3000W Chinese Gensets Info.

[professor95]

professor95 wrote:
EDIT ADDED 45/5/2013- When this thread started in March of 2005, I never expected to see it survive this long or amass the quantity of information that has been shared here.

In the eight year run of this thread we have amassed almost 10,000 postings and surpassed a million views. This creates somewhat of a dilemma for anyone who has just discovered the forum.

Since the amount of information is virtually overwhelming, I suggest you set your preferences for this thread to read "newest first" and then begin to page backwards.

What you will find in these pages is a wealth of info on virtually any make or model of Chinese manufactured synchronous (non-inverter) generator in the 3,000 watt performance class. Info will include how to rewire series coils to parallel to obtain maximum wattage from a single 120 volt outlet. Tips on further reducing sound levels, how to care for these generators, which ones are "RV ready" and provide the best overall performance for the dollar invested. Which companies NOT to deal with, where the best prices are, how to safely wire the generator into a home or RV, how to check your RV for electrical faults, sources for generator accessories, which 20/30 adapters are safe to use and which are not. How to convert a gasoline generator to propane or NG. This is only the beginning. The forum has a life of its own with the focus sub-topic switching frequently. Still, the main topic of utilizing the amazing, inexpensive Chinese gensets is always there. The amount of creativity and innovation presented in these pages is indicative of the talents shared in the diverse backgrounds of the folks who make up our combined RV community.

Many of the original brands and models of Chinese gensets mentioned in the introduction and early pages of the thread have since disappeared. New EPA and CARB emissions requirements, company bonds assuring the emissions warranty will be honored even if the company goes out of business, and fierce competition in the industry have changed the playing field. Champion Power Equipment has become the apparent "trophy team" providing an ever expanding retail outlet, an ample parts supply, a strong warranty and excellent customer service. CPE has continued to improve their product and now offers a new model (#46538) with exclusive convenience, safety and performance features aimed at the RV market. Big names like Cummins/Onan, Honda and Generac all now have Chinese built open frame synchronous gensets available. Ironically, the prices often found on these gensets has not significantly changed during the past eight years - even with the devaluation of the American Dollar and new EPA/CARB requirements.

I also encourage you to use the search function and even the advanced search options to find information. Key works such as "rewiring", "PowerPro", "Champion", "Onan Homesite", "Duropower", "ETQ", "Jiung Dong or JD", "Tractor Supply", "Costco", "Lowe's" and "Home Depot" are all examples of keywords that will give you specific information on different models being sold by retailers today.

Or, you can fill your glass with your favorite beverage (keep more close by - maybe some munchies as well :D, sit back at your computer, tell your wife (or significant other) that you will see her in the morning and spend the next 10 or so hours reading through the postings.

No one on the forum gets mad if you ask a question that is a repeat. Please do not hesitate to post to the forum. All questions are considered important and those active on the forum will do their best to respond with a valid answer.

Also note we are not out to knock the Honda, Yamaha, Kipor or other brands of high end digital gensets. We recognize the quality of these products and their suitability for quite, efficient RV use. But, there is a flood of reliable, inexpensive and comparatively lower cost gensets coming out of China that are excellent alternative choices for the RVer wanting power to run an air conditioner, microwave, etc. without excessive noise or breaking the budget.

Oh, one last thing. The folks on this forum are true gentlemen. We do not flame one another or the product discussed - period. Ugly contributors usually have their comments and remarks ignored by our masses. It is not a forum to start arguments to obtain a clear win. We do disagree on many issues, but we have all agreed to do that in a respectable manner.

We now have the introduction of more and more inverter gensets. There is a rather extensive thread named "The Official Unofficial Champion 2000i Generator" on this forum. Today, I added info on the new Champion 3100i inverter genset. Discussion on this product may get moved to its own thread at a later date.

Many have looked upon this thread with distain saying Chinese is cheap and doomed to failure. I remember saying exactly the same thing about Japanese products a few decades back. But, over the past eight years the track record for Chinese built generators has shown otherwise.

Please, join us in a fascinating journey down the Chinese built genset road of knowledge.

This is the question I posted that got it all started back in March 2005.......

Randy

For a little over a month now, I have been somewhat intrigued by the availability of a 3000 watt, 6.5 HP generator at Pep Boys and Northern Tool for under $300.00. The engine on this generator looks identical to a Honda 6.5 HP OHV engine. Knowing that the Chinese have become very adept at “cloning” reputable technologies from other manufacturers, I was not surprised at the similarities. Neither store could give me any information on the generator nor did they have a “running” display model.

I have done a little research. This is what I have discovered:

Many of these generators are imported by ELIM International (www.eliminternational.com) out of Buffalo, New York from Jiung Manufacturing in China. (The unit at Northern is identical but carries the JIUNG name.)

The engines are indeed a Chinese knockoff of the popular 6.5 HP 196cc Honda Engine. “Supposedly” Honda has licensed the engine technology to the Chinese manufacturer of the product.

