warrenjo46 wrote:zippinbye wrote:
Thanks to everybody who responded so far. Busskipper, the philosophy of priorities/objectives you outlined very nicely summarizes many considerations I have already formulated. Perfect! The link to IRV2 looks awesome; I read to the bottom of page 3 so far .... good stuff.
May I ask about your GX470, aka Landcruiser Prado? I've never noticed one in tow, but I just happen to own a 2005. I had in the back of my mind that a 1997 or newer Jeep TJ would probably make a good toad. And I thought of getting a TJ just for exploring the desert near me. Considering the cost and effort of all the potential TJ mods to make it "sweet," right up to a LS V-8 conversion (or Cummins 4BT or VW TDI), I realize that my GX already does so many things as well or better than the TJ would, except for these concerns: I won't be dropping 35" tires under the GX or conquring Moab with it, and the body is just too pretty and vulnerable to squeeze between boulders and trees. Plus it's not as well-suited to a winch mount was a TJ would be. However, it will kick butt on a Jeep for freeway cruising, comfort and MPG, and is virtually as capable off-road. With the locking center diff and KDSS (auto-disconnect front sway bar) I have horrified some "expert" off-roaders by showing up to challenging trails in a Lexus ("nice girlie rig, dude," etc). Horror was replaced by respect when all was said and done, including me rescuing a FJ-40 that got stuck. It's a great machine. In this day and age of frameless cross-over SUVs and such, the GX is a force to be reckoned with. Mine has 170,000 miles and these days just sits around as an extra vehicle, mainly cause I know she'd sell for far less than she's worth to me! If I took the money I sold it for, I'd probably need another $20k to buy and build a TJ the way I want, it it would be lacking in many ways compared to the Lexus.
Would the GX be the ideal toad? Not sure ... is it as simple as putting the transfer case in neutral, hooking up, and rolling down the road? I have never been over the scales in the GX, but I'm guessing 5500 lbs - the thing is a tank, so it would not be an inconsequential burden behind our "big rig." I would speculate that locked up in 4x4 low, the GX could pull a Class A out of some traction-challenged situations.
Guess I'll hang tight with her until I make a RV decision.
Skipper, I'd be very interested to hear your thoughts on the GX 470 as a toad. Thanks very much.
I am also looking for an older used DP and own a 2004 GX 470 like the OP(except mine has a little over quarter million miles). I would love to use the GX470 as a Toad but the owners manual nixes 4 down toeing. Does anyone on the forum have experience with a GX 470.
Look Here the procedure is listed - It Works!
Best of Luck,
zippinbye wrote:
Thanks to everybody who responded so far. Busskipper, the philosophy of priorities/objectives you outlined very nicely summarizes many considerations I have already formulated. Perfect! The link to IRV2 looks awesome; I read to the bottom of page 3 so far .... good stuff.
May I ask about your GX470, aka Landcruiser Prado? I've never noticed one in tow, but I just happen to own a 2005. I had in the back of my mind that a 1997 or newer Jeep TJ would probably make a good toad. And I thought of getting a TJ just for exploring the desert near me. Considering the cost and effort of all the potential TJ mods to make it "sweet," right up to a LS V-8 conversion (or Cummins 4BT or VW TDI), I realize that my GX already does so many things as well or better than the TJ would, except for these concerns: I won't be dropping 35" tires under the GX or conquring Moab with it, and the body is just too pretty and vulnerable to squeeze between boulders and trees. Plus it's not as well-suited to a winch mount was a TJ would be. However, it will kick butt on a Jeep for freeway cruising, comfort and MPG, and is virtually as capable off-road. With the locking center diff and KDSS (auto-disconnect front sway bar) I have horrified some "expert" off-roaders by showing up to challenging trails in a Lexus ("nice girlie rig, dude," etc). Horror was replaced by respect when all was said and done, including me rescuing a FJ-40 that got stuck. It's a great machine. In this day and age of frameless cross-over SUVs and such, the GX is a force to be reckoned with. Mine has 170,000 miles and these days just sits around as an extra vehicle, mainly cause I know she'd sell for far less than she's worth to me! If I took the money I sold it for, I'd probably need another $20k to buy and build a TJ the way I want, it it would be lacking in many ways compared to the Lexus.
Would the GX be the ideal toad? Not sure ... is it as simple as putting the transfer case in neutral, hooking up, and rolling down the road? I have never been over the scales in the GX, but I'm guessing 5500 lbs - the thing is a tank, so it would not be an inconsequential burden behind our "big rig." I would speculate that locked up in 4x4 low, the GX could pull a Class A out of some traction-challenged situations.
Guess I'll hang tight with her until I make a RV decision.
Skipper, I'd be very interested to hear your thoughts on the GX 470 as a toad. Thanks very much.
