K&N air filter

fj12ryder wrote:
Man, I'm done, you people don't even read a post before you start to spout like Mt. Vesuvius. Did any of you ranters even read anything I posted, or did you just cut and paste?

Never, ever, ever, ever did I say anything about HP increases, better filtering, or anything else you guys are ranting over.

I did point out that the company has been in business for over 50 years, so they are obviously selling something people are buying.

Hopeless, absolutely hopeless.

They work for some people, in wet, muddy or humid conditions. They don't work work a poop in dusty, or dry, or dirty, or desert conditions with a lot of airborne particulate matter, dirt, or dust, where you really need the air filtered of airborne dust, dirt and particulate matter.

I refuse to pay that kind of money for an oily cotton rag passing as a "filter" that does NOT work effectively for the places I drive.... farm country, AG country, desert dirt and dust country, the whole West and Midwest area of the USA. The South East, East and North East tend to have enough frequent rains and humidity to make mud more common than air born dust.

PT Barnum said "Don't worry about that, there's a sucker born every minute." That was a long time ago, it's probably down to every 5 or 6 seconds, nowadays. Add in the quality of USA public schools and education nowadays, and folks having critical reasoning skills, and it's probably down to 3 or 4 being born, per second.

The pin holes are there to prevent cigar ash size contamination from being scared of the dark.

Lynnmor wrote:
If you use a K&N, please permanently affix the decal so that when you trade it in some poor unsuspecting buyer will know that the truck was abused. It's the right thing to do.

:B

I once had a K&N drop in filter on an S10 pickup. In all honesty I didn't really notice any difference in performance, and never could get any consistent, measurable mileage gains. It was probably on the truck about a year, the throttle was getting a little sticky, so I pulled the air tube off the throttle body and was surprised at the amount of dust and grit that got through to the clean side of the filter. Cleaned the throttle, dropped a paper filter back in, and never looked back!

It is also telling, that they can usually pick up a K&N filter or a faulty filter in a used oil analysis. The silicon (fine sand particles)levels generally read higher with a K&N filter in use than a paper.

I'm not saying it will instantly ruin your engine or fear mongering. I just don't think it is a wise investment to spend $50 or mor for an air filter that seems to offer no or little measurable advantages in performance, and allows more dirt in your engine.

If you want a good air filter that flows better than stock paper, Amsoil EA filters use synthetic nanofiber technology, it flows better than standard paper and still filters very well.

If you use a K&N, please permanently affix the decal so that when you trade it in some poor unsuspecting buyer will know that the truck was abused. It's the right thing to do.

Lots of opinions already I will just tell you my preference from building and working with race engines. the oiled filters flow great on a naturally aspirated 350. Put a turbo or supercharger on there and the oil gets sucked into the intake and leaves you with a cotton cone that can't stop squat.

On these applications we use the Amsoil Ea Air Filters - Nanofiber Technology

A very experienced diesel mechanic I know well told me that the K&N passes everything smaller than small stones. Fleetguard is the only air filter I'll use for my Cummins.

fj12ryder wrote:
Man, I'm done, you people don't even read a post before you start to spout like Mt. Vesuvius. Did any of you ranters even read anything I posted, or did you just cut and paste?

Never, ever, ever, ever did I say anything about HP increases, better filtering, or anything else you guys are ranting over.

I did point out that the company has been in business for over 50 years, so they are obviously selling something people are buying.

Hopeless, absolutely hopeless.

Sorry,

Obviously the truth hurts.

You already have your mind made up..

Hopefully though my "spouting" as you say will save other folks from wasting money.

Just "because" a company has been in business for 50 yrs does not really tell any story that the products they sell are good nor that they are truthful. There are thousands of companies selling thousands of products for 50 yrs, some with good products and some selling snake oil..

Never judge a company product reputation solely on how long they have been in business.. A really good marketing team can and will find ways to make junk products sell..

They have been in business for 50 yrs because they have a good MARKETING TEAM and SALES TEAM.. It is called MARKETING HYPE and it works..

Often times folks feel ripped off and are extremely ASHAMED that they got ripped off.. That IS the case with a lot of snake oil products such as this.

I AM NOT ASHAMED that I got ripped off, I AM MAD that I allowed the marketing hype to convince my skeptical side to waste money and time on a piece of quackery.

They STILL do market their filters under the pretense of "possible" HP and gas mileage increases and that IS wrong. They have only slightly changed it, it used to state clearly that it WOULD increase HP and mileage (up to 10 HP)..

You are more than welcome to buy and use them, but for me, they will never ever find their way into one of my vehicles again. I have better things to spend my hard earned cash on.

Man, I'm done, you people don't even read a post before you start to spout like Mt. Vesuvius. Did any of you ranters even read anything I posted, or did you just cut and paste?

Never, ever, ever, ever did I say anything about HP increases, better filtering, or anything else you guys are ranting over.

I did point out that the company has been in business for over 50 years, so they are obviously selling something people are buying.

Hopeless, absolutely hopeless.

Fj12ryder writes “Man, do people ever get riled up when you offer a differing experience. Believe it or not, some people really do have different experiences with the same product.

