Questionable Sales Tactic by Lazydays

[kedanie]

We have been looking to upgrade to a Tiffin Phaeton for some time. Looking for a good used late model coach. I found a couple listed on the Lazydays web page and inquired. I found it odd that they were listed as "arriving soon" with some basic data.

Well, after being contacted by a sales rep from the Tampa store, we started exchanging emails and phone calls about the coach we were interested in. The sales seemed a little high pressure to the point that they were asking for a deposit on a used coach and had yet to even provide a photo of the coach. I ignored this and continued the discussion even going so far as beginning to talk about prices on their coach and our trade. Keep in mind that they are in Florida and we are in New Mexico.

After quite a bit of talk, they still had not provided any details about the coach and were still asking for a deposit. Finally, I told them that that was not going to happen. Then, today they called back and once again asked for a deposit. I, once again said that that wasn't going to happen. At this point I was told that most likely they would not be able to have anything for us as they would be sold to someone else.

Keep in mind that the deposit was supposedly 100% refundable. But, they apparently wand a deposit to stand in line for chance to buy one of their used coaches when it finally arrives.

I'm sorry, but that's not for us. I guess we'll go look elsewhere.

Keith

[JALLEN4]

rockhillmanor wrote:
What part of this line in my post did you miss? :W

That would

not

include a salesman telling you something is 'coming in' but it does apply if 'advertised'.

I didn't miss any of your post. It simply is not against any Florida regulations to advertise an incoming unit if disclosed properly. That is contrary to your definitive statement. If you believe that to be erroneous, cite a reference to the law.

[rockhillmanor]

What part of this line in my post did you miss? :W

That would

not

include a salesman telling you something is 'coming in' but it does apply if 'advertised'.

[JALLEN4]

rockhillmanor wrote:

Deano56 wrote:

JALLEN4 wrote:

rockhillmanor wrote:
They passed laws years ago to stop that practice.

If a dealership 'advertises' a vehicle and it is not 'physically' on their lot (doesn't matter if they say coming soon)it is now against the law to do so. It was called bait and switch with a fictitious vehicle.

If you take the advertisement and the listed vehicle stock number in the ad and report them you can make them give you that vehicle or comparable one for that exact sales price and/or they can loose their license also.

Could you possibly clarify that statement with a source. Forty years in the business and never knew it was somehow illegal to advertise an incoming unit.

would like to see that in writing also, if its not law it sure should be. A few things could happen before it arrives at the dealer or it might never make it's way there.

I worked in the car business also.

It is illegal to advertise a car that is not actually on the dealerships lot at the price advertised.

I was working at a dealership when this came out. It was a very common practice for dealerships to advertise a popular car at a ridiculous low price. As a come on and of course no such car 'at that price' existed on their lot. Buyers would get there and we'd just say oh it just sold.

If it is advertised in writing with a stock number when a customer gets to your dealership you must have that vehicle on the lot AND sell it for the advertised price.

The dealership may only have that just one. That is ok. If it is not there when a buyer gets there they do have to prove it was sold.

Which they started sending out fake buyers to make sure these dealerships had these discounted cars. If they did not they were fined for false advertising. They also 'had' to include a stock number in the advertisement.

Been a while so I can't remember who fined them it might had been the manuf of the ticket the dealership had. My dealership got fined twice, slow learners.

So the jist of it was the dealerships continued to use the low price advertisement as a come on AND where now forced to actually have that advertised vehicle on the lot for sale and just took the hit of selling it below cost to the first buyer that got there to obtain the increased buyer traffic.

Moral of the story if there is something advertised with a stock number and you get there and the vehicle is not there you have the 'right' to ask for them to prove it was sold.

That would not include a salesman telling you something is 'coming in' but it does apply if 'advertised'.

To the OP was this RV advertised in the paper with a stock number?

You are mixing and matching what are generally state specific rules of sale governing vehicle sales and advertising related to those sales. These vary greatly from state to state and usually are enforced by the State DMV. I have owned and or operated new car dealerships in multiple states and can assure you the regulations are very different from state to state. What is perfectly legal in Ohio may well get you fined in California.

