Pullrite 2600 with the big boys

timelinex wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:

timelinex wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:
So you are saying the hitch mentioned should be used with toy haulers so the pin is less?

Tandem axle 5ers have 20-25% pin weight. On the higher side especially if fulltiming.

I'm sorry, I'm not sure I understand what you are saying. So I will restate my point.

My post had nothing to do with using a specific hitch. I am saying that the rule of thumb you are using (20%-25%) is not a god given fact, but just a rule of thumb that applies to maybe most 5er's. However, that there are many 5er layouts that produce 15%-20% hitch weights, by design and layout.

For Example: If you look up factory numbers for the Grand Design 381m (NOT THE 381MS) you will find they are much less than 20%. Then if you look up peoples posts on what their hitch weights are for their FULLY LOADED 281m trailer weights... You will quickly find almost no one is breaking 20%. Most are at 16%-18%. It's not because they all decided to irresponsibly swing the rear end of their trailer down the freeway.

The problem is what i saw was you were posting unloaded factory weights. Most all weight added to a standard 5er goes to the pin. Toyhaulers are a different animal.

My original point is it is unrealistic to have a 28k hitch with only 5k pin unless those numbers are not correct???

OK, sorry I misunderstood you. You were commenting that even though it's possible to have a 5k pin with 28k trailer, it would be odd to make a hitch with those limits since you would only be able to come close to that tow rating with that little pin weight in a minority of applications. Effectively making it a 20k hitch for most people.

I agree that this is odd, but seems fairly consistent to how truck manufacturers do it. Sell based on tow capacity and smuggle in the piss poor payload rating under covers.

I agree on the truck part of your comment!!! But if you look at any other hitch they will have a MUCH higher pin percentage number.

Cummins12V98 wrote:

timelinex wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:
So you are saying the hitch mentioned should be used with toy haulers so the pin is less?

Tandem axle 5ers have 20-25% pin weight. On the higher side especially if fulltiming.

I'm sorry, I'm not sure I understand what you are saying. So I will restate my point.

My post had nothing to do with using a specific hitch. I am saying that the rule of thumb you are using (20%-25%) is not a god given fact, but just a rule of thumb that applies to maybe most 5er's. However, that there are many 5er layouts that produce 15%-20% hitch weights, by design and layout.

For Example: If you look up factory numbers for the Grand Design 381m (NOT THE 381MS) you will find they are much less than 20%. Then if you look up peoples posts on what their hitch weights are for their FULLY LOADED 281m trailer weights... You will quickly find almost no one is breaking 20%. Most are at 16%-18%. It's not because they all decided to irresponsibly swing the rear end of their trailer down the freeway.

The problem is what i saw was you were posting unloaded factory weights. Most all weight added to a standard 5er goes to the pin. Toyhaulers are a different animal.

My original point is it is unrealistic to have a 28k hitch with only 5k pin unless those numbers are not correct???

OK, sorry I misunderstood you. You were commenting that even though it's possible to have a 5k pin with 28k trailer, it would be odd to make a hitch with those limits since you would only be able to come close to that tow rating with that little pin weight in a minority of applications. Effectively making it a 20k hitch for most people.

I agree that this is odd, but seems fairly consistent to how truck manufacturers do it. Sell based on tow capacity and smuggle in the piss poor payload rating under covers.

timelinex wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:
So you are saying the hitch mentioned should be used with toy haulers so the pin is less?

Tandem axle 5ers have 20-25% pin weight. On the higher side especially if fulltiming.

I'm sorry, I'm not sure I understand what you are saying. So I will restate my point.

My post had nothing to do with using a specific hitch. I am saying that the rule of thumb you are using (20%-25%) is not a god given fact, but just a rule of thumb that applies to maybe most 5er's. However, that there are many 5er layouts that produce 15%-20% hitch weights, by design and layout.

