Electric over hydraulic - anyone using them ?
What is good and what is bad about them ?
Forum Discussion
n0arp wrote:
I will add that my brakes design cannot be very old, as the rotors have the inductor ring for antilock brakes.Huntindog wrote:
n0arp wrote:
Huntindog wrote:
My new Momentum has disc brakes. The difference is HUGE!
I will never go back to drums. They are 1950s technology.
A relic of the past. And I will note, that you cannot get parts for them at Autozone either.
The calipers are all based on old GM designs for Kodiak/Titan brakes. If those are who make the ones on your Momentum, you certainly can at least get all caliper components (including entire calipers, pins, seals and pads) from Autozone/NAPA/Oreilly/etc. But you have to use a cross-reference and not just tell them they're for a GD Momentum...
Other parts, like the hub assemblies, especially if integrated on your particular model, and the controller/pump assembly, aren't going to be stocked. But those are probably less likely to require rushed parts for maintenance/repair.
I may have something different than what you are thinking of.
My 8000# Dexter axles have Dexter 4 piston calipers. They are not the sliding design. They bolt on to the axles as a solid one piece unit.
Sounds nice. Titan/Kodiak are big for aftermarket. Dexter bought them a couple years ago, but looks like they're separate product lines for now. Maybe if Dexter continues to produce the ones you have, increased adoption will drive increased parts info/availability.- This entire discussion points to the need for travelers to not depend on a parts store or anyone else to look up or come up with part numbers.
You should have a "manual" composed of all the install and repair manuals for everything on an RV and the tow vehicle, and for things like caliper kits, pads, (for parts that are GM based, determine the part numbers ahead of time for sure). Get cross reference lists and include them. Determine what hoses you would need, find part numbers from various auto parts stores. Part numbers for wheel bearings and races, seals, etc are also handy. With Timken, there are SET numbers for many of the bearing and race combinations, so you don't have to purchase separate parts (which is the norm at industrial suppliers). Also know good overnight sources of parts. I find the best deals on many wheel bearings and seals are from Summit Racing. They carry the SET numbers, and a couple of different seals (yes, you need the National seal number, not that propriety Dexter seal number, again, figure this out ahead of time)
On your tow vehicle do the same thing, find part numbers (correct numbers) for things like serpentine belts (yours may have different belts depending on options, or a cutoff production date where changes were made) and things that destroy belts like idler pulleys and tensioners. Get numbers for several major brands
One way to gather some of this information is the Gates web site, via their VIN decoder. Enter your VIN number, get the list, PRINT IT OUT file it in your "manual" (if going digital, print it to a PDF file for your thumbdrive)....
Gates VIN decoder for belts, hoses, and other items.
Saw a Youtube video the other day where a female truck camper adventurer/hiker had a serpentine belt fail. She got towed to a very nearby town and they ordered in the belt and the tensioner that had caused the belt failure, and sure enough the belt was the wrong one, thankfully they were able to get the correct belt in an hour or so.
Same goes for RV appliances and components that could ruin a trip if failed.
Do all of this AT HOME while you have the luxury of TIME.
Does this sound over the top? to me its cheap insurance that will minimize the time you are stranded and help to get things fixed right away. Look at it as an INVESTMENT in your future travels.
I did all of this when I had a 2006 Sprinter chassis motorhome (a 2007 Winnebago View) and I had complete digital PDF files of the Dodge shop and parts manuals, all of the Winnebago wiring diagrams and installation drawings, plumbing drawings, etc. I had everything digitized and stored on a thumb drive. That thumb drive stayed on the MH all the time in the pouch with the WBO manuals. I had downloaded repair manuals for many of the appliances also.
Know your vehicle. The Sprinter used a transmission fluid that is difficult to source, brake fluid that is quite difficult to source, and filters that not everyone carries. I carried a spare fuel filter and engine oil filter. In addition, I carried the original serpentine belt which I had removed. The Gates version of the belt was way too long, the Dayco belt was not much better (both put the tensioner near the end of its travel) and I had ordered a Continental/ContiTech belt that was an exact replacement for the original.
