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Dual hitch adapter.. De-rating when extending hitch.

rerod
Explorer
Explorer
Hello..

My Tow vehicle is a 97 dodge 2500 CTD and I'd like to attach two things to the hitch using a dual hitch adapter.. On top I'd like to mount the Ultimate MX Hauler to carry a drz400 which weighs about 300 lbs. On the bottom receiver I'd like to possibly pull a small camper like a geo-pro, or maybe a 7x16 cargo trailer conversion. All within the 10K rating of the dual adapter I was looking at, but it looks like I would need to extend the bottom hitch maybe 12" for the trailer and motorcycle to clear each other.

How much do I de rate the hitch and receiver if I extend the trailer hitch out 12"?

Thanks

Hauler lift..
12 valve ram
24 REPLIES 24

Grit_dog
Nomad III
Nomad III
JRscooby wrote:
Grit dog wrote:


Regarding the universal 3500lb rating. Pffft. Towed an (estimated) 6500-7klb trailer with no lack of tongue weight from here to Anchorage during mud season, where all the frost heaves were still very much at their max. 18” “3500lb” extension hanging off a factory 2” receiver. Never questioned it and it never gave any problems.


I would be surprised if anybody ever had a failure of the extension itself. After all, to bend a wire you need to hold one side of bend, put force on the other. Any extension will increase the force applied to hitch. If hitch, mounting, and even vehicle, is not designed to absorb that force, something gives.
Now the OP wants to add extra points for looseness, plus a 300+ hammer beating on the hitch and mounting plus do it full time.


Yup that was my point. The hitch extension, is a very stout cheater pipe. And to not get the bonus points for looseness, I’d jam a large flat washer r 2 under the stinger on the extension and under the stinger on the hitch ball. I think they make contraptions for that. But I liked the $free.99 solution.
One fell out once but I think it was on a washboard road. So I started setting them tight with a tap from a hammer and flat screwdriver. Gave that whole setup the rigidity of a guy who just doubled down on the viagras (so I’m told…).
2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29 - Sold.
Couple of Arctic Fox TCs - Sold

Grit_dog
Nomad III
Nomad III
I think he said he’s got a 2nd gen Dodge HD. So it’s got lots of springs already. A chubby dirt bike and a smallish trailer may not need anything. The rear spring packs on 2nd gens are built like a shiit brickhouse. Lol.
Yes the super combo of a double bubble receiver and big extension plugged into the bottom for the trailer seems doable. It’s just a really bad way to go about the whole thing. And very expensive considering the feller appears to not be made of money.

From his original post, a 12” extension will put the camper tongue ball the better part of 2” under the bike and the handlebars will be might close to the front of the trailer. I guess which way you load the bike could determine the only direction you could turn that day!
2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29 - Sold.
Couple of Arctic Fox TCs - Sold

blt2ski
Moderator
Moderator
Grit,
reality, an extension for mount, and trailer hitch itself. I need to add a foot of hitch to one trailer to get it to go around, and jackknife my flatbeds. Typical pickups with a 3.5-4' hitch worked. But a flatbed 8' wide, one needs 4.5-5' of tongue length.
Those extensions I linked are for pickups with 10-12' bed campers, s those folks can tow with out supet long tongue extensions.
It's going to come down to a, OP will need to take ALL of our thoughts, put a positive and negative to the equation, maybe come up with a answer.
If this was me, depending upon the age of truck, I would do a hitch extension as I linked. Along with extending the trailer tongue, or if still in buying stage, have the manufacture build a longer tongue, so I can jack knife around the bike.
I would also add a leaf, or just plain replace the current rear springs with another 1500-2000 lbs of rating, so the rear does not say as much as the lighter springs. Potentially making it so not too much weight is pulled off the FA.
With that, I don't feel their is a single bullet point to do what the OP wants. It could mean literally needing to go with a heavier suspension rig too.

