Forum Discussion
jus2shy wrote:
OK, has nobody noticed that in the night vision shots, you can see a glow emanating from the engine bay through the wheel well? I almost wonder if the pipes are glowing red with the tow test they're putting down. I wouldn't be surprised, but they certainly are wringing her out. It also shows that They're meeting the SAE J standard for towing. The truck slowed down by the top of the hill, but it maintained above the minimum 35mph speed it needed to. But it did slowdown at max GCWR.
Good on Ford. The 450 is finally the monster it should be.
?? FINALLY ??
I beg to differ. The F450 has been a monster again since 2015 when they went back to the 10 lug axles. Sure there was a hiatus from 2011-2014 when it was a glorified F350, but that ended a couple model years ago. Anyone who thinks the 2015+ F450's are not the true towing kings for any 5th wheel RV out there, have either never driven one, or never looked under one.
I was actually a little disappointed that they dropped the S130 axle in 2017, but I guess I can understand why with the new aluminum M300 weight savings, but I'd rather have the 12.2" Dia gears from the S130 personally.
And for those saying the F450 may have a stout rear axle but is still limited by the tires/springs?....Really? Where is this supposed weak link? Is it the G-rated 19.5" tires that come stock rated for 15000lbs on the rear?? Or the extra thick leaf springs unique to the F450?? Oh I know, it must be the massive brakes that come on the F450 right??
All the naysayers should just be happy that Ford continues to push the technology/capabilities forward on these trucks, it will eventually be adopted by the competition providing better trucks no matter which brand you choose.- It's very impressive performance for sure. I'll be even more impressed if it can go 300k plus miles without any major engine work like some of the competition can!
- Actually if you totally ignored all the tow ratings and hooked that 30,000 lb trailer behind two Cummins powered Rams; one with the 4:10 gears the other with 3;73 gears I am almost certain the 3;73 equipped truck would be able to pull that hill in 2nd gear and do it at a higher speed than the 4:10 equipped truck.
Me Again wrote:
4x4ord wrote:
jims1 wrote:
I would like to see a 5th wheel at 20000lbs behind it. Something with 60-70sqft of frontal area. Not knocking it, but test it for the RV user.
If the hill averages a. 7% grade the test would have required lifting about 38000 lbs up about 2900 ft of elevation gain in 11 1/2 minutes. That alone required 290 rear wheel HP. In addition the truck required HP to overcome rolling and wind resistance which at 40 mph would likely be another 50 HP or so. So in order to accomplish what it did it would have been putting about 340 to the pavement for the entire 11 1/2 minutes. At 2500 rpm the crankshaft HP of that Powerstroke should be about 390 HP.
Pulling a 20,000 lb RV up the hill at the same speed would have required about 270 rear wheel HP.
Now add in getting there 15-20 second before the other guy! This is a race you know!
You don't support the SAE J standard?Me Again wrote:
Now add in getting there 15-20 second before the other guy! This is a race you know!
It's a little more than 15-20 seconds. I figure the Ram will pull that same trailer up the hill in about 13 and a half minutes but it would have to be pulled down to second to do it. In 3rd gear it would take longer. If the Ford had been manually pulled down into 3rd sooner it would have made better time.
I pulled my 15000 lb RV up a steep grade yesterday. The truck slowed to about 50 mph before I manually dropped it to 3rd gear. It then accelerated to 55 mph for the rest of the grade.4x4ord wrote:
jims1 wrote:
I would like to see a 5th wheel at 20000lbs behind it. Something with 60-70sqft of frontal area. Not knocking it, but test it for the RV user.
If the hill averages a. 7% grade the test would have required lifting about 38000 lbs up about 2900 ft of elevation gain in 11 1/2 minutes. That alone required 290 rear wheel HP. In addition the truck required HP to overcome rolling and wind resistance which at 40 mph would likely be another 50 HP or so. So in order to accomplish what it did it would have been putting about 340 to the pavement for the entire 11 1/2 minutes. At 2500 rpm the crankshaft HP of that Powerstroke should be about 390 HP.
Pulling a 20,000 lb RV up the hill at the same speed would have required about 270 rear wheel HP.
Now add in getting there 15-20 second before the other guy! This is a race you know!jims1 wrote:
I would like to see a 5th wheel at 20000lbs behind it. Something with 60-70sqft of frontal area. Not knocking it, but test it for the RV user.
The truck alone is 50-70 depending upon how out fitted. A BIG 5w with a bedroom slide is typically in the 110-120 total sw ft of frontal area. My old TT was 90! One could notice it vs when i pulled a 9500 lbs bobcat behind it. It took more HP to move the 15K gcw TT than the 18K equipment trailer setup by 20-25HP. But 50HP to hold 60 up ea 1% grade vs 45 with the TT. So after about 3%, i was faster with the tt than the equipment trailer. I also got better mileage with the ET than the TT by about 1mpg. I made a trip across the state of washington with the eT and my small trackhoe. 15K same as TT, made 2 mpg better, pulled most of the grade a gear taller, and 7-10 mph faster.
Frontal area does make a difference in how well one will pull.
Martyjims1 wrote:
I would like to see a 5th wheel at 20000lbs behind it. Something with 60-70sqft of frontal area. Not knocking it, but test it for the RV user.
If the hill averages a. 7% grade the test would have required lifting about 38000 lbs up about 2900 ft of elevation gain in 11 1/2 minutes. That alone required 290 rear wheel HP. In addition the truck required HP to overcome rolling and wind resistance which at 40 mph would likely be another 50 HP or so. So in order to accomplish what it did it would have been putting about 340 to the pavement for the entire 11 1/2 minutes. At 2500 rpm the crankshaft HP of that Powerstroke should be about 390 HP.
Pulling a 20,000 lb RV up the hill at the same speed would have required about 270 rear wheel HP.d rocs wrote:
JIMNLIN wrote:
Pulling 30000 lb trailer is much tougher on a truck than pulling any rv trailer. The vast majority of rv trailers don't weigh anywhere close to that kind of weight. No doubt this truck with the power the 6.7 engine puts out will have no problems with any rv trailer.
The F450 pickup may be popular with rv transport folks or rv owners but serious long term hotshot work this truck simply doesn't have the rear axle capacity needed to make money.
Now the older F450 with those big 11000 RAWR numbers allowed more payload...more payload = more money.
If your looked at the axle tag on that F450, think you'll find it has a Dana 130. GAWR: 16,000 lbs. and GCWR: 40,000 lbs.
Don't know what Ford de-rates it to on the 2017.
Yeah its a good stout axle.......
However the axle is still limited by the tires/wheels and rear spring package Ford uses on them.- OK, has nobody noticed that in the night vision shots, you can see a glow emanating from the engine bay through the wheel well? I almost wonder if the pipes are glowing red with the tow test they're putting down. I wouldn't be surprised, but they certainly are wringing her out. It also shows that They're meeting the SAE J standard for towing. The truck slowed down by the top of the hill, but it maintained above the minimum 35mph speed it needed to. But it did slowdown at max GCWR.
Good on Ford. The 450 is finally the monster it should be.