For Example: If you look up factory numbers for the Grand Design 381m (NOT THE 381MS) you will find they are much less than 20%. Then if you look up peoples posts on what their hitch weights are for their FULLY LOADED 281m trailer weights... You will quickly find almost no one is breaking 20%. Most are at 16%-18%. It's not because they all decided to irresponsibly swing the rear end of their trailer down the freeway.

The problem is what i saw was you were posting unloaded factory weights. Most all weight added to a standard 5er goes to the pin. Toyhaulers are a different animal.

My original point is it is unrealistic to have a 28k hitch with only 5k pin unless those numbers are not correct???

Cummins12V98 wrote:
So you are saying the hitch mentioned should be used with toy haulers so the pin is less?

Tandem axle 5ers have 20-25% pin weight. On the higher side especially if fulltiming.

I'm sorry, I'm not sure I understand what you are saying. So I will restate my point.

My post had nothing to do with using a specific hitch. I am saying that the rule of thumb you are using (20%-25%) is not a god given fact, but just a rule of thumb that applies to maybe most 5er's. However, that there are many 5er layouts that produce 15%-20% hitch weights, by design and layout.

For Example: If you look up factory numbers for the Grand Design 381m (NOT THE 381MS) you will find they are much less than 20%. Then if you look up peoples posts on what their hitch weights are for their FULLY LOADED 281m trailer weights... You will quickly find almost no one is breaking 20%. Most are at 16%-18%. It's not because they all decided to irresponsibly swing the rear end of their trailer down the freeway.

So you are saying the hitch mentioned should be used with toy haulers so the pin is less?

Tandem axle 5ers have 20-25% pin weight. On the higher side especially if fulltiming.

Cummins12V98 wrote:
28k trailer and only 5k pin is VERY odd. B&W Puck Hitch for RAM is 25k and 6,250# pin that is exactly 25% of max trailer. My RV weighs 24k with a 6k pin that is 25%. I would be overloaded on the BD5 model???

I can't speak for him, but the percentage isn't odd at all. Different trailer layouts optimize for different things.

Here are the weights directly from the factory for my 2021 381m (UVW with propane: 15,242, Hitch weight:2,848)




I have measured my pin weight with just a few added things but far from fully loaded and the pin weight was 2900. Multiple forum members on multiple forums report pin weights of around 3,100 at 19k lb when carrying things in the garage.

After alot of research before buying my 381m, I found that the "rule of thumb" is exactly that. A rudimentary rule of thumb that refers mostly to 5th wheel travel trailers, not all trailers and especially not some 5th wheel toy haulers.

Moderator edit to resize picture to forum recommended limit of 640px maximum width.

28k trailer and only 5k pin is VERY odd. B&W Puck Hitch for RAM is 25k and 6,250# pin that is exactly 25% of max trailer. My RV weighs 24k with a 6k pin that is 25%. I would be overloaded on the BD5 model???

I went with the Hensley TrailerSaver BD3 air ride hitch, what a different the air suspension makes! Their BD5 model is rated for 28,000 trailer and 5,000 pin weight. That would have been my choice.

JIMNLIN wrote:
Assuming it has a % safety factor isn't wise.
Just like its not wise assuming our tires with a 3500 lb load/80 psi rating has a safety factor and can support more psi and load.
Trailer hitches has a load and draw capacity.

I sure wouldn't exceed the hitch mfg 20k draw capacity....nor tell anyone its safe to do so long term.

Using the safety factor to justify pulling a 25k trailer with a 20k hitch...yeah that's foolish as you don't know exactly what safety factor was used and it's possible you might exceed it.

Pulling a 20k trailer with a 20k hitch is perfectly fine and yes, I can guarantee the structural engineers built in a safety factor.

If you are going to load up a 20k GVWR trailer to 25k, you probably don't care if you are exceeding the hitch as you are likely overweight on the axles, tires and other parts.

No different from a tire rated for 4000lb and putting 4000lb on it.

OP, What truck do you own that is capable of towing a 20k 5er?