The Chinese company that makes the ELM3000 generators is a rather large, diverse, long-standing company with a reputation for “above average quality” Chinese made products (Jiung Manufacturing). There are many more Chinese companies making almost identical gensets.

The generators at PepBoys do have a six month limited warranty. But, it is only on the engine (not the generator) and requires paying for shipping to and from Buffalo. Probably not a very practical thing to do if you have warranty issues.

ELIM does supply replacement parts (a PDF parts manual is available on the ELIM web site). No prices are given for replacement parts nor is there an “availability listing”.

The generator head itself is a brushless design. The only really significant wear parts in the generator are the bearings – most likely universally available.

The published dB rating is 67 at 23 feet. This is “reasonably” quite for a generator of this size as most comparabl.... The 67 dB rating is the same as Honda gives their 3000 watt CycloInverter with a “look alike” eng...

[bwloans]

professor95 wrote:

bwloans wrote:
Well, just found out yesterday that a new unit will not be put in...according to the dealer, Fleetwood and Coleman(Airxcel) have determined that a hard-start kit needs to be installed. The say that Fleetwood does not order the A/C units with capacitors that will start A/C...I don't think this is the answer, but....

Alas, Fleetwood seems to be cutting a lot of corners in their products. I could write a book about what they left off or had to redo on my 2005 Regal. All told, the repair work while it was in warranty vastly exceeded any profit they might have had in the beginning.

But, this is not a Fleetwood quality forum, so I will refrain.

I would not worry too much about them adding a hard start kit to your AC. It should solve your problem. I just think it is sad.... no, let me restate that...... I think it is a (expletive) shame they can't do it right when they build the things!

Well, just as I thought, hard start kit did not work...we are now waiting for authorization for a new A/C unit...2 weeks and counting in the shop....

[stockrex]

dunno if the TN homier sale location is close to you,

http://www.homier.com/retaillocations.asp

but they have the champion clone for 199$

I bought one on my way back to MI from WI yest. at Hammond, IN (right off I-90)

still in the box, maybe tomorrow if I get some time I will open it up and take some pics.

this is the item
http://www.homier.com/detail.asp?dpt=13&cat=188&sku=03237


Prof, sorry I was typing hurriedly before the concierge lounge closed, there is no free internet in my room...

No problem, I will remind you when you get back, enjoy you weekend.


FYI: I saw manual tfr switch in Menard (they are having their 17% of brown paper back sale)
http://www.connecticut-electric.com/switch.asp

the smallest switch was $186, OUCH...

will take some pics of my coleman with the robin subaru motor and the homier unit.

the Homier did not have either a RV plug or a 4 prong plug???

any know the steps to sway one of the regular 3 prong to a RV plug??

I am guessing no 220V also??


FYI: checkers, and their sister chains will HONOR any ad special from partamerica.com website,

[berniealvey]

The Champion C46535 is out of stock but the C46540 is in stock for $329 and it has the RV 30amp plug already on it. I believe it is the same except it says it has 4000 surge watts and the 46535 has 4450. Would you get this one instead of the 46535? I would not have to buy any adapters so I think the $30 difference would make up for that. Does anyone know where you can buy one close to Kentucky so you dont have to pay the $100 shipping cost? I would like to pick it up at the warehouse.

[Vic2]

They have the All Power 2000 Camping Mate made by Kipor (as indicated on the label atop the unit) at our local Pepboys. The price is $699 and none of the staff can tell me much about it. No return allowed if it doesn't meet my needs, so I passed on it.

[mavapa]

Prof, that looks very interesting. I hope you do finish and let us see the results.

[professor95]

Gene,

Please send me your personal e-mail via PM. I have some info to share that might be helpful.

[Gene-C]

I have the Champion c46540 RV ready generator. I am happy with its performance and intend to use it with my RV. I have been working for more than a week now trying to reduce the noise level. So far I have build a box to enclose it. I have a six inch round air intake with a round duct to the air intake on the left of the engine. I have moved the muffler to the outside of the box. I have a small ( about 4inch square) hole in the bottom under one of the air exits from the engine to remove that portion of the heet. I have tried venting the rest of the engine heet out the right side through different size openings with out much sucess. I have tried a 4x8 inch opening first. Then a 6x10 inch without sucess. I am still reading more about 120 degrees on top of the fuel tank inside the box. It is much hotter down below. And this is without any load on the generater and not running more than about twenty min with an outside temp of about 85 degrees.
Has any one else work in this direction and what have bee your results??

Gene-C

[professor95]

stockrex wrote:
http://www.bestconverter.com/Transfer-Relays_c_53-1.html

can I get one of these auto tfr switches to be used with the generator and my house/rv electric box?

Professor, could you pls share the steps to make a manual switch

You have two different questions in the first line.

First question: "Can I get one of these auto tfr switches to be used with the generator and my house electric box?"


