replacing Brake Pads

Grit dog wrote:

otrfun wrote:
Back in the day, I never did anything to the brakes except swap out pads when I was absolutely forced to. Do things differently now.

In addition to a total flush every 3-5 years, we also drain and fill the entire contents of the brake reservoir on our Ram Cummins once a year using the vacuum line on our brake bleeder. Literally takes less than 3 min. Both the larger containers of brake fluid and the brake reservoir on our Ram hold exactly 32 oz., so no waste. When we started doing these D&F's, I did it as long-term preventative maintenance, with no expectations it would provide any noticeable improvement in braking performance. Was pleasantly surprised to find the brakes became distinctly more firm after every D&F.

I believe there's a bit of placebo effect going on here.
Not that I disagree with the merits of periodic brake fluid flush/change, the fluid would have to be really bad to have a noticeable difference in feel.

As a lifelong sports car owner and DIYer, the brake flush is a real thing, especially when the brakes are under stress like towing or on a track. Brake fluid attracts and keeps moisture and can cause a soft pedal and, in extreme cases, corrosion in the lines. It can also overheat and boil.

I flushed mine in the M3 every 5 years as a matter of regular maintenance. The choice of pads can also make a HUGE difference.

otrfun wrote:


If I hadn't done this 3-4 times with the same results, I'd be right there with you saying it was probably a placebo effect. However, the same thing happens every time. I can honestly say I never anticipate an improvement, but as soon as I use the brakes a few times I'm reminded there is one.

I'll try to remember to do a side by side comparison. I haven't noticed this effect.
I'm also a big fan of the lazy man's brake flush! Once a vehicle is about 5 years old or so, I'll do the empty/replace master cyl fluid method periodically. Not as complete as an actual flush, understood.
The new fluid does mix (over a period of time) with the old fluid. It's just too easy and quick to not do a gradual replacement. (unless there's cause to do some serious brake work, then flush and bleed isn't alot more onerous.

Grit dog wrote:

otrfun wrote:
Back in the day, I never did anything to the brakes except swap out pads when I was absolutely forced to. Do things differently now.

In addition to a total flush every 3-5 years, we also drain and fill the entire contents of the brake reservoir on our Ram Cummins once a year using the vacuum line on our brake bleeder. Literally takes less than 3 min. Both the larger containers of brake fluid and the brake reservoir on our Ram hold exactly 32 oz., so no waste. When we started doing these D&F's, I did it as long-term preventative maintenance, with no expectations it would provide any noticeable improvement in braking performance. Was pleasantly surprised to find the brakes became distinctly more firm after every D&F.

I believe there's a bit of placebo effect going on here.
Not that I disagree with the merits of periodic brake fluid flush/change, the fluid would have to be really bad to have a noticeable difference in feel.

As I mentioned, I had no expectations it would do anything except be a good, long-term ROI for 3 min. of my time.

If I hadn't done this 3-4 times with the same results, I'd be right there with you saying it was probably a placebo effect. However, the same thing happens every time. I can honestly say I never anticipate an improvement, but as soon as I use the brakes a few times I'm reminded there is one.

otrfun wrote:
Back in the day, I never did anything to the brakes except swap out pads when I was absolutely forced to. Do things differently now.

In addition to a total flush every 3-5 years, we also drain and fill the entire contents of the brake reservoir on our Ram Cummins once a year using the vacuum line on our brake bleeder. Literally takes less than 3 min. Both the larger containers of brake fluid and the brake reservoir on our Ram hold exactly 32 oz., so no waste. When we started doing these D&F's, I did it as long-term preventative maintenance, with no expectations it would provide any noticeable improvement in braking performance. Was pleasantly surprised to find the brakes became distinctly more firm after every D&F.

I believe there's a bit of placebo effect going on here.
Not that I disagree with the merits of periodic brake fluid flush/change, the fluid would have to be really bad to have a noticeable difference in feel.

Kinda interesting to read the replies and all good. I'd like to add that my '17 350 DRW w/ 29K seems to have a decent amount of pedal travel now than was new. Tire shop says nothing about how pads look and haver never seen then myself either so really don't know how much is left......especially the front ones. Upon next tire rotation, I'm going to ask the shop if I can see the front pads while they have the wheels off. Last time tho I did change pads/rotors was on my '03 250 and want to say I went w/ Hawk pads and slotted rotors. To make matters worse, several months after I put them on, got rid of the truck.

Back in the day, I never did anything to the brakes except swap out pads when I was absolutely forced to. Do things differently now.

In addition to a total flush every 3-5 years, we also drain and fill the entire contents of the brake reservoir on our Ram Cummins once a year using the vacuum line on our brake bleeder. Literally takes less than 3 min. Both the larger containers of brake fluid and the brake reservoir on our Ram hold exactly 32 oz., so no waste. When we started doing these D&F's, I did it as long-term preventative maintenance, with no expectations it would provide any noticeable improvement in braking performance. Was pleasantly surprised to find the brakes became distinctly more firm after every D&F.

Bottom line, any properly operating brake system on any newer truck of any size or flavor is pretty robust and sufficient for what the truck was designed to do.
Also, there’s mostly no one who said “I wish this didn’t stop as fast.” (I did, on our SRT, as the racing brakes weren’t the most conducive to normal driving).
All subjective, but I’ll take ceramic brakes generally, not for the ultimate performance, but for as good or a bit better in some vehicles than OE and the lack of brake dust.

Now if I was towing cattle trailers down the Ike loaded to the hilt, I would opt for better.

Some of the pads are too coarse. They may be ok for a very heavy application but they will also ruin the rotors faster. For my F-250 I could have bought pads for $19.99 but I paid $80.00 for a comparable oem pad for the front.

I did a front pad slap on my Ram dually at 100k miles. The original pads still had some meat but they were rock hard and their performance was poor. I used Bosch pads I bought from Amazon for $39. I really like these pads, initial bite is smooth and progressive, much better than the 100k OEM pads. Can't say how they will wear but for 39 bucks and a couple of hours of time I will replace them again.

Many feel that the more you pay the better they are. I disagree.

IMO keeping brake fluid relatively fresh has as much or more to do with maximizing brake system component life as it does stopping power.
Being somewhat lazy when it comes to that, I’ve never straight bled all the old fluid out which is the best method. But I use the replacement method. When fluid looks pretty dirty, I’ll replace the fluid in the master cyl. Several times over the course of weeks or months. The new mixes with the old after driving for a while, but is a bit cleaner. After several replacements it’s not perfect, but better. Same concept as drain and fill on a transmission vs fluid replacement method.
But If you have a couple hours to kill, bleeding it out is the best way.