Hi all, I own an RV repair shop. We have one insurance adjustor who argues with our methods almost constantly. Long stories on various issues, but they boil down to doing "adequate" vs. quality repairs.The issue concerns a damaged RV roof. It's a 35 ft motor home, 2015 model so fairly new, with extensive damage to the EPDM roof membrane. As a rule I don't like to just patch. If the damage covers a large area, to me it justifies putting a whole new, one piece membrane on. The insurance adjustor agrees with that but he balks at replacing the luan underlayment.In my experience, once the membrane is pulled up you're left with a LOT of glue to scrape off, and pulling the old roof off tends to pull chunks of the old underlayment off with it. It's difficult (sometimes impossible) to get the old surface smoothed out enough to be a viable surface for the new membrane. Over the years it's become my standard to lay down new luan and then lay down the new membrane. The result is a very smooth roof, without any question of bubbles or debris underneath that will never allow the new roof to completely glue down.This adjustor refuses to accept that (we've never run into this with any other insurance companies, and we work with many). We've reached a standoff of sorts because I feel there's no question that a 35 foot roof membrane needs new underlayment since it would be a huge area to have to smooth out. This is a fairly new RV, the owners want it done right, and I can't stand behind my work if I have to cut corners like that.I'd like to know what others do in these situations, the preferred method for quality repair.

Doesn't an insurance company warrant repair to original condition? The original condition was a one piece rubber roof. Any insurance company attorneys on the forum?

sounds to me your right,the adj is just uping his commision check on what he saves the insurance company. they get a nice kick back. I,d get the owner and maybe a second opinion and then a att. involved.

Well, This repair shop ALWAYS replaces the deck on all roof jobs. NEVER had any insurance company balk at this. Ask the Adjuster, IF you do not deck and the customer is upset(THIS WILL HAPPEN), when he sees all the debris and old glue causing small bumps and uneven rubber, will the Adjuster then auth a complete new roof WITH decking? I will bet you are dealing with Progressive or Geico. They give us the most trouble on damage estimates. DougBTW, we will NOT do a roof job unless redecking is done. We had to eat a roof 12 years ago and we will not do another one without decking. STICK to your principles. Tell the customer you refuse to do a half *** job. I will bet once the customer talks to his Ins agent, the job will be approved. Agents have a LOT of power to get things done for their clients.

as a last resort I would pay extra to have the surface replaced.bumpy

I see it like this1. tell the customer he can pay to replace the luan (insurance won't cover it) - or - 2. he can take the RV to a different shop (you won't do it the other way).Considering the time involved to prep the surface vs. a remove and replace the difference in cost can't be more then a couple of hundred $'s. If I was the customer, I'd raise hell with the insurance company but pay the couple hundred if I had to. Either way your problem is solved.

Opinions from other repair techs re: replacing rubber roof?

Lwiddis
Explorer II
Feb 15, 2018
Doesn't an insurance company warrant repair to original condition? The original condition was a one piece rubber roof. Any insurance company attorneys on the forum?
midnightsadie
Explorer II
Feb 15, 2018
sounds to me your right,the adj is just uping his commision check on what he saves the insurance company. they get a nice kick back. I,d get the owner and maybe a second opinion and then a att. involved.
dougrainer
Nomad
Feb 15, 2018
Well, This repair shop ALWAYS replaces the deck on all roof jobs. NEVER had any insurance company balk at this. Ask the Adjuster, IF you do not deck and the customer is upset(THIS WILL HAPPEN), when he sees all the debris and old glue causing small bumps and uneven rubber, will the Adjuster then auth a complete new roof WITH decking? I will bet you are dealing with Progressive or Geico. They give us the most trouble on damage estimates. Doug

BTW, we will NOT do a roof job unless redecking is done. We had to eat a roof 12 years ago and we will not do another one without decking. STICK to your principles. Tell the customer you refuse to do a half *** job. I will bet once the customer talks to his Ins agent, the job will be approved. Agents have a LOT of power to get things done for their clients.
Bumpyroad
Explorer
Feb 15, 2018
as a last resort I would pay extra to have the surface replaced.
bumpy
troubledwaters
Explorer III
Feb 15, 2018
I see it like this
1. tell the customer he can pay to replace the luan (insurance won't cover it)
- or -
2. he can take the RV to a different shop (you won't do it the other way).