GX470 at 170,000 miles - Like New - ๐ - Again I will defer to an old post on another forum - Link with a few more pages to read - ๐
Think I pretty much decided over the years that I needed to be able to go Off Road in Colorado - Alpine Loop in the MDX was all it could handle, not sure a Jeep would not rust away - so IMHO the GX would keep the wife Happy, she has an old LS430 that I'm trying to pry her out of so this was a compromise to get her to go back on the road with me. I searched for 3 years and Found a White/Dark Grey interior - with 100,000 miles - and looks and drives like a New Car - notice I said Car - as you know the thing is a Truck (Beast) - and I love it - Self installed the Base plate from I think etrailer and went to Craigslist to get a lightly used Blue Ox tow bar - all for less than $1,000.00 so that was good.
So - Yes I think the GX is the Perfect Toad, and as you know it's a Lexus and if you are so lucky as to have KDSS, I could not find one with good seats and a non cracked Dash - and in all honesty I could not tell the difference driving them on the Highway, which is what it will do for 99% of the time. As for the "Girlie look" - just smile as you pull them out with a Strap or a Chain ๐
As you appear to have some time, as all of us will till summer with this COVID19 - I suggest you take the time to join the other forum and try the question there - It's just bigger and Easier to use - plus it will send you an email to notify you of other posters on a thread - pain but also a big Plus. Last thing - if a winch is needed then I think there was a guy on the other post I linked you to that put a bumper on the front to hook up his 2008 and it would easily allow a winch.
Again if I can be of more help just ask, issue is I seldom come to this forum as I thought they renamed it to 83 Pace Arrow forum
Bill
zippinbye wrote:
Greetings All,
I was member here, inactive since 2015; it seems my account was deleted due to lack of use.
Anyhow, I just re-joined, pleased to see I could reclaim my old username. My RV history started in the early 2000's with an Alpenlite truck camper. This forum was a tremendous resource to me as I considered that purchase, and learned the skills necessary to use and maintain my rig. The TC was fun, but child #3 made it beyond impractical, so we switched to a fifth wheel, in 2009 or 2010. It's a 2004 Thor Jazz 278 bunkhouse, single slide that is an actual 32 feet. I did a lot of upgrades to it: stripped the carpeting and laid vinyl plank flooring, reupholstered everything, massive TV and sound system upgrade, lifted the suspension to fit well with my Dodge 3500 4x4 tow rig, along with a bunch of electrical tweaks and other small fixes.
I currently sit in that rig typing this post, as I isolate from my family for 14 days due to CV-19 concerns (I returned from Korea a few days ago). With immune-suppressed family members, I'm playing it safe and staying out of the house. I'm parked in the side yard at my home, with full hook-ups and a hot tub nearby. So it's not too bad. We lived in this RV for 6 months when our house had a mold issue. We being me, the wife, 3 kids, and 2 dogs. I was never uncomfortable, nor was anybody else really, until summer temps pushed beyond the limits of our single 13,000 BTU A/C unit. But due to the "cabin-fever" and general chaos of being stuffed into 250 square feet of living area for a prolonged time, fond memories of the experience are non-existent with my wife and kids. Hence, there has been little eagerness to spend time in it anywhere on earth .... even if it's in an awesome natural setting, like a mountain lake or at the beach. We have only taken 2 RV trips since our house was rehabilitated. I've known for some time that I needed to consider a nicer, newer, fresh-to-us RV in order to rekindle an eagerness to take camping road trips. Now we can shed the bunkhouse requirement, since there is just one kid left at home. So that opens up a lot of options that did not exist when I was hunting for a fifth wheel with easy sleeping for 5.
I have considered a diesel pusher as an eventual goal, always putting off any serious searches due to the capital investment and operational/fixed costs compared to the fifth wheel (which is basically free to own), along with the proverbial spousal resistance, which I expect others on this board have had to hurdle at some point.
Imagine my elation today, when my wife knocked on the door and dropped off dinner, while keeping a safe, germ-free distance and uttered these words: "Maybe we should get one of those big self-driving RV thingy's - you'd have more room, and we could just turn the key and go if a bad situation happens." I tried to act casual in my response, and said, "yeah, that's something we should look at." In my mind, that lead to a Tim Allen moment ... oh, oh, oh more power, bigger, better, oh, oh, oh (scratch the armpit). So here I am.
As great as I think a DP might be, I do have a some reservations still, but it's time to sort through all the possibilities. One issue is I'm debt-adverse. I would only consider a cash purchase or big down-payment, low interest financing with an aggressive pay-off schedule. That, along with a desire to avoid later engines with DPF or DEF, places me in the target model years of 2000-2008 most likely. I also like the idea of a rig that has probably plateaued on its depreciation curve. Just a few years ago, I thought I'd need a $80 to $100,000 budget to get anything decent in a DP. But now I am seeing some really nice rigs in the sub-$50,000 range, so that's where my mind is. Just yesterday, I fell into a YouTube "wormhole" and watched a RV dealer walk-through of a 2000 Monaco Diplomat 38D with a Cummins ISC 8.3, just traded by the original owner. It appeared to be highly maintained and tastefully optioned/upgraded, and made the impression of being an incredible "bang for the buck." 155,000 miles on the odometer, asking $29,950.