I would defy anyone to find a written regulation that prohibits a dealership in Florida to advertise an incoming motor home as long as it is well established in the advertisement that it is exactly that.As well, you will not find any regualtion prohibiting a dealership taking a deposit to "hold" such a unit as long as the deposit is refundable.

While the OP may well consider himself way too astute to give LazyDays a deposit on an incoming unit, that is his own unilateral decision and has nothing whatsoever to do with any violation of law or for that matter, poor business practices on their part. They have acted in this manner for years and one can find multiple anecdotal instances of satisfied customers using this method.

[rollingslow]

I understand why..dont agree with it but understand. I didnt have a problem when i bought from LD but i agree some of there practices arent the best but they are a delearship..lol..buyer beware

[dougrainer]

rockhillmanor wrote:

Deano56 wrote:

JALLEN4 wrote:

rockhillmanor wrote:
They passed laws years ago to stop that practice.

If a dealership 'advertises' a vehicle and it is not 'physically' on their lot (doesn't matter if they say coming soon)it is now against the law to do so. It was called bait and switch with a fictitious vehicle.

If you take the advertisement and the listed vehicle stock number in the ad and report them you can make them give you that vehicle or comparable one for that exact sales price and/or they can loose their license also.

Could you possibly clarify that statement with a source. Forty years in the business and never knew it was somehow illegal to advertise an incoming unit.

would like to see that in writing also, if its not law it sure should be. A few things could happen before it arrives at the dealer or it might never make it's way there.

I worked in the car business also.

It is illegal to advertise a car that is not actually on the dealerships lot at the price advertised.

I was working at a dealership when this came out. It was a very common practice for dealerships to advertise a popular car at a ridiculous low price. As a come on and of course no such car 'at that price' existed on their lot. Buyers would get there and we'd just say oh it just sold.

If it is advertised in writing with a stock number when a customer gets to your dealership you must have that vehicle on the lot AND sell it for the advertised price.

The dealership may only have that just one. That is ok. If it is not there when a buyer gets there they do have to prove it was sold.

Which they started sending out fake buyers to make sure these dealerships had these discounted cars. If they did not they were fined for false advertising. They also 'had' to include a stock number in the advertisement.

Been a while so I can't remember who fined them it might had been the manuf of the ticket the dealership had. My dealership got fined twice, slow learners.

So the jist of it was the dealerships continued to use the low price advertisement as a come on AND where now forced to actually have that advertised vehicle on the lot for sale and just took the hit of selling it below cost to the first buyer that got there to obtain the increased buyer traffic.

Moral of the story if there is something advertised with a stock number and you get there and the vehicle is not there you have the 'right' to ask for them to prove it was sold.

That would not include a salesman telling you something is 'coming in' but it does apply if 'advertised'.

To the OP was this RV advertised in the paper with a stock number?

You 2 are comparing apples and oranges. The item in question is NOT NEW. It is a potential trade in. I do NOT believe any B&S laws pertain to future trade in units. There will be NO stock number(used stock number) issued until the unit is actually at the dealership and paperwork has been done. Doug

[RVforfishing]

We purchased our first and only class A motor home in 1999 from Lazy Days.
We knew we only wanted a used Foretravel and had been talking to people in other parts of the country who had ones for sale. Since this was 15 years ago I don't remember all the detail but I know we put a deposit down on one that was being traded in and wasn't delivered yet. We did receive several photos of it ahead of time.
There were so few Foretravels available anywhere in our price range we were glad to have a chance at the 1993 U280 they had coming in. It was a refundable deposit.
I think we would have missed out of this wonderful motorhome if we didn't handle it this way. When there were a few problems after we took delivery they fixed them.
15 years later we still have the coach and the Foretravel Service people in Nacadoches still support us when we have problems or questions.
In a few years we will purchase a newer Foretravel if we decide to fulltime.

