Forum Discussion
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- This is a Chargepoint dual 32 amp head at one of the strip malls near us. Although this one is free and is used as a loss leader to get people to their restaurants etc (works for us) many of the chargepoint sites are pay per use with a credit card or prepaid RFID card. Ideal for places where you will be for a few hours like theaters, outlet malls etc. Would work well for campgrounds once the various companies like Rivian Ford and Tesla start building EV trucks. Start with a couple, add as required. They are not crazy expensive but about three times what you pay at home. We occasionally use these and have a prepaid RFID card but usually find ourselves at the ones that are used as a loss leader for restaurants, some malls etc. Handy when away from your home area or on road trips. Most of the time we just charge at home. Cheap.
ShinerBock wrote:
Reisender wrote:
It is a valid concern Shiner but as you and I have discussed infrastructure is not static. Adding a half dozen J1772 32 amp Level 2 locations would probably suffice for the next couple decades and would be compatible with every EV. Probably just get a company like ChargePoint to put them in and then just share the profit. Maybe do it modular. A couple at first, a couple more when they get busy etc. ChargePoint is good at that kind of thing. I noticed on one of my appraisal trips that one of the campgrounds near Kelowna put a clipper creek 40 amp unit in last year. Probably the first campground close to us with a permanent J1772.
But what about getting power to these chargers? The more chargers they add, the more they need to upgrade the lines going to these chargers. You are not dealing with just one utility company here. You are dealing with hundreds of independent entities with different budgets, manpower, supplies, priorities, and so on. Then you have the cost to upgrade these lines which will go to the end user causing their electric bill to increase. The ones this will hurt the most will be the poor.
All I am saying is that it is not as simple as some tend to think and you these changes will require more than just putting in a charger and will effect more than just the EV owner.
Agreed, that is why I say infrastructure is not static. It is constantly evolving. Take the Clipper creek unit in my pictures. That campground made a decision to spend probably a few grand on putting that unit in. At this point I don't think it draws a lot of clientele but who knows in the future. They have a start though. That park is kind of a summer Vacation park with lots of permanents on leased lots. My guess is there are a bunch of owners/leasers with EV's (common in this area) and they got together and put it in. Just a guess. Surprisingly it is not a pay unit. Essentially free. That is the advantage of going with a company like chargepoint. They do all the work and just cut you in on the profits.- ShinerBockExplorer
Reisender wrote:
It is a valid concern Shiner but as you and I have discussed infrastructure is not static. Adding a half dozen J1772 32 amp Level 2 locations would probably suffice for the next couple decades and would be compatible with every EV. Probably just get a company like ChargePoint to put them in and then just share the profit. Maybe do it modular. A couple at first, a couple more when they get busy etc. ChargePoint is good at that kind of thing. I noticed on one of my appraisal trips that one of the campgrounds near Kelowna put a clipper creek 40 amp unit in last year. Probably the first campground close to us with a permanent J1772.
But what about getting power to these chargers? The more chargers they add, the more they need to upgrade the lines going to these chargers. You are not dealing with just one utility company here. You are dealing with hundreds of independent entities with different budgets, manpower, supplies, priorities, and so on. Then you have the cost to upgrade these lines which will go to the end user causing their electric bill to increase. The ones this will hurt the most will be the poor.
All I am saying is that it is not as simple as some tend to think and you these changes will require more than just putting in a charger and will effect more than just the EV owner. ShinerBock wrote:
Reisender wrote:
valhalla360 wrote:
Yosemite Sam1 wrote:
My wish list is modest, a 240v electrical connection in public campsites.
Works great when there are 3 EVs in a 200 site park and you can have it now by getting a 50amp site.
But for wide scale EV usage...If you've ever been to a park on a hot summer weekend when everyone is running their air/con, you know that power goes out regularly.
Your average draw for air/con is usually around 11-12amp (single air/con on 30amp) or 22-24amp (dual air/con on 50amp sites).
Now imagine adding in 100 sites with EVs pulling the max amperage to charge up big battery packs regardless of the weather and run the numbers...and don't tell us how you can reduce the draw by setting it lower...you and I both know people will use as much as they can get away with until there are outages and even then, if they want to travel the next day, they will continue to bump up against those limits causing outages.
One of the parks we stay at has trouble on peak summer weekends (we bring our generator to account for this). Owner found out it was going to be upwards of $50k to upgrade his power feed to fix the problem. This didn't include rewiring the entire camp just the feed from the road to his main distribution panel. To add in EV charging at most sites, you would have to get an even bigger feed upgrade at even higher price. I'm betting you wouldn't be the first to step up and pay for it when most don't need it.
Meh. People find problems where there aren’t energy. People driving EV’s are not evil. They just like the driving experience, performance, convenience. Most will obey the rules just like most people do. The campground director can simply say charging at designated sites only etc. Not a big deal now, won’t be then.
He actually has a logical point. It is not a big deal now because there are so few out there. But imagine half of the people in a 100 site park needing to charge for the night. They would either have to wait their turn and switch out during the night or upgrade the camp wiring along with the utility wiring from the power plant to the camp for the amount of energy required. It may also require additional substations depending on how far it is to push that much electricity to places far from the power plant.
It is a valid concern Shiner but as you and I have discussed infrastructure is not static. Adding a half dozen J1772 32 amp Level 2 locations would probably suffice for the next couple decades and would be compatible with every EV. Probably just get a company like ChargePoint to put them in and then just share the profit. Maybe do it modular. A couple at first, a couple more when they get busy etc. ChargePoint is good at that kind of thing. I noticed on one of my appraisal trips that one of the campgrounds near Kelowna put a clipper creek 40 amp unit in last year. Probably the first campground close to us with a permanent J1772. We were invited to use it for the hour or so we were there visiting. Like 40 km from our house. Never knew it was there. :) It is on the map though.- ShinerBockExplorer
Reisender wrote:
valhalla360 wrote:
Yosemite Sam1 wrote:
My wish list is modest, a 240v electrical connection in public campsites.