You can use one of these with the house box, but it will require a 12 volt battery and charger to be added and connected all the time. Additionally, you would need to install a 30 amp breaker in your house pannel to feed the xfr box along with the generator. This in turn would require a sub pannel to be mounted with breakers for whatever it is you want to feed when the generator is on. Overall, it is not designed for home use. There are better devices out there to do the job.

2nd question: Can I get one of these auto tfr switches to be used with the generator and my rv electric box?

Yes

Professor, could you pls share the steps to make a manual switch

It will probably be next week before I can work it up so I can post it (heading out for VA Beach tomorrow). Please remind me if I forget....

[Toyota_Camper]

Completed my first oil change (5 hours of use) on my Homier 4000K blue generator. Glad I did oil was a grey color (normal for break in of new motor). So just a reminder to fellow chinese generator owners be sure to change your oil after break-in period.

Nate

[03screw]

ol Bombero, thanks for the heads up. I got so worrried my generator was the wrong one it totally slipped my mind. I'm pretty sure I beat this dead horse a little more, just trying to keep you guys on your toes a little more :W

Professor, thank you very much for bearing with me. I am so relieved this generator will work! Time to go wash and wax trailer before the sun breaks through the clouds :E

[professor95]

03screw wrote:
Thanks for the quick response, wasn't sure if you abandoned this thread
This is all new to me so bear with me. The model is JD3000bstf. The unit looks very basic. No volt meter, a little switch that flips to 120 or 240 service, 25/12.5a. On the outlet section- two 120vac 3 spring grounded, One 120/240v AC twist and lock
In the instruction manual it says "make sure generator capacity matches the use (115v-20amps)".
On the wiring drawing it has the two 120v plugs connected to each other if that sounds right? It shows a red & brown wire from each receptacle being connected to each other and also the blue and white, but each color getting power seperatly. The brown and white is getting power from the 240 side and the red blue from the other half.

Would I be doing damage to my a/c by not providing enough watts?

Sounds like you are OK. As previously stated, you have the second generation Nikota made by JiangDong (this is good).

The 110/220 switch is the key to making it work with your camper. When in the 110 position, the stator coils are parallel giving 24 amps. The two circuit breakers are also in parallel giving a 24 amp protection capacity.

Use the generator like it is and make no changes at this time. You should not be concerned about damaging your AC from the generator. If the AC starts and runs, all is well. If it will not start or perhaps does start and them trips one (or both) of the breakers I would (with some hesitancy) replace the double breakers on the 110 loop with a single breaker, retaining the twin breakers for the 220 loop (move breaker connections directly to the individual outlets to accomplish this).

AC units that are connected to generators that are incapable of providing enough "watts" simply do not work. No damage should result unless you repeatedly keep resetting the breaker and trying to restart the unit.

[ol_Bombero-JC]

03screw -
Just an FYI for new forum members - the search box will
sometimes save reading lengthy threads in their entirety
to supply/find the answer you are looking for.

I entered "NIKOTA" and checked tech forum only.
This brought up 79 posts - 4 pages worth - which is quite a bit easier to check and/or read than two thousand (plus) and 254 pages.

[jimhumphries]

This is a nice unit and working fine for me (I love the electric start) but ... you need to change the breaker for the RV outlet if you intend to pull the full 30 Amps. Both of the original breakers are rated at 12 Amps with one wired to the duplex outlets and the other wired to the RV outlet. When I commented on this unit earlier in this thread I hadn't run the AC for more than a few minutes. On a later visit I discovered that the breaker kept tripping after about 3 minutes with the AC on. I took the panel off and discovered the breaker rating problem.

The original breakers are thermal types and a 30 Amp drop-in replacement is avaliable from Jameco Electronics - PN 282597CM. I elected to replace mine with a 30 Amp magnetic type (Carlingswitch) and panel modifications were required for that one.

Now I can run everything at the same time. Very nice.

Jim

[jimhumphries]

Red Clay Rambler wrote:
Looks like the manufacturer might be JD, the same as the original ELM 3000 gens that the professor used to originate this thread.

Find it HERE

Scroll down page for the RV-ready model.

Not bad for an RV-ready gen with electric start, although my ELM 3000 starts first pull anyway.

[03screw]

Thanks for the quick response, wasn't sure if you abandoned this thread:B
This is all new to me so bear with me. The model is JD3000bstf. The unit looks very basic. No volt meter, a little switch that flips to 120 or 240 service, 25/12.5a. On the outlet section- two 120vac 3 spring grounded, One 120/240v AC twist and lock
In the instruction manual it says "make sure generator capacity matches the use (115v-20amps)".
On the wiring drawing it has the two 120v plugs connected to each other if that sounds right? It shows a red & brown wire from each receptacle being connected to each other and also the blue and white, but each color getting power seperatly. The brown and white is getting power from the 240 side and the red blue from the other half.

Would I be doing damage to my a/c by not providing enough watts?