Tried the Blue Flame, will be looking at another way to heat

For folks who don't mind dropping a wee bit o' coin, you may be able to Google up info on Propex or Espar. No first-hand knowledge, but minimal battery draw from what I've read.

Jim, "Play nice, children, or mommy will sell your souls on eBay."

VentFree.org FAQs. I learning stuff here!!!


But it still makes me uncomfortable! Grew up in a time when everything gas operated had to be vented. Many home gas fired appliances still have to be vented. i.e. hot water tank and clothes dryers. If a gas meter reader sees a improperly vented hot water tank, they turn off your gas supply to this day!!!

Living in the cold wintery north, hardly a year goes by that one does not read locally about someone dying in a RV in the winter time because of improperly operated heaters. And often read locally about who families dying from CO (carbon monoxide) deaths because of defective or improperly vented furnaces. I remember when "vent free" heaters came on the market and were available in some states and not in others. We could buy one in the neighboring state of Pennsylvania, but not in NYS. And no respectable appliance installer would be caught installing such a heater!!!

But it appears that when installed and operated properly that "vent free" is perfectly safe. It is amazing that a old dog can still be taught new tricks! But the key is proper installation and proper operation. Improperly installed and improperly operated can bring things we don't want to think about. And I'm not installing any heating appliance in my home or RV that is not certified by a authorized agency.

SuzzeeeQ2012 wrote:


Ok, I'll see. I'm on CPAP and that pulls some off our inverter.

SuzzeeeQ,
See if you CPAP is both 110 AC and 12 VDC. The 12 VDC will not draw as much from the batteries as the inverter does. Mine CPAP is and many are, but they don't give you a 12 volt cord. You can buy the cords on line, and they are cheaper too than they are from the CPAP suppliers! Think I got my cord off ebay. Installed a 12 VDC outlet in the bed box.

pianotuna wrote:


Suz had blue flame and didn't like it, not a catalytic.

Reread O.P. Suz's opening post, relevant part reproduced below. I'm just reminding her to weigh all evidence, and give special priority to what she knows to be true based on her own experience.

SuzzeeeQ2012 wrote:
..snip.. We had a Wave 6 catalytic in our other motorhome. and it worked good.
I'm always afraid of carbon monoxide, and leave windows cracked.

Hi Francesca,

High/low venting is about attempting to get rid of the excessive moisture (and other nasty by products) that an unvented combustion heater is going to create inside an RV.

Suz had blue flame and didn't like it, not a catalytic.

I am not interested in becoming a Darwin award winner, and my daughter is a CO survivor. I will not use an unvented combustion heater while I sleep.

Where I full time (we get to -40), it would be impossible to go all night without heat because of water lines freezing. There is a good chance the waste tanks would freeze, too.

I also refuse to use a generator while sleeping. These actions are too much of a gamble for me.

Francesca Knowles wrote:
I think of the high/low venting as at least partly for air movement/circulation.

Do keep your own experience with the Wave in mind...sounds like you "survived" all right, as have thousands of other users that know how to follow the simple venting requirements.

I'm also a member of that group- now on my second (a Wave) due to having somehow damaged the face of the blanket on the one I'd been using for five or six years.

SuzzeeeQ2012 wrote:
Ok. Question. One high and one low.


why high?

To provide a convective exchange of air.

beemerphile1 wrote:

CavemanCharlie wrote:
...my house furnace has a chimney yes, but it's just a flame setting in the basement with no outside air coming in to replenish what it burns except what it pulls in through cracks....

That antique is costing you a lot of money. A 90%+ efficiency home furnace will bring in combustion air and the exhaust is so cool it goes out through a schedule 40 PVC pipe. No chimney required and only about 7% of your fuel is wasted. Some old furnaces are 60% efficient which means 40% of the fuel you pay for is wasted.

Sorry, I didn't explain myself very well. My home furnace is only about 8 year old and when I said "chimney" I should have said the exhaust goes out of the house through a PVC pipe. No fresh air intake though.

CO = carbon monoxide which will make you drowsy and kill you in a relatively short time

CO2 = carbon dioxide which isn't a big concern for this discussion although it can kill if highly concentrated in your blood. CO2 is also what makes your soda fizz.

Both are byproducts of combustion

CO is nearly the same density as air so it can't be said to rise or fall

Heat rises and since CO and CO2 are in the combustion gasses (heat) output they both will rise by convection

I think of the high/low venting as at least partly for air movement/circulation.

Do keep your own experience with the Wave in mind...sounds like you "survived" all right, as have thousands of other users that know how to follow the simple venting requirements.

I'm also a member of that group- now on my second (a Wave) due to having somehow damaged the face of the blanket on the one I'd been using for five or six years.

Answer:

I take it back. I found this...then, THAT'S why the high vent opening is required..interesting.

Carbon monoxide will rise indoors
True. CO is slightly lighter (28amu) than O2 (32amu) which comprises about 21% of air and of equal mass to N2 (28amu) which comprises pretty much all of the remaining 79%. So its density is very slightly lower. However, the reason it is likely to rise has more to do with the fact that it is usually the result of combustion and will therefore be warmer than the surrounding air - causing it to rise.
But the bottom line is this: the difference in density is so slight and the mixing of the CO with the air in a room so rapid that it would be very safe to assume that if excess amounts of carbon monoxide are present in a building they will quickly spread to all floors in a multi-story building/house. So don't just put a detector on the top floor thinking that all of the CO will end up there! If there's source of CO in your basement (or anywhere, for that matter) it could be a dangerous situation throughout the house. Install a detector on each level.


oh my, I guess I need someone that really knows what they're talking about....instead of the internet lol




Does carbon Dioxide rise or fall indoors?





In: Chemistry, Global Warming



Answer:




Carbon Dioxide is heavier than air. This means that it will not float, but will sink in the atmosphere