Marty
92 Navistar dump truck, 7.3L 7 sp, 4.33 gears with a Detroit no spin
2014 Chevy 1500 Dual cab 4x4
92 Red-e-haul 12K equipment trailer

Grit_dog
Nomad III
Nomad III
^Theres a couple good solutions but that long arse contraption of a MC rack ain’t one of them. It takes up far too much length to be practical in the scenario of also towing a trailer.
If anyone including the OP took 10 seconds to look at the dimensions of it in the link he posted, they would understand what I’m saying.
Using that thing, next steps would be “I don’t want a huge long hitch extension so maybe lengthening the trailer tongue (of the mythical trailer that doesn’t exist yet) would allow a shorter extension.
Just trying to save the OP expense and trouble. Nothing more.
2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29 - Sold.
Couple of Arctic Fox TCs - Sold

JRscooby
Explorer II
Explorer II
Grit dog wrote:


Regarding the universal 3500lb rating. Pffft. Towed an (estimated) 6500-7klb trailer with no lack of tongue weight from here to Anchorage during mud season, where all the frost heaves were still very much at their max. 18” “3500lb” extension hanging off a factory 2” receiver. Never questioned it and it never gave any problems.


I would be surprised if anybody ever had a failure of the extension itself. After all, to bend a wire you need to hold one side of bend, put force on the other. Any extension will increase the force applied to hitch. If hitch, mounting, and even vehicle, is not designed to absorb that force, something gives.
Now the OP wants to add extra points for looseness, plus a 300+ hammer beating on the hitch and mounting plus do it full time.

blt2ski
Moderator
Moderator
The link I did, WAS ment for the towing part of equation. Assuming the upper tube would hold the bike.

Putting an extended 2" bar a foot or so is not an issue. I was given one 18-24" for my equipment to tow with my Navistar from the bed manufacture. This got the ball mount beyond behind the flaybed. Needless to say, the first time someone forgot to remove the mount, dumping the bed. Mount and bed were bent. I've stuck with as short of mounts as I can since. No issues with the bed hitting the mount dumping.
I'm of the opinion, yes opposite of mkirsh, not holding his NO against him, this can be done, safely and sanely. It will take some ingenuity with a welder etc.
I would also derat total trailer rating from 10k lbs, by the hw percentage divided by bike and it's components. Say total 300 lbs, that's 3000 lb derate of trailer capacity. It appears like he's towing a max 3000-5000 lbs of trailer. IMHO below ratings overall.
OP will still have to deal with unloading part of FA with that load behind. A stiffer higher capacity spring pack could alleviate that part of the issue.
Reason I say this, is my ET with 1500 lbs of HW, with Navistar 16k rear suspension loses less that 100 lbs off the FA. My dually 3500 with an 8500 rear springs, lost 300 lbs, and a SW 3500 WL 6400 lb springs lost 400. Latter truck handling issues were felt due to amount of the FA.
My background etc on where my brain is going with this.
I'm probably more positive on a solution than some are.

Marty.
92 Navistar dump truck, 7.3L 7 sp, 4.33 gears with a Detroit no spin
2014 Chevy 1500 Dual cab 4x4
92 Red-e-haul 12K equipment trailer

mkirsch
Nomad II
Nomad II
Just answering the question that was asked, hoping that the OP will take my answer as a "NO" as to whether his idea will work.

The extension is by its own labeling de-rated to well below the ratings of anything else in the system.

I too can "pfft" as my twig-n-berries extension isn't rated at all. It's a Curt 18" weldable receiver tube drilled for a cross pin at 12" of extension, and inserted into the 2-1/2" receiver on my truck. I've towed 6000+ with it, probably more.

Putting 10-ply tires on half ton trucks since aught-four.

Grit_dog
Nomad III
Nomad III
Marty, mkirsch I think is right. Any of the plug n play 2” extensions are universally rated for 3500lbs. Afaik. That said how could an 8” extension not be stronger than a 24” extension of the same construction. The rating is likely a cya because the mfg doesn’t know what kind of receiver it’s going into (which is what will likely break first if overloaded, before the extension).
What you posted is a link to a Cannon or Super Truss extension. The OP would actually need a long extension similar to a Cannon in the bottom tube of a super hitch to even think about it working with that bike carrier thing. So on that front, good suggestion.

Regarding the universal 3500lb rating. Pffft. Towed an (estimated) 6500-7klb trailer with no lack of tongue weight from here to Anchorage during mud season, where all the frost heaves were still very much at their max. 18” “3500lb” extension hanging off a factory 2” receiver. Never questioned it and it never gave any problems.
2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29 - Sold.
Couple of Arctic Fox TCs - Sold

blt2ski
Moderator
Moderator
(url)https://torkliftcentral.com/rving-and-towing/truck-campers/extended-towing-systems(/url)

Not sure if that will clicky, that's torklifts extension options. They go upwards of 7500 lbs of tow capacity.
It appears that they can do a setup as required by OP.