Considering the time involved to prep the surface vs. a remove and replace the difference in cost can't be more then a couple of hundred $'s. If I was the customer, I'd raise hell with the insurance company but pay the couple hundred if I had to. Either way your problem is solved.
ScottG
Nomad
Feb 15, 2018
Just had our roof replaced and they left most of the old underlayment (I think). I can tell some of the luan came apart towards the back. They just glued the rubber down to the voids.
Looks like krap but seems tight - for now.
Northood tries to use quality materials but workmanship is worse than most (or all) other brands.
AmerRV
Explorer
Feb 15, 2018
Thank you troubledwaters, that's our thinking too. But we get stuck between the customer (who has often been a very satisfied customer for years) and this crazy adjustor. We just can't hang our good customers out to dry. The current situation is a new customer, but he's so great to work with we'd hate to lose his future business.

This one adjustor is just a problem every time we deal with him, which is frequently. The customers can't stand him and he makes everything so difficult. We just shipped a repair this week that we did our original estimate in June 2017 (!). The adjustor got stuck on something about a vacuum-bonded rear wall. He contacted the RV manufacturer, and anybody else who might back him up, but got nowhere. Yet he still insisted it needed a vacuum-bonded wall (he was sure it was cheaper than the way our estimate stated). We've never heard of a vacuum-bonded wall. The customer did raise hell with him, and with his supervisor, but got nowhere. In the end we did the repairs exactly as stated on our June 2017 estimate.

The adjustor also doesn't care if it's a 20 year old RV or a brand new one (the one that just left was a 2017 model). He wants to go cheap.

Your opinion is the common sense approach, and that's the approach we take. But it's a sticking point that we truly care about both our work product and our customers. Appreciate your reply!
AmerRV
Explorer
Feb 15, 2018
This is a pic of how our roof replacements look when we're done - how they SHOULD look. We've never had a single complaint.
AmerRV
Explorer
Feb 15, 2018
Lwiddis wrote:
Doesn't an insurance company warrant repair to original condition? The original condition was a one piece rubber roof. Any insurance company attorneys on the forum?

That's my understanding -- they have to put them back in pre-loss condition: as good as it was before the damage. When we're talking about a nearly brand new RV, there should be no question.
AmerRV
Explorer
Feb 16, 2018
dougrainer wrote:
Well, This repair shop ALWAYS replaces the deck on all roof jobs. NEVER had any insurance company balk at this. Ask the Adjuster, IF you do not deck and the customer is upset(THIS WILL HAPPEN), when he sees all the debris and old glue causing small bumps and uneven rubber, will the Adjuster then auth a complete new roof WITH decking? I will bet you are dealing with Progressive or Geico. They give us the most trouble on damage estimates. Doug

BTW, we will NOT do a roof job unless redecking is done. We had to eat a roof 12 years ago and we will not do another one without decking. STICK to your principles. Tell the customer you refuse to do a half *** job. I will bet once the customer talks to his Ins agent, the job will be approved. Agents have a LOT of power to get things done for their clients.

Haha! How did you know it was Progressive? Too funny.

Thanks for the reinforcement. That is our stand too. If you won't let me do it the way it has to be done, we won't do it. Sometimes it's an easy call: new customer who wants us to eat the difference and is unwilling to pay it themselves. We're not hurting for work and won't accept those conditions. This is an issue that shouldn't concern us - it's to be decided between the insurance company and their customer. And we've never had it come up with any other insurance company before. Or for that matter, with any other adjustor. If they question why we're doing it that way, the explanation is always adequate for approval.