New to RVs

Cotay wrote:

bikendan wrote:
i guess we should just ignore that any hybrid's frontal area, will exceed every minivan's manufacturer maximum amount.:R
except the one minivan truly capable of towing a hybrid, the Astro/Safari with the 4.3 Vortec built on a ladder frame chassis.

Interstingly, my Expy EL suggests a frontal area of 60 sq ft. Our small HTT exceeds that too.

luckily, you have a v-8 and a rear end, with low gear ratios, that has enough torque to overcome the air resistance, whereas most minivans only have 3L v-6 with high gear ratios.

I bought a 2001 Accord, because I wanted to be one of those guys who can brag about having several hundred thousand miles on a vehicle. Well, 6 transmissions in under 60,000 miles and we sold it. I went through a long drawn out process with Honda to get them to treat me fairly, but they gave me the shaft basically.

Hoosierdaddy47 wrote:

Cotay wrote:

dwright1969 wrote:
Thanks for all the input guys. I should have come here first. You did "scare the bejeebers out of me":) but that's a good thing. I'm not normally an impulsive person and tend to over-research before making even a minor purchase. I have been in contact with the dealership and this is what they are willing to do for me: I can take a test tow of a very similar trailer and go over some local hills with it to see how it feels. I plan to put some weight in the mini-van for this test. If I am not comfortable they are willing to let me purchase something else. I'm feeling much better. If I do feel comfortable with it then I will complete the purchase and most likely be in the market for a new tow vehicle late next year.

Sigh...deep breaths...

DWright,

If you do your math and know that you will not ever dry camp, then you can push a 3,000 pound trailer with a minivan in my opinion. We recently bought a 2013 Aerolite 174e to pull behind a 2009 Routan with the tow package (transmission cooler, oil cooler, load leveling suspension, etc.) and hooked up with weight distribution and anti-sway. At 3156 actual pounds (Aerolite weighs with all options) combined with all people/cargo considerations we were under our max towing weight, GCWR, and tongue weight was spot on. I knew we could successfully pull the Aerolite if we never wanted to dry camp. We weighed all of our gear at 300lbs and maybe a third of that was going in a skybox to spread the weight over the van’s axles. All of our tests established that the Routan is a solid vehicle for towing. The nonsense about Chrysler transmissions is a holdover from several vehicle generations ago and properly set up you can tow a lighter setup.

That said, I decided I want to dry camp and I know that I have no margin of error for carrying 400 pounds of water in my 52 gallon tank. Two nights ago my wife and I decided we’d upgrade the TV and last night traded for a 2007 Expedition EL 4X4 (interestingly it only has 13K miles on it…old ladies make great first owners.

The bottom line is that minivans get a bad rap…they are fine tow vehicles so long as you know what you want and do the math. Fortunately for us I don’t have the itch to now upgrade my HTT since we wanted one that would fit in our driveway and we can’t squeeze much more than 20ft.

It is true that my Caravan was 2nd generation (The first rounded ones-also the best looking!). But, boy, when Dodge made a bad transmission, they did NOT mess about! Popped the first one at 30,000 miles. Made the roadside look like a mob hit. Didn't even have a hitch on it yet. Second one(mentioned above)lasted 60,000. Was on its way through the third when I gave the van to my wife's sister...

I feel your pain...I had a 2000 Isuzu Trooper that chewed through 5 transmissions in 12 months (all under warranty thankfully). They never did figure out what was going wrong so I got rid of it...the dealer claimed it was because they put GM transmissions in them. Troopers were generally very reliable but I happened to get the lemon. My next vehicle was a Saab 9-7x...it also started to have weird (GM!) transmission issues before it was taken back off lease. I guess the point is that every manufacturer makes stinkers...that doesn't mean they are all bad.

bikendan wrote:
i guess we should just ignore that any hybrid's frontal area, will exceed every minivan's manufacturer maximum amount.:R
except the one minivan truly capable of towing a hybrid, the Astro/Safari with the 4.3 Vortec built on a ladder frame chassis.

Interstingly, my Expy EL suggests a frontal area of 60 sq ft. Our small HTT exceeds that too.

Cotay wrote:

dwright1969 wrote:
Thanks for all the input guys. I should have come here first. You did "scare the bejeebers out of me":) but that's a good thing. I'm not normally an impulsive person and tend to over-research before making even a minor purchase. I have been in contact with the dealership and this is what they are willing to do for me: I can take a test tow of a very similar trailer and go over some local hills with it to see how it feels. I plan to put some weight in the mini-van for this test. If I am not comfortable they are willing to let me purchase something else. I'm feeling much better. If I do feel comfortable with it then I will complete the purchase and most likely be in the market for a new tow vehicle late next year.

Sigh...deep breaths...