Also, carry tools that are unusual, that you may need, and make sure they fit. I carried a dipstick for the transmission on the Sprinter, it is a shop tool and CANNOT be left in the transmission, so I kept it stored in the motorhome.
About two weeks ago, on the way home from Wal-Mart, I came across a young couple with a travel trailer and a blown tire. The trailer was used, but fairly new, and they had cleared the main road and turned off at an intersection onto a side road. They were only a couple of miles from home, but had NO SPARE. They were returning from their first trip, a short shakedown cruise to a nearby lake. I offered to go home and get a spare tire and wheel I knew would fit, I was about 15 minutes from home, but they had called a friend who was pulling the spare from a boat trailer and bringing it. The fellow had no idea about jacking it but I suggested the truck jack which had a saddle that fit the axle perfectly and a lug wrench that fit the lug nuts (much to his surprise), I bid them farewell and went on my way, but this goes to show you, BE PREPARED ahead of time, its gonna happen.
This happened out in the country, rural area, and the thing that surprised me the most was the number of people that pulled over to check and see if they needed help, probably 6 or 7 in the ten minutes or so I was there.
Charles Huntindog wrote:
n0arp wrote:
Huntindog wrote:
My new Momentum has disc brakes. The difference is HUGE!
I will never go back to drums. They are 1950s technology.
A relic of the past. And I will note, that you cannot get parts for them at Autozone either.
The calipers are all based on old GM designs for Kodiak/Titan brakes. If those are who make the ones on your Momentum, you certainly can at least get all caliper components (including entire calipers, pins, seals and pads) from Autozone/NAPA/Oreilly/etc. But you have to use a cross-reference and not just tell them they're for a GD Momentum...
Other parts, like the hub assemblies, especially if integrated on your particular model, and the controller/pump assembly, aren't going to be stocked. But those are probably less likely to require rushed parts for maintenance/repair.
I may have something different than what you are thinking of.
My 8000# Dexter axles have Dexter 4 piston calipers. They are not the sliding design. They bolt on to the axles as a solid one piece unit.
Sounds nice. Titan/Kodiak are big for aftermarket. Dexter bought them a couple years ago, but looks like they're separate product lines for now. Maybe if Dexter continues to produce the ones you have, increased adoption will drive increased parts info/availability.n0arp wrote:
Huntindog wrote:
My new Momentum has disc brakes. The difference is HUGE!
I will never go back to drums. They are 1950s technology.
A relic of the past. And I will note, that you cannot get parts for them at Autozone either.
The calipers are all based on old GM designs for Kodiak/Titan brakes. If those are who make the ones on your Momentum, you certainly can at least get all caliper components (including entire calipers, pins, seals and pads) from Autozone/NAPA/Oreilly/etc. But you have to use a cross-reference and not just tell them they're for a GD Momentum...
Other parts, like the hub assemblies, especially if integrated on your particular model, and the controller/pump assembly, aren't going to be stocked. But those are probably less likely to require rushed parts for maintenance/repair.
I may have something different than what you are thinking of.
My 8000# Dexter axles have Dexter 4 piston calipers. They are not the sliding design. They bolt on to the axles as a solid one piece unit.- I did my own install of Performance brakes, round numbers 2K for the kit 1k for 2 day install if you have it done. I did mine in two days at home, had a question during install, called an had my answer from the first one answered the phone. BTW: 7K axle upgraded to 8K for $65.00 (Larger outer bearing 9/16" studs vs 1/2" and lug nuts) Not any one here that has not been cut off or had to stand on brakes hoping you'll get stopped before you hit some idiot. 36ft 5W 13,500lbs best upgrade and I'll never go back to drums.
- I had disc brakes installed by performance brakes. They came to my house did the entire install in my driveway.
As mentioned night and day difference. I will never go back to drum/magnetbrakes again. The old adage the trailer brakes stop the trailer comes closer to reality with a disc brake upgrade.