Marty
92 Navistar dump truck, 7.3L 7 sp, 4.33 gears with a Detroit no spin
2014 Chevy 1500 Dual cab 4x4
92 Red-e-haul 12K equipment trailer

mkirsch
Nomad II
Nomad II
Well, I've never seen a commercially available 12" extension that was rated for more than 350lb tongue weight, 3500lb trailer weight.

So, to answer the original question as asked, you would have to limit your trailer to 3500lbs.

Putting 10-ply tires on half ton trucks since aught-four.

blt2ski
Moderator
Moderator
Grit, Guess we can say happy birthday. but your 11 yrs younger than me! Probably 20+ younger than a few others around here.
THen again, at 50 6 month, I got to live again, youngest was not one of them smart alek teenagers any more. THen again, if you kids are teenagers still.....you're still "REALLY OLD"
Im 8+ years from being an "olde phart!" Cummins 12v might be close to or over the "really Olde Phart" decade, ie 80!

SPouses B-day too, shes got a couple of years on me!

Marty
92 Navistar dump truck, 7.3L 7 sp, 4.33 gears with a Detroit no spin
2014 Chevy 1500 Dual cab 4x4
92 Red-e-haul 12K equipment trailer

Grit_dog
Nomad III
Nomad III
bucky wrote:
"Run along now dog.." I'm still laughing. I've blocked said Dog so many times but I guess I'm addicted and unblock him after a day or two.
He or she is a cranky old soul but says what others are thinking and as such is a valuable member on this forum.


Ain’t that the truth…turned 51 today….if that ain’t over the hill…lol.
And yes I’m probably a bit crankier since Ive had some devastating life changing events recently, but I “think” I‘ve been consistent in my responses.
I’ll add, my posts are generally very helpful for those who actually care to read, think about or research and accept what I’m saying from experience. Honestly trying to be helpful. But it’s hard to say “we lol gee maybe, I think, you might want to, maybe, umm, icbw but, …..etc”.
I’m a get your point across a move on kinda person.

I’d rather someone tell me like it is and make me think about something whether I think I agree with it or not, than to blow smoke up my skirt and tell me what to hear and not hurt my feelers.
2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29 - Sold.
Couple of Arctic Fox TCs - Sold

Grit_dog
Nomad III
Nomad III
rerod wrote:
Grit dog wrote:

Tried to help him years ago with trailer selection and realized there’s no use.


So why try again and then belittle me? I'm trying to motivate myself to spend money to become homeless, and get your attitude again. Run along now dog..

To the rest of you.. Thanks.. Sounds like the receiver will hold, but I still don't know how much you re rate a receiver when you start to extend the hitch..


Just tryin to save you from what I recognized as a poor, at best, but almost impossible combination, in reality. You can tell me what I’m missing with the measurements if you’d like though. I’m open and honest and if I’m wrong I’ll admit it….
Cheers!
2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29 - Sold.
Couple of Arctic Fox TCs - Sold

Grit_dog
Nomad III
Nomad III
JRscooby wrote:
Doing more thinking. I know my ideas may not be good, but thinking about bad ideas have produced good ones.
The fact OP wants to haul outside bed implies some weight in bed. Then TW will transfer some weight from front to rear axle, plus more than TW to rear axle.
On any truck, the axle least likely to be overloaded is front.
If going to build custom hitch, build it to mount on front. Still need 2 point mount*, but that extra 400-500 lbs will not be messing with trailer.

Do you need to mount at 2 places? To slide into the receiver, you need play on side and top. Call it 1/16 inch. (Likely more) How far above the tire rail is SOG of bike? Plus rail will be above mount. I'm betting that SOG will be couple feet from mount. So that SOG will move well over inch. With inch stroke, a 300lb hammer can deliver a bell of a wallop. And there will be a lot of wallops per mile.


Front hitch with bike carrier (not the one proposed) is a far better idea scooby.

Edit, to other responses, yes I too am assuming rerod is planning on a bed full of other stuff or a topper or ??? Otherwise the glaringly obvious solution is to load the double dog bike in the truck bed.
2016 Ram 2500, MotorOps.ca EFIlive tuned, 5” turbo back, 6" lift on 37s
2017 Heartland Torque T29 - Sold.
Couple of Arctic Fox TCs - Sold