DWright,

If you do your math and know that you will not ever dry camp, then you can push a 3,000 pound trailer with a minivan in my opinion. We recently bought a 2013 Aerolite 174e to pull behind a 2009 Routan with the tow package (transmission cooler, oil cooler, load leveling suspension, etc.) and hooked up with weight distribution and anti-sway. At 3156 actual pounds (Aerolite weighs with all options) combined with all people/cargo considerations we were under our max towing weight, GCWR, and tongue weight was spot on. I knew we could successfully pull the Aerolite if we never wanted to dry camp. We weighed all of our gear at 300lbs and maybe a third of that was going in a skybox to spread the weight over the van’s axles. All of our tests established that the Routan is a solid vehicle for towing. The nonsense about Chrysler transmissions is a holdover from several vehicle generations ago and properly set up you can tow a lighter setup.

That said, I decided I want to dry camp and I know that I have no margin of error for carrying 400 pounds of water in my 52 gallon tank. Two nights ago my wife and I decided we’d upgrade the TV and last night traded for a 2007 Expedition EL 4X4 (interestingly it only has 13K miles on it…old ladies make great first owners.

The bottom line is that minivans get a bad rap…they are fine tow vehicles so long as you know what you want and do the math. Fortunately for us I don’t have the itch to now upgrade my HTT since we wanted one that would fit in our driveway and we can’t squeeze much more than 20ft.

It is true that my Caravan was 2nd generation (The first rounded ones-also the best looking!). But, boy, when Dodge made a bad transmission, they did NOT mess about! Popped the first one at 30,000 miles. Made the roadside look like a mob hit. Didn't even have a hitch on it yet. Second one(mentioned above)lasted 60,000. Was on its way through the third when I gave the van to my wife's sister...

i guess we should just ignore that any hybrid's frontal area, will exceed every minivan's manufacturer maximum amount.:R
except the one minivan truly capable of towing a hybrid, the Astro/Safari with the 4.3 Vortec built on a ladder frame chassis.

dwright1969 wrote:
Thanks for all the input guys. I should have come here first. You did "scare the bejeebers out of me":) but that's a good thing. I'm not normally an impulsive person and tend to over-research before making even a minor purchase. I have been in contact with the dealership and this is what they are willing to do for me: I can take a test tow of a very similar trailer and go over some local hills with it to see how it feels. I plan to put some weight in the mini-van for this test. If I am not comfortable they are willing to let me purchase something else. I'm feeling much better. If I do feel comfortable with it then I will complete the purchase and most likely be in the market for a new tow vehicle late next year.

Sigh...deep breaths...

DWright,

If you do your math and know that you will not ever dry camp, then you can push a 3,000 pound trailer with a minivan in my opinion. We recently bought a 2013 Aerolite 174e to pull behind a 2009 Routan with the tow package (transmission cooler, oil cooler, load leveling suspension, etc.) and hooked up with weight distribution and anti-sway. At 3156 actual pounds (Aerolite weighs with all options) combined with all people/cargo considerations we were under our max towing weight, GCWR, and tongue weight was spot on. I knew we could successfully pull the Aerolite if we never wanted to dry camp. We weighed all of our gear at 300lbs and maybe a third of that was going in a skybox to spread the weight over the van’s axles. All of our tests established that the Routan is a solid vehicle for towing. The nonsense about Chrysler transmissions is a holdover from several vehicle generations ago and properly set up you can tow a lighter setup.

That said, I decided I want to dry camp and I know that I have no margin of error for carrying 400 pounds of water in my 52 gallon tank. Two nights ago my wife and I decided we’d upgrade the TV and last night traded for a 2007 Expedition EL 4X4 (interestingly it only has 13K miles on it…old ladies make great first owners.

The bottom line is that minivans get a bad rap…they are fine tow vehicles so long as you know what you want and do the math. Fortunately for us I don’t have the itch to now upgrade my HTT since we wanted one that would fit in our driveway and we can’t squeeze much more than 20ft.

A few others have mentioned this,but you will be inclined to think it tows okay during your test. Short, local trips might be okay, but a few hours on the interstate is another story.

In the end, moving up to a better tow vehicle might not be the "expensive" route. Ruining your vans transmission cold be more costly.

The tranny on my Caravan puked from the abuse of having towed a 1400 lb P/U. WITH a trans cooler. Just sayin...

Hey DWright-

Welcome to the forum..and welcome to Camping High & Dry!

Don't fret. Common mistake. Heck, my dealer told me I could tow my 23' Hybrid with my Suburban. NOT! After 20min down the road, I knew it was too much for the Suburban's mushy suspension. Plenty of Towing capacity (your 3500 number) with our old Suburban, but very poor on the PAYLOAD capacity (you will find this on the driver door).

After your "test drive" I would seriously think about the kind of mileage you will put on the camper. Zipping around the local area for a few miles is one thing...but treking for a 1000 miles could very well put your minivan into an early grave. If your towing capacity is 3500lbs, I would consider a 2500lb camper...max. Or...get a bigger tow vehicle.

We used to have a 3600lb pop up, and my Chevy trailblazer (w/ 5000lb tow rating) was screaming in 3rd gear all day long to keep it at 65mpg.

When you add all the camping stuff, and people in the van, with their stuff...the weights add up really fast!