Works great when there are 3 EVs in a 200 site park and you can have it now by getting a 50amp site.
But for wide scale EV usage...If you've ever been to a park on a hot summer weekend when everyone is running their air/con, you know that power goes out regularly.
Your average draw for air/con is usually around 11-12amp (single air/con on 30amp) or 22-24amp (dual air/con on 50amp sites).
Now imagine adding in 100 sites with EVs pulling the max amperage to charge up big battery packs regardless of the weather and run the numbers...and don't tell us how you can reduce the draw by setting it lower...you and I both know people will use as much as they can get away with until there are outages and even then, if they want to travel the next day, they will continue to bump up against those limits causing outages.
One of the parks we stay at has trouble on peak summer weekends (we bring our generator to account for this). Owner found out it was going to be upwards of $50k to upgrade his power feed to fix the problem. This didn't include rewiring the entire camp just the feed from the road to his main distribution panel. To add in EV charging at most sites, you would have to get an even bigger feed upgrade at even higher price. I'm betting you wouldn't be the first to step up and pay for it when most don't need it.
Meh. People find problems where there aren’t energy. People driving EV’s are not evil. They just like the driving experience, performance, convenience. Most will obey the rules just like most people do. The campground director can simply say charging at designated sites only etc. Not a big deal now, won’t be then.
He actually has a logical point. It is not a big deal now because there are so few out there. But imagine half of the people in a 100 site park needing to charge for the night. They would either have to wait their turn and switch out during the night or upgrade the camp wiring along with the utility wiring from the power plant to the camp for the amount of energy required. It may also require additional substations depending on how far it is to push that much electricity to places far from the power plant. - ShinerBockExplorer
Yosemite Sam1 wrote:
If we acknowledge your grievance that your very tender feelings was hurt, will you promise that your post will be useful and intelligent henceforth?
My feelings weren't hurt. I don't care what you call me. I was just warning the guy of what will happen when he posts anything logical or rational that could be perceived as negative about the subject. valhalla360 wrote:
Yosemite Sam1 wrote:
My wish list is modest, a 240v electrical connection in public campsites.
Works great when there are 3 EVs in a 200 site park and you can have it now by getting a 50amp site.
But for wide scale EV usage...If you've ever been to a park on a hot summer weekend when everyone is running their air/con, you know that power goes out regularly.
Your average draw for air/con is usually around 11-12amp (single air/con on 30amp) or 22-24amp (dual air/con on 50amp sites).
Now imagine adding in 100 sites with EVs pulling the max amperage to charge up big battery packs regardless of the weather and run the numbers...and don't tell us how you can reduce the draw by setting it lower...you and I both know people will use as much as they can get away with until there are outages and even then, if they want to travel the next day, they will continue to bump up against those limits causing outages.
One of the parks we stay at has trouble on peak summer weekends (we bring our generator to account for this). Owner found out it was going to be upwards of $50k to upgrade his power feed to fix the problem. This didn't include rewiring the entire camp just the feed from the road to his main distribution panel. To add in EV charging at most sites, you would have to get an even bigger feed upgrade at even higher price. I'm betting you wouldn't be the first to step up and pay for it when most don't need it.
Meh. People find problems where there aren’t any. People driving EV’s are not evil. They just like the driving experience, performance, convenience. Most will obey the rules just like most people do. The campground director can simply say charging at designated sites only etc. Not a big deal now, won’t be then.- valhalla360Navigator
Yosemite Sam1 wrote:
My wish list is modest, a 240v electrical connection in public campsites.
Works great when there are 3 EVs in a 200 site park and you can have it now by getting a 50amp site.
But for wide scale EV usage...If you've ever been to a park on a hot summer weekend when everyone is running their air/con, you know that power goes out regularly.
Your average draw for air/con is usually around 11-12amp (single air/con on 30amp) or 22-24amp (dual air/con on 50amp sites).
Now imagine adding in 100 sites with EVs pulling the max amperage to charge up big battery packs regardless of the weather and run the numbers...and don't tell us how you can reduce the draw by setting it lower...you and I both know people will use as much as they can get away with until there are outages and even then, if they want to travel the next day, they will continue to bump up against those limits causing outages.
One of the parks we stay at has trouble on peak summer weekends (we bring our generator to account for this). Owner found out it was going to be upwards of $50k to upgrade his power feed to fix the problem. This didn't include rewiring the entire camp just the feed from the road to his main distribution panel. To add in EV charging at most sites, you would have to get an even bigger feed upgrade at even higher price. I'm betting you wouldn't be the first to step up and pay for it when most don't need it. - valhalla360Navigator
pitch wrote:
In 2019 coal provided 27.4% of electricity generated in the US. I don't recall if anyone has ever claimed the electric transportation was zero pollution..
Zero emissions from the unit but not zero impact over all.
Wake up you old farts,electricity is the power source of the future!
Pretty much everyone pushing EVs and all the programs and propaganda simply say "zero emissions" with no mention that it is specific to emissions at the vehicle.
You are adding the clarification as the EV community has been caught out in a lie. - pitchExplorer II
K Charles wrote:
If most of the charging stations get their power from coal is it still zero pollution?
In 2019 coal provided 27.4% of electricity generated in the US. I don't recall if anyone has ever claimed the electric transportation was zero pollution..
Zero emissions from the unit but not zero impact over all.
Wake up you old farts,electricity is the power source of the future!
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