Over the years, I have purchased a number of older, well-maintained, cars, trucks, motorcycles, boats and airplanes. At the end of the day, old is old and there are potential pitfalls, no matter how loved the machine has been. But the value of buying something I could have never afforded new, but has a lot of remaining life, has always been very attractive to me. If I could find a pre-DEF 2008-ish model year quality coach for a good price, right back to something like the 2000 Monaco referenced above, I think that would be in my sweet-spot. I am open to guidance from anybody that has gone through a similar thought process.
As I am in the early stages of trying to learn much more about DP coaches, one thing I have not got a handle on is seat-belted positions aft of the driver and copilot seats. Is there a timeframe (or a manufacturer) that is more likely to have seat belts installed at the sofas, dinettes or chairs? I'd like to be able to secure at least two more passengers, aside from the up-front seating positions. I feel like our family is much more insulated from injury in the cab of our modern pick-up truck while hauling a fifth wheel, with numerous airbags and other safety features than we would ever be in a big, rolling fiberglass box greatly devoid federally mandated safety features. But seat belts would appease me a bit. I welcome comments from those who have weighed the safety of riding in a tow rig vs. a Class A. I've seen the post-crash pictures of both self-contained and towable RVs; it's clear the RV structure does little to protect human occupants, but the tow vehicle seems to come out better most of the time. So it's not a trivial consideration.
I know posts from newbies trying to make a decision come along all too frequently. But I do not think there is a better way to learn than gaining perspective from those who have passed this trail ahead of me. I won't be disappointed to be talked out of a Class A, as I'm certain a change in fifth wheels would get us back in the road again. And that's the main goal. But we sure like the idea of all of us sharing the living space as we roll, being able to pull over at anytime to use the amenities, etc. I hope to be primed and ready to act when this virus is on the down swing!
Thanks, and take care of yourselves, and each other (from a distance).
Here is a great LINK that may help in the decision - as Wolf learned a lot over the two years and despite all the recommendations to try used first he purchased a new DutchStar from Newmar..
How do I even Start looking for a good Class A
While a little long it appears you have a little time on your hands so the read may be interesting, and may help fill some time.
Hoping you have a larger screen to work from in the RV. in reading your post it appears you are pretty handy so used will not be an issue, but once you decide post again to get as much feedback as possible on the chosen Coach.
First and most Important IMHO, will be to List the Mission - then to go through that list and prioritize what you NEED - Want and would Like, as the likes often overshadow the NEEDS!
FloorPlan, FloorPlan, FloorPlan, FloorPlan did I mention FLOORPLAN ๐ - next is Quality of the Build (Manufacturer) and level of Quality - I'm a big fan of Wood - Solid Wood - Engine and where it lands in the DEF world - again IMHO - Big Deal - Tires and Age/Quality - Storage - inside or out as it grew older - as most coaches in the 12-20 year category age painted and Paint Checking is common on most that were stored outside - For me personally I use the Coach in the Winter so heat - non Propane was a big deal - Hydro Hot and it's condition...........as you can tell I could go on an on - a PM might just be better if you think I could help more.
OH, then after the Class A decision, then you need to start thinking about the TOAD, ๐
Read through the recommended Link - maybe ask the question again on that forum - as it seems to be a lot more active.
Hoping this is of some help.
Best of Luck,
C20 wrote:
Might look at some of the older beavers. Good quality coaches from what I've heard. We've been very happy with our 08 itasca. Ours is high mileage at almost 100k. It would be in the 70-100k range with the miles on it. The miles are nothing to the chassis.
Having owed a 40โ 98 Beaver Patriot, I agree the woodwork was excellent BUT the air over hydraulic disk brakes had recalls and were not as good as straight air brakes. The parking brake on the driveshaft is expensive to fix (no parts) and eventually it will give problems.
Around 2003-04 Monaco was putting the Beavers on the RoadMaster chassis... much better. Most 04-06 Beaver owners were unhappy with the Cat Accert engines... not just the decreased mpg. I was looking for a fairly new 04 Beaver to get 4 slides, fortunately I found a 04 42โ Dynasty instead... a great MH.
โ38 or largerโ be careful then on the amount of CCC for 40โ in that era on a single rear axle. They added tag axle for increased CCC and a big plus is better handling. I made the mistake of starting too small (36โ) because of the BS that 36โ is the largest for public CGs. I now say โBuy more DP than you think you need...ONE TIME!
