2015 Ram 3500 TFL Ike Gauntlet

jus2shy wrote:


You have to agree that J2807 is a start. It's better than having in-house standards that are ambiguous at best among all truck makers. Totally unknown at worst. However, as with all things in life, there is room for improvement.

I know for a fact that some manufacturers in house standards, like Fords, were actually higher than the J2807 standards. Complying with J2807 actually lowered their standards which raised their tow ratings. The only major issue I have is that this J2807 is giving people a false sense of safety when the J2807 has nothing to do with safety. People think that just because a vehicle is J2807 rated to tow X amount then it can safely do so when the J2807 does not test for towing safety, it is only a universal standard of testing procedures.

jus2shy wrote:
I think all 3 trucks are mighty competent at 21,000 lbs for the duallies.

I will agree that these trucks towing 20k-24k seem more reasonable and think that that is where their max should be.

jus2shy wrote:
They even did the Ford and RAM at full load. I'm sure the Super Duty would hold a higher speed with 40 more horsepower on tap in 2015. The 2015+ Super Duty also has a much better exhaust brake setup.

Yeah I saw that although they were towing 22.6k and no where near 30k since that was before J2807 ratings and they were rated to tow less. After J2807 those trucks are rated to tow 30k. They did add another 3,800 lbs to that 22.6k trailer the Ram was towing since Ram gave it a 4,000 lbs higher tow rating that the Ford gave that F450 at the time. With a 26k trailer, they said that Ram did a top speed of 48 mph and the slowest of 28 mph. Now imagine adding another 4,000 lbs to that with the new J2807 standard ratings.

Shiner, may I suggest that you start a separate thread about the tow ratings?

It's obvious to me that these trucks are able to handle these loads, my only issue is that some people driving them shouldn't be behind the wheel of a Smartcar.

ShinerBock wrote:
To add to my last post. I also think they should add to the brake portion of the J2807. Instead of just a 35 to 0 mph stopping distance requirement, they should add being able to go down the same 11.4 mile hill(that they test going up) without brake failures or overheating the brakes. Better yet, being able to hold a certain speed going down the hill without any failures or overheated brakes too.

I also think they should add a stopping requirement with just the truck stopping the truck/trailer combo for those cases where the trailer brakes fail(yes, that has happened to me). Wouldn't you guys rather know before hand that the truck alone could stop X amount of weight if it needed to in an emergency rather than going down a 6% grade with the 30K lb trailer that the manufacturer said it can tow going by the J2807 because it does not have this as a requirement? Yes, all these things would probably lower a lot of tow ratings for some trucks, but is that necessarily a bad thing? After all, having higher standards would force manufacturers to improve to meet them and what is so wrong with that?

You have to agree that J2807 is a start. It's better than having in-house standards that are ambiguous at best among all truck makers. Totally unknown at worst. However, as with all things in life, there is room for improvement. Did you by chance ever check out the test that pickuptrucks.com did in 2014? They do a much better job of testing evenly among all the manufacturers and getting solid numbers up for everyone to see: Pickuptrucks.com test. I think all 3 trucks are mighty competent at 21,000 lbs for the duallies.

They even did the Ford and RAM at full load. I'm sure the Super Duty would hold a higher speed with 40 more horsepower on tap in 2015. The 2015+ Super Duty also has a much better exhaust brake setup.

They should put these trucks on Teton Pass and see how that 21k trailer would do. That would be dangerous though. Great job by the Ram and that a lot of weight up that mountain. I've towed it twice.

To add to my last post. I also think they should add to the brake portion of the J2807. Instead of just a 35 to 0 mph stopping distance requirement, they should add being able to go down the same 11.4 mile hill(that they test going up) without brake failures or overheating the brakes. Better yet, being able to hold a certain speed going down the hill without any failures or overheated brakes too.

I also think they should add a stopping requirement with just the truck stopping the truck/trailer combo for those cases where the trailer brakes fail(yes, that has happened to me). Wouldn't you guys rather know before hand that the truck alone could stop X amount of weight if it needed to in an emergency rather than going down a 6% grade with the 30K lb trailer that the manufacturer said it can tow going by the J2807 because it does not have this as a requirement? Yes, all these things would probably lower a lot of tow ratings for some trucks, but is that necessarily a bad thing? After all, having higher standards would force manufacturers to improve to meet them and what is so wrong with that?

45Ricochet wrote:

No threat whatsoever meant, I apologize if it came out that way. Your post just seemed to me anyway to imply that this truck in this video wasn't equipped to handle this amount of weight.

My post of me thinking that this 30k lb tow rating pissing contest that Ford and Ram are in right now just to say the are "best in class" is ridiculous is my opinion. Am I not allowed to have that here?

45Ricochet wrote:
That's where your false information came into effect.

How is my opinion false? It is my opinion.

45Ricochet wrote:
That Ram was J2807 compliant to the weights being towed.