It's too bad you had a bad experience with the product. My experiences are different, go figure. Hey, it works for me, don't like it? Don't buy it, and I'm sure they'll be out of business in, oh say, another 50 years?”

An example of great “marketing”.. Do you remember the 1970s Memorex commercials where Ella Fitzgerald was recorded on to a Memorex audio tape and her performance on the tape was able to shatter a wine glass?
To refresh your mind take a look at the following link..

HERE

In reality it WAS NOT the quality of the tape that caused the glass to break. No, instead it was the FREQUENCY of the resonance of the glass. Ella only had to hit that frequency with enough volume and the glass would vibrate until it shattered.

Had nothing to do with how good the tape was, in fact I bought several of those tapes and discovered that they sounded horrible.. You could get just as good results using cheapo Five and Dime store tapes which were sold in a strip package of 6 for 99 cents..

If you want to dispute how they shattered the glass you should check out Mythbusters confirming that a glass can be shattered with a human voice..

HERE

Oiled air filters are in reality not a new idea, they HAVE been around well before paper filters in fact here is an article describing a oil bath filter for a farm tractor.

HERE

Here is a great video showing a typical oil bath filter used in tractors and even autos from 1910 up to late 1960s..

HERE

If they were so great, then why did auto manufacturers drop the use of those filters?

The reason was they were not as good at trapping dirt as the new to the scene paper filters at the time.

Granted a K$N is not technically a oil bath, BUT it is a oil WETTED filter and it works on the same principle of using a “media” that when dry is extremely inefficient at picking and holding dust and dirt out of the air drawn through it.

It is nothing more than a cotton cheese cloth material soaked in oil.. Take a good hard look at the cloth in a K$N, you WILL see lots of HOLES, the oil does not “bridge” those gaps..

Plenty of opportunity for fine dust and dirt to pass right through those holes until the filter grabs enough dirt to bridge the gaps.

And when the dirt does bridge the gaps you lose all of your supposed gains as in a clogged filter.

Wash and repeat the whole process.

Fast forward to modern day vehicles.. The manufacturers if they thought that they could edge out the competition with one or two HP more they WOULD be using oil wetted filters..

The truth is oil wetted filters do not and can not give any “gains” at normal RPMs at or below the redline of the engines. At the same time oil wetted filters can allow more dirt through.. It IS the nature of the beast.

Todays are built to even more tight tolerances (than early 1900 to 1970s), it wouldn’t take much road grit to do damage, old early 1900 “technology” does not belong on today’s modern day engines.

For the “dirt” bike argument.. Well, this is were a reusable filter could make sense.. Dirt bikes will by the very nature of the sport operate in a often very dusty environment..

One race could CLOG a paper filter and sometimes it would happen DURING the race.. The bike owner would be forced to change paper filters for each race or even be left in the dirt during the race. With a oil wetted filter they could just wash, reoil and save money.. But it comes at another cost.. Many dirt bike race owners are willing to take the chance they will have to tear down and rebuild/REPLACE the engine more often..

I would rather not take that chance with any of my vehicles engines, a short block now days will set you back $4K-$5K for gas and diesel you could see upwards of $10K for a short block not including R&R..

If you feel you must use a oil wetted filter then perhaps you should be driving a Model T or A which would be a better match to oil wetted filter technology..

Sorry to bust holes in your experiences, but just because you have never had an issue doesn’t mean that it really works, just means you are lucky.

My Dads 1980 truck has 350K miles on it, he has fully rebuilt that engine well over 10 times, each time lots of wear on the cylinder walls, completely shot rings and at least one time with scoring of the cylinder walls so much that it had to be bored out.

Contrast that to a 1970s car I drove which I put 300,000 on it and rebuilt the engine only twice. Each time only needed light honing of the cylinders and a set of rings.

The difference, my Dad has been running a K$N on that truck since the 1990s and I have always used paper filters..

For modern day engines, well I do have a 5.4 with 200K miles and doesn’t use a drop of oil between oil changes and it has never been rebuilt..

I am just warning folks that there are lots of hyped up aftermarket parts which really do not live up to the marketing hype (as in more HP or gas mileage) and even can cause damage..

K$N filters are in the same category as the fuel line magnets, vornado, carb spacers, ect, junk.

You cannot gain anything just by putting this filter in on these engines in spite of what well intentioned folks may say.

Sadly over the years I seen my Dad spend boat loads of money on his 1980 truck to make it perform better and get better mileage.. The money he spent on gimmicks and parts over the years he could have easily bought two brand new modern trucks loaded to the max and still had money leftover. Use to drive my mom crazy, can’t tell you all the stories of how his “improvements” ended up stranding them somewhere out of state.. several memorable ones was the fire under the hood several states from home, blown piston on another trip and multiple times spending most of the time during the trip with the hood up and heads off the engine..

If you want more power, you MUST treat the engine as a “system”, one part does not make a “system”, it takes lots of well thought out parts to increase HP and even then now days the gain is very small for the amount of money and time you will spend on it.

Save your money and spend it on a good meal where you will get your money’s worth of enjoyment!