I am sure those magnetic brakes were not stopping the trailer! Huntindog wrote:
My new Momentum has disc brakes. The difference is HUGE!
I will never go back to drums. They are 1950s technology.
A relic of the past. And I will note, that you cannot get parts for them at Autozone either.
The calipers are all based on old GM designs for Kodiak/Titan brakes. If those are who make the ones on your Momentum, you certainly can at least get all caliper components (including entire calipers, pins, seals and pads) from Autozone/NAPA/Oreilly/etc. But you have to use a cross-reference and not just tell them they're for a GD Momentum...
Other parts, like the hub assemblies, especially if integrated on your particular model, and the controller/pump assembly, aren't going to be stocked. But those are probably less likely to require rushed parts for maintenance/repair.- My new Momentum has disc brakes. The difference is HUGE!
I will never go back to drums. They are 1950s technology.
A relic of the past. And I will note, that you cannot get parts for them at Autozone either. - As you can see hydro brakes are a major install, cost, complexity etc...
How big of a trailer are you towing down mountains all the time?
Do you own a diesel truck? Spend your money on exhaust brakes instead.
Have you or can you considered/add bigger drums? if they will fit in the wheels, or put on bigger wheels so you can install bigger drums.
Yes, as in your car, disc should be superior, but only if necessary.... n0arp wrote:
O'Reilly (just one example) stocks generic "BrakeBest" hoses that are universal fitment. The one closest to me in a small town in NW Indiana, shows that they have 71 different ones in stock for in-store pickup today. Go to the store and lay eyes on them, and you'll find what you need. I checked out the selection when buying spare parts to carry in my toolbox a while back. Plenty of valid options as I was able to assemble a kit from what they had on hand.
I found all new seals for one of my calipers at a NAPA in West Yellowstone, MT.
I completely agree with you on redundancy. If you lose the EoH controller/pump or a line or even a seal, you will lose your brakes. Fortunately those failures are rare, and the increased stopping power and control more or less justifies it for me. I experienced one failure in five years and 20-25K miles, which is probably one too many. Luckily, I noticed it during a routine brake test at slow speed after hooking up, and (I believe) it was due to dirt making its way into the crevice behind the pad due to extended use on dirt/unimproved roads and lands.
There are ways to mitigate most of those issues and perform roadside repairs (anything excluding complete controller/pump failure). Again, I would never consider going back to drum brakes on a 16+K trailer. I opted to carry a handful of spare parts to address any issue short of a complete pump or hub failure.
No Oriely around me, have a couple of NAPA stores but I could simply buy a new trailer for the prices they charge.. Last time I bought anything at a NAPA was a couple of incandescent taillight bulbs, yeah $5 later for a pack of 2, could have bought those at WM for $1.99 but it would have cost $3 in fuel to run to WM..
The box autoparts stores near to me all rely on their computer systems, they have zero ways to simply browse for say brake hose..
As far as drums goes, I also have a 10K GVW flatbed trailer which has drums, it has 5,200 lb axles, I have had loads in excess of 12K lbs on that trailer and have never had issues with not enough brakes or brake fade. Last summer I moved 2 cords of green Oak (nearly 8K lbs), that was eight 40" across "rounds" that were 20" tall plus my tractor with FEL and backhoe (4K lbs)Tractor FEL is rated 980 lbs lift and the FEL was barely able to lift those rounds. Trailer weighs empty 2700 lbs (14K+ lbs load and trailer combined!) and still only had my brake controller set to 5.5 out of 10 for gain and never felt like the trailer brakes were not working or effective. Have to take a couple of massive steep hills for some of the fire wood loads I haul on a regular basis.
So, yeah, I have experienced loads darn near 16K lbs on a trailer with drum brakes that are technically only good for 10.5K lbs..
Good quality wiring to the brakes also makes a difference, wouldn't want to try that with 14 ga wiring..
If one has drums and is looking for better braking, try running heavier wire first, much cheaper and will drastically improve braking performance.
