SLIGHTLY moved.

Hence, that's why you'll see the light on your dash. The arm is moved enough to trigger the light but, not apply the toad brakes.

Now, when I set my system up, I too sent the signal from the toads brake switch to the dash on the coach. But, I did it in what to me is, a very simple way. You'd be surprised how many folks out there in RV land don't have a clue that their toads brake lights are being lit up when they're using an auxiliary brake system in toad. No one ever tells them.

Anyway, because I wired my toads all the exact same way, (seven different Jeep Wranglers over a 25 year period) and that is to utilize the stock tail lights for toad lights when towing. So, to alleviate the dual signals being sent to the same filament while towing, here's what I did.

A very simple solution. No diodes in this section. All I did was, cut the brake switch output wire from the toads brake switch. I then routed it to a tiny, double throw, toggle switch located almost in the door jamb of the Jeep. I ran that wire to the center post of that toggle. Then, I ran another wire, right back to the cut wire on the brake light switch. I tied those together. Now, I ran another wire from the other side of that toggle switch, to the front of the toad, through the pig tail, and all the way to an LED light on the dash of the coach.

Now, when the toad is being towed, I flip the switch to send the toads brake switch signal, to the dash on the coach. But, when driving the toad, I flip the switch to send the toads brake light signal to the toads brake lights, as normal. To me, it was incredibly simple solution to cover three issues. 1, it stops dual signals being sent to one filament, 2, it allows for one filament to accommodate signals from two different sources, and 3, It allows for me to be notified that the R/B system is working correctly.

Just another way to look at your situation for you. Take care.
Scott

I have my RAV4 wired via diodes so that all of the brake lights and turn signals work normally no matter which vehicle is controlling them. That includes having the ReadyBrake dash indicator only lighting up when the RAV's brakes are actually applied enough to turn on the brake lights. All three brake lights work normally on both the coach and the toad, and the amber turn signals also work normally on both. The coach has conventional incandescent bulbs, and the RAV has LED's.

Just Lee wrote:
Right now when hooked up the TOAD uses the Brake/Running Lights for everything Running/Brake/Signal........ However my TOAD lights work whether the key is on or not. So I disconnect the Battery because I do not want the lights to be fed from 2 sources.

Mine is wired exactly the same way, but I don't have a problem with it. The only downside I see is if the MH turn signal is on and the toad's brakes come on, the toad's turn signal doesn't flash. The constant brake light signal from the toad's brakes keeps it on. However, that happens whether the dash light is hooked to the RB or the toad. It is just the way those work.

Just Lee wrote:
Bobbo that's a great idea running a wire from the 3rd brake light. The only problem I see with that is I have to disconnect the battery in my TOAD the reason why is, here is my story (and I'm sticking to it LOL)

My coach is a 2013 with LED tail lights, it has separate Turn Signals (amber) and Brake/Running lights. My TOAD I bought is a 96 Geo Tracker that has separate Turn Signal, Brake/Running lights. The Toad I bought was already wired using (DIODES 4 wire plug on the front) so I bought a 7 to 4 Umbilical Cord.

Right now when hooked up the TOAD uses the Brake/Running Lights for everything Running/Brake/Signal........ However my TOAD lights work whether the key is on or not. So I disconnect the Battery because I do not want the lights to be fed from 2 sources.

So I am not sure I can do as you suggest.......

Thanks LeeB

Diodes are meant to handle exactly what you describe here, I'm not seeing just based on this, a need to disconnect your battery. One of our toads, a Kia Sedona minivan, is wired with diodes exactly as you describe. We use a Readybrake with it, and when braking, no doubt two signals are going to the diode. Has not been a problem.

Obviously its your vehicle(s) and your call, but just from a tail-light wiring standpoint, I don't see the need to disconnect the battery in your case. I'd try keeping it hooked up, then you can look at how to wire the Readybrake dash indicator to the toad's brake switch.

FYI, an easier, safer, and less intrusive way I've found to wire to a vehicle's brake switch, is to get and install a universal trailer wiring kit like this one on your toad. Just make sure you connect it to the toad's brake light wire on the vehicle side before it goes to the diode. Then, you can use the stop light wire from the 4 flat connector on the wiring kit, and run a wire from there to the MH dash indicator. This way, it 'isolates' the wiring going to the MH dash indicator, and if there's ever a short or other problem with the wiring to your dash indicator, you're not going to hurt the electrical system of your toad. Most you'd do is blow the fuse for the trailer wiring kit. I used a wiring kit this for both of my 'toads' to make the MH dash indicator show true toad braking, and it works great.

Bobbo that's a great idea running a wire from the 3rd brake light. The only problem I see with that is I have to disconnect the battery in my TOAD the reason why is, here is my story (and I'm sticking to it LOL)

My coach is a 2013 with LED tail lights, it has separate Turn Signals (amber) and Brake/Running lights. My TOAD I bought is a 96 Geo Tracker that has separate Turn Signal, Brake/Running lights. The Toad I bought was already wired using (DIODES 4 wire plug on the front) so I bought a 7 to 4 Umbilical Cord.

Right now when hooked up the TOAD uses the Brake/Running Lights for everything Running/Brake/Signal........ However my TOAD lights work whether the key is on or not. So I disconnect the Battery because I do not want the lights to be fed from 2 sources.

So I am not sure I can do as you suggest.......

Thanks LeeB

Bobbo is exactly right - Just 'cause the Readybrake Actuator moves enough to engage the switch, turning on your brake indicator, does NOT mean it has moved enough to actually engage the brakes on your toad. It is taking up the slack, initially.

That is why Bobbo, me, and several other RB owners wired the dash indicator directly to the toad vehicle's brake switch instead of the RB actuator. That way you know exactly when the brakes are engaged and when they are not. This approach does require a bit more work to set up initially, but has several advantages. Its really good to know exactly when and how often your toad brakes are actually being applied, not just when the RB actuator is moving.

As to your specific question: If you have your RB set up correctly, the cable properly tensioned, NO, RB will NOT drag your toad's brakes all the way downhill. I have personally confirmed that several times on ours, when going down mountain inclines. This is a common 'myth' that folks sometimes suggest about surge systems like Readybrake, but it simply is not true. The Readybrake actuator is designed to prevent this.

...I would pursue this issue with ReadyBrake. I don't think this issue should have arisen, seems to me there is something amiss!

No, nothing amiss. Just the nature of the system, when the dash indicator is wired to RB's actuator and not the toad's brake switch. You lose something when its wired that way.

Readybrake used to instruct (and give you the parts) to wire the dash indicator directly to toad's brake switch. However, they stopped doing that due to the fact so many folks were having to pull fuses, disconnect battery, etc. on their toad. Its still a much, much better way to wire the dash indicator if your setup allows such. I recommend that approach to anyone using a Readybrake, if they can.

JMO, but I think EVERY supplemental brake system should have some indicator like this, to tell you exactly when your toad brake pedal is being pressed. That way you'll know immediately if something with the brake system isn't working properly.

There is slack in the cable between the ready brake and the toad's brake. When the ready brake first activates, it is taking up that slack and the car's brakes are not, yet, activated. That is what his dash light is signaling, the slack being taken up. That is why I switched my indicator to the car's brakes. That slack does not light up my indicator any more.

The fix is great and makes sense. However, I would pursue this issue with ReadyBrake. I don't think this issue should have arisen, seems to me there is something amiss!