I do not totally agree with the J2807 as I think it should be more strict than it is like raising the speed limit, time, and braking requirements. The J2807 has nothing to do with safety like most think it does and I think Pickuptrucks.com said it best when they said "Following J2807 standards means that the truck maker followed a certain set of testing procedures, not whether higher or lower numbers are more or less safe." - http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2013/10/not-so-fast-toyota-j2807-is-not-about-safety.html

Also, just because a manufacturers DRW passed the J2807 test of being able to tow a certain weight up a 5% grade hill at 35 mph(yes that is the minimum speed for duallies) does not mean said manufacturer has to rate it that high. They can rate it for less which I think they should(<--- again, my opinion). Although I think it is funny that many used to cry foul on manufacturers tow rating before J2807, but now that they are done by the j2807 standard and are higher than before, not one complaint.

I also don't get why some are against a more strict tow standard. Would it really affect you in a bad way if the 30k lb tow ratings were lowered to say 25k lbs because a new standard is set to being able to tow up a 5% grade at 45 mph instead of 35 mph for DRW trucks? Or having the 0-30 mph time for DRW lowered to 12 seconds instead of 14 seconds? Seriously, what will it hurt anyone to raise the standards besides having lower and more reasonable tow ratings. How many of you guys actually tow 30k lbs in your 350/3500 anyways to even care for it being that high?

45Ricochet wrote:
My eat you up alive comment had more to do with the 250/2500 crowd towing way over their ratings and tell everyone their truck is the same as a 350/3500 dually :W

I will agree with you that a SRW 250/2500 is no DRW 350/3500, but I will debate that the payload ratings on the 250/2500 are the way they are more because it is being limited by it's DOT class than its actual handling ability.

45Ricochet wrote:
So again welcome to the site, like your interest but better stay straight with info or F250/2500 guy will call you out.

Thank you. Although I welcome a good debate.

NC Hauler wrote:

ShinerBock wrote:

ib516 wrote:

Why?

Then Ford shouldn't rate their F450 to tow 30,000# either. It's all a contest by the respective advertising departments - no matter the brand. They ALL do it - Ford, GM, and RAM.

I am with you that Ford(or any brand) shouldn't rate it that high either which is why I said this.....

ShinerBock wrote:

That is fine, I don't think trucks like that should be towing 30,000 lbs in the first place. That should be left to medium duty commercial trucks. This "30,000 lbs towing battle" that Ford and Ram are doing is senseless which is why I applaud GM for staying out of it.

..... in this thread last week.

GM couldn't compete because their 3500 DRW wasn't rated high enough to compete with the Ram 3500 and the Ford F350 in the 30,000# weight competition.....Thus the reason they didn't compete...Though they could have competed with the weight in this test. No Reason for GM to compete, they've beaten both Ford and Ram in head to head test year after year. They really don't have anything to prove....The Ford with more HP and TQ should easily, I would think, win this competition..I didn't watch the link, but didn't buy my truck to see who could get to the top of the mountain first, or I would have stayed with Chevy if that had been what I was out for..

I think GM is standing on the sidelines and got out of the HP/TQ/Weight races because the weaker Allison 1000 tranny is maxed out! Chris

45Ricochet wrote:

ShinerBock wrote:

45Ricochet wrote:

New member warning, we'll eat you up alive IF you continue to post false information.

1) Is this a threat?

2) What false info?

No threat whatsoever meant, I apologize if it came out that way. Your post just seemed to me anyway to imply that this truck in this video wasn't equipped to handle this amount of weight.
That's where your false information came into effect. That Ram was J2807 compliant to the weights being towed. Ford 350 isn't, till next year anyway :W
My eat you up alive comment had more to do with the 250/2500 crowd towing way over their ratings and tell everyone their truck is the same as a 350/3500 dually :W
So again welcome to the site, like your interest but better stay straight with info or F250/2500 guy will call you out.
How's that Troy? Dang forgot to call you a name. Ol well Easter weekend I suppose....

Well said Captain... :W

BTW... It's ok if a driver doesn't feel comfortable towing the max rated load just because it has a SAE J2807 rating.

ShinerBock wrote:

45Ricochet wrote:

New member warning, we'll eat you up alive IF you continue to post false information.

1) Is this a threat?

2) What false info?

No threat whatsoever meant, I apologize if it came out that way. Your post just seemed to me anyway to imply that this truck in this video wasn't equipped to handle this amount of weight.
That's where your false information came into effect. That Ram was J2807 compliant to the weights being towed. Ford 350 isn't, till next year anyway :W
My eat you up alive comment had more to do with the 250/2500 crowd towing way over their ratings and tell everyone their truck is the same as a 350/3500 dually :W
So again welcome to the site, like your interest but better stay straight with info or F250/2500 guy will call you out.
How's that Troy? Dang forgot to call you a name. Ol well Easter weekend I suppose....