Fords 6.7 Scorpion Diesel motor

[1Longbow]

Anyone have any long term experience with this motor,such as towing ,likes ,dislikes. I like the looks of the Super Duty,but did'nt like the 6.0 motor. Just wondering about the new one. Thank you

[FishOnOne]

Cummins12V98 wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:

AH64ID wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:


Also Ford ditched the cummins in the F650/F750!

Not according to Ford....

http://www.ford.com/commercial-trucks/f650-f750/

They are planning to drop it for the MY16 trucks, but those are not out yet. Initial info from Ford has the ISB available with more hp/tq than the 6.7 PSD.

Let me restate then... Ford is in the process of ditching the cummins engine and will only offer their V10 and 6.7 Power Stroke engines in the F650/F750 trucks.

In addition Ford is retooling a plant here in the US to build these F650/F750 trucks.

Built in the USA by a US company... :B

Now let's have full disclosure here. Where is that engine made that is going into the F650/750's?

Yes the same place my RAM is assembled.

Sure... And where are the parts of the engine made... USA my friend but perhaps that's not important to you. Having said that there's various parts made from foreign locations.

I enjoy driving my "Made in the USA" truck by an American company... something your truck lacks and that's a shame... but Macaronni is OK with that... Go figure.

[blt2ski]

NinerBikes wrote:

blt2ski wrote:

W4RLR wrote:

NinerBikes wrote:


Ford's track record with building diesels... 3 attempts now, since Navistar got smart and dumped Ford. 6.0, 6.4, now 6.7. Nothing has changed, when it comes to their engineers designing diesel engines.