[Laman]

If case some of you doubters have not looked at LD's website, they have numerous coaches listed as "coming in soon". Each one will have a stock number and a general listing of appliance, decor etc. There will be no price listed until the unit is on the lot. You can even ask to be notified when that unit arrives. Bait and switch, not likely.
How hard is it to understand that a very large dealer with a high turn over rate of popular models RV's is going to stipulate that if you want to reserve a look at a particular model you will have to put a deposit(hold) down to assure that the unit is not sold before you get there. What is the salesman supposed to do, tell the other 100 plus salesmen "hey guys nobody sell that Phaeton because I have a guy that called about it". Questionable sales tactic, I don't think so.

[rockhillmanor]

Deano56 wrote:

JALLEN4 wrote:

rockhillmanor wrote:
They passed laws years ago to stop that practice.

If a dealership 'advertises' a vehicle and it is not 'physically' on their lot (doesn't matter if they say coming soon)it is now against the law to do so. It was called bait and switch with a fictitious vehicle.

If you take the advertisement and the listed vehicle stock number in the ad and report them you can make them give you that vehicle or comparable one for that exact sales price and/or they can loose their license also.

Could you possibly clarify that statement with a source. Forty years in the business and never knew it was somehow illegal to advertise an incoming unit.

would like to see that in writing also, if its not law it sure should be. A few things could happen before it arrives at the dealer or it might never make it's way there.

I worked in the car business also.

It is illegal to advertise a car that is not actually on the dealerships lot at the price advertised.

I was working at a dealership when this came out. It was a very common practice for dealerships to advertise a popular car at a ridiculous low price. As a come on and of course no such car 'at that price' existed on their lot. Buyers would get there and we'd just say oh it just sold.

If it is advertised in writing with a stock number when a customer gets to your dealership you must have that vehicle on the lot AND sell it for the advertised price.

The dealership may only have that just one. That is ok. If it is not there when a buyer gets there they do have to prove it was sold.

Which they started sending out fake buyers to make sure these dealerships had these discounted cars. If they did not they were fined for false advertising. They also 'had' to include a stock number in the advertisement.

Been a while so I can't remember who fined them it might had been the manuf of the ticket the dealership had. My dealership got fined twice, slow learners.

So the jist of it was the dealerships continued to use the low price advertisement as a come on AND where now forced to actually have that advertised vehicle on the lot for sale and just took the hit of selling it below cost to the first buyer that got there to obtain the increased buyer traffic.

Moral of the story if there is something advertised with a stock number and you get there and the vehicle is not there you have the 'right' to ask for them to prove it was sold.

That would not include a salesman telling you something is 'coming in' but it does apply if 'advertised'.

To the OP was this RV advertised in the paper with a stock number?

[dougrainer]

Remember, the OP is looking at a used trade in that has not been delivered to LD yet. I think LD was telling the OP that his deposit put him first in line. IF the unit, when it came in was to his satisfaction, he had the FIRST right to purchase. If he did not like the unit, he got his deposit back. NO DEPOSIT, then he takes his chances that another purchaser puts a deposit in or beats him to the purchase. CarMax does NOT take deposits on their used cars. To get the car you have found, you must purchase it. Think about it for 1 hour, someone else may purchase it. CarMax will refund your total amount if you do not like the Car after purchasing. But, they do NOT take deposits. Car dealers still do a version of Bait and Switch, but do it the legal way. They advertise a bare bones Auto with NO AC or options, knowing that almost nobody will purchase it, then upsell you to a more expensive model. They usually have 2 of those models, because SOMEONE will buy at the LOW price, and they have a back up when it does sell. REAL Bait and Switch is when they have NO Cars at that advertised price and cannot produce the Invoice or Stock number to prove they did have one. Remember, when you see those ads, you will see the Stock number mentioned and also that they only have 1 or 2 at that price. Doug

[two-niner]

When the economy went south in 2008, Winnebago had a LOT of inventory at their factory. They changed the mode of operation regarding manufacturing.
I can only speak of direct knowledge of the 2012 Tour. Each Tour is paid for, before assembling the vehicle.
LD may not have the RV on the lot, but it has been ordered and they must advertise to stay in business. So "coming soon" or "no photo" is their way of getting your attention.
My one dealing with LD was honest and above board. We drove our 2008 Tour from Las Vegas to Seffner and traded. I had sent about 20 photo's of the 08 Tour and it was sold before we arrived in FL. The new buyer kept coming by to see when we were going to move into the 2012 model. It's LD way of doing business.

Kerry

[msmith1199]

Deano56 wrote:

JALLEN4 wrote:

rockhillmanor wrote:
They passed laws years ago to stop that practice.

If a dealership 'advertises' a vehicle and it is not 'physically' on their lot (doesn't matter if they say coming soon)it is now against the law to do so. It was called bait and switch with a fictitious vehicle.

If you take the advertisement and the listed vehicle stock number in the ad and report them you can make them give you that vehicle or comparable one for that exact sales price and/or they can loose their license also.

Could you possibly clarify that statement with a source. Forty years in the business and never knew it was somehow illegal to advertise an incoming unit.

would like to see that in writing also, if its not law it sure should be. A few things could happen before it arrives at the dealer or it might never make it's way there.

There are in fact laws about bait and switch techniques, but they would vary from state to state, and I don't think they are anywhere near as strict as the person here claims. Most of them do deal with advertising and require language that you often see such as "One at this price." Car dealers used to run ads for new vehicles and really low prices and the ads would give the impression that all models of that car were at that price. People would arrive at the dealer to find that vehicle was already sold, but they had plenty more at a slightly higher price. The bait and switch laws make them do things like indicate how many they have and do things like put the last five digits of the VIN in the ad so that it can be verified that they really did have a vehicle at that price and really sold it at that price.

[Deano56]

JALLEN4 wrote:

rockhillmanor wrote:
They passed laws years ago to stop that practice.

If a dealership 'advertises' a vehicle and it is not 'physically' on their lot (doesn't matter if they say coming soon)it is now against the law to do so. It was called bait and switch with a fictitious vehicle.

If you take the advertisement and the listed vehicle stock number in the ad and report them you can make them give you that vehicle or comparable one for that exact sales price and/or they can loose their license also.

Could you possibly clarify that statement with a source. Forty years in the business and never knew it was somehow illegal to advertise an incoming unit.

would like to see that in writing also, if its not law it sure should be. A few things could happen before it arrives at the dealer or it might never make it's way there.

[Deano56]

JALLEN4 wrote:

afrescop wrote:

darsben wrote:
I am not sure it is a questionable sales tactic. I can see both sides of the street here.
You are reluctant to give a deposit sight unseen.
The salesman ON COMMISSION ONLY is spending non-compensated time on a maybe sale from what 3000 miles away. Does not take much of a leap to wonder if the person taking up your time is serious or just gathering information and buying somewhere else. It is in my mind analogous to what independent small stores are going through with internet stores. People come in take lots of time ask lots of questions then go home and order the product for a few bucks less online. Or to put it closer to home go to Camping World and gaather information then go home and order from Amazon

The salesman is trying to feed his family

What the....???? The saleman's first job is to satisfy his customer. There are many dealers doing business from the Internet on a national basis. Heck, LazyDays has a "Fly and Buy" program. So, your position is that if a potential customer calls for information the salesman's duty is to blow them off and wait for a walk in?

I wish I had your wealth and ability to take on faith a mirage RV.

A salesman's "first job" is to sell units. The satisfaction of the customer is job #2.

you should say a salesmans first job it to completely honest,then make the sale if possible and without pressure.

[Deano56]

darsben wrote:
I am not sure it is a questionable sales tactic. I can see both sides of the street here.
You are reluctant to give a deposit sight unseen.
The salesman ON COMMISSION ONLY is spending non-compensated time on a maybe sale from what 3000 miles away. Does not take much of a leap to wonder if the person taking up your time is serious or just gathering information and buying somewhere else. It is in my mind analogous to what independent small stores are going through with internet stores. People come in take lots of time ask lots of questions then go home and order the product for a few bucks less online. Or to put it closer to home go to Camping World and gaather information then go home and order from Amazon

The salesman is trying to feed his family

Oh please, what sensible person would do that other than on Ebay where there is a buyer protection plan, and there I have heard of someone personally getting burned for 35K. How long would it take to get your deposit back from a place like that if you backed out once the coach was looked over.