RV selection help

Slate CM wrote:


:h

Hmmm, so what you're saying is that payload does not take into account the passengers and hitch and those must be subtracted.

Those items only affect the tow rating? If so that would only be 370# total, not much of a difference in trailer weight.

I have read several articles that manufacturers were reluctant to adopt a standard for fear their tow ratings would be less. But it wouldn't be much.

Maybe there is more to it. After all, it was on the internet....

The maximum amount you can tow will include various things, different per vehicle manufacturer usually. My Acura included a 150# passenger and an 150# driver, and 40# of cargo for each of those people I think it was. Some vehicles account for just a 150# driver. You mentioned Toyota accounts for some people and some weight for a WDH. Anything above and beyond what the manufacturer accounts for in the tow rating, basically means that you can no longer tow the maximum that they advertise as the tow rating.

The payload is separate from that. They weigh the vehicle sometime prior to it getting shipped out with all factory options on it and full fluids (oil, washer fluid, gas, etc.) and they then subtract that off the GVWR and slap a sticker that indicates that number. That number is how much you can add in dealer options, aftermarket accessories, cargo, people, tongue weight, WDH, basically anything on the truck that didn't come from the factory.

As for the 370 number you gave, sorry, I'm not sure which numbers you were using to calculate that so I can't confirm for you if the math is correct there.

SilverEscape wrote:

Slate CM wrote:
All Tundras made starting in 2007 use the J2807 engineering standards for payload and towing.

So those take into account the weight of the w/d hitch at 70#, and 150 for each front passenger. There other parameters including cooling capability on a long grade, launch and acceleration and trailer sway.

The tow ratings include those things but the payload does not. Payload is ALL passengers and cargo (WD hitch is cargo) in the vehicle. The payload sticker should account for the truck as shipped from factory with full fluids (including tank of gas). Any dealer options added after won't be reflected in the payload sticker.

The best way to find out what your truck can carry is to go the scales and weigh it empty with a full tank of gas then subtract that number from your GVWR. That leaves you with now munch weight you can add to the vehicle with people, cargo, tongue weight, etc.

:h

Hmmm, so what you're saying is that payload does not take into account the passengers and hitch and those must be subtracted.

Those items only affect the tow rating? If so that would only be 370# total, not much of a difference in trailer weight.

I have read several articles that manufacturers were reluctant to adopt a standard for fear their tow ratings would be less. But it wouldn't be much.

Maybe there is more to it. After all, it was on the internet....

Slate CM wrote:
All Tundras made starting in 2007 use the J2807 engineering standards for payload and towing.

So those take into account the weight of the w/d hitch at 70#, and 150 for each front passenger. There other parameters including cooling capability on a long grade, launch and acceleration and trailer sway.

The tow ratings include those things but the payload does not. Payload is ALL passengers and cargo (WD hitch is cargo) in the vehicle. The payload sticker should account for the truck as shipped from factory with full fluids (including tank of gas). Any dealer options added after won't be reflected in the payload sticker.

The best way to find out what your truck can carry is to go the scales and weigh it empty with a full tank of gas then subtract that number from your GVWR. That leaves you with now munch weight you can add to the vehicle with people, cargo, tongue weight, etc.

All Tundras made starting in 2007 use the J2807 engineering standards for payload and towing.

So those take into account the weight of the w/d hitch at 70#, and 150 for each front passenger. There other parameters including cooling capability on a long grade, launch and acceleration and trailer sway.

I have a 2008 Tundra CM and my TT is 5600 dry. I haven't weighed it loaded yet, maybe next trip at the end of this month. Towed about 1200 miles during July 4th week and was a good experience all the way. Except a little bouncy on Seattle area freeways.

Start with the truck first. Your Tundra is worth a good amount. You can find a quality 2011+ 3/4+ ton gas truck for the same value. Then you can find the right toy hauler or other TT you want and stay within ratings.

Ok next question

Assuming I get the winnebago Minnie...

I live in Houston and some of the atv parks does not have hookups. From what I have read the battery that comes with travel trailers will not power the ac and it is way to hot to camp without ac.

Will a honda eu3000 power the ac and everything in the trailer?

I know the eu3000 is expensive but I don't want a loud generator I'm worried about bothering people.

When powering with generator does this bypass the battery so the battery doesn't get drained at all?

If you are looking for a good used TT, take a trip down to PPL, it is on 59 south at Beltway 8 in Sugarland. They have several hundred trailers for sale. If you're not interested in used at least this would give you an opportunity to a see a large selection and get a better idea of what you are looking for. I ended up buying new from Holiday World in Katy. I also made a huge mistake by buying more TT than my TV could handle and had to upgrade to an F-250 over my F-150. Some people may have stayed with the F-150, but I was just barely over the weight limit and I didn't feel comfortable putting my family in that situation. An RV TT is a whole new ball game in towing if you never have towed one before. Don't be like me and spend way to much by not knowing exactly what type of TT to get to match your TV.

Good Luck.
Mike

What are yalls thoughts on the
2015 Winnebago Minnie 2451BHS?

It's lighter with a gvwr of right at 7,700 pounds (I know still heavier than the calculations)

I like the 2451 because it has the bunks and the couch bed so
I could technically sleep 6 adults. It's shorter only 27' and I like the "bright" color options as I just think it looks different...doesn't look "cookie cutter"

I think I could probably negotiate the rv dealer to about $19,000 on it. No clue if that is a good deal or not though..msrp is $28,812

Understand your frustrations. Most of us (myself included) have been right where you are at with your decisions. Where many folks get caught up, is in the marketing hype. Tow vehicle and RV manufacturers both do it.

Truck manufacturers:

Advertise large tow capacity numbers and put small print in your owners manual, where it says only propperly equipped vehicles, under the right circumstances, can actually pull that weight.

They don't tell you, not all of a specific make / model are created equal. F150 for example, has versions that have 750 lbs of payload, versions with 3120 lbs of payload, and some in between. Some are rated to pull 11,000 lbs, some have trouble with half of that.

Some don't tell you, accessories, people, and cargo reduce towing capacity and payload availability.

Trailer manufacturers:

Make their advertising numbers sound like you could pull the unit with a golf cart.

Don't tell you how the hitch weight goes up, or, how it fluctuates.

Don't tell you an approximate camping load.


It's great that, you are doing a lot of homework prior to talking to the RV sales people. There are some, who will only ask about max tow capacity, and sell you a trailer that fits that. You could run into one who thinks you'd be fine with a trailer that has 9000 lb dry weight. Best to not let them do your calculations.

You're looking at 643 lb dry hitch weight. That is eleven percent of the advertised dry weight for the trailer. It's not uncommon for dry hitch weights to not include a battery and propane. Those two items would push that hitch weight over 700 lbs.

The average camping load of 800 - 1000 pounds will add 10 - 15 percent of that to the hitch weight.

In the formula, I used .13 because it is about average for tongue / hitch weight. Some trailers come from the factory with a higher percentage, and depending on how you load your trailer, you can affect the percentage. However, you do not want the percentage to go below 10%. There may also be items that you'll have little control over, but, you should be aware of their potential.

Example: My fresh water tank is located behind the trailer axles. Filling it, takes 175 lbs off my hitch weight. My galley tank is in front of the axles, it can add 200 lbs to my hitch weight. Depending on tank levels and other stuff I may have loaded, my hitch weight can be anywhere between 1000 and 1250 lbs.

Here's a link to another calculator, you might like to try.

That trailer won't have a 643 lb tongue weight when loaded. If you load it to it's max of 9443, your tongue needs to be 10-15% of that. And some trailers are hard to keep at 10% (and most people prefer to tow with a tongue heavier than that). You could have a tongue weight of up to about 1400 lbs. More than your payload.

And ya half tons aren't great for towing big trailers. We just bought our F-150 last summer and I quickly found out that the model I wanted had low payload due to all the creature comforts. Typically around 1100 lbs of payload. So I discovered if I found one with the "max tow" option, I could get around 1500, so I found a truck with 1575. And once loaded with us and the kids (and we are light adults and the kids are still small) and loading stuff in the back, and our tongue weight of 770 lbs on a 5000 pound trailer, we have some payload left but are close to our rear axle weight rating (we went to a scale and weighed). As the kids get bigger, we'll be changing what we carry in the truck bed.

Our is a great trailer but I don't think it will meet your needs even though it has bunks. While we have 5 people camping in ours, it's different when it's your spawn that are with you as opposed to other adults. It would be tight for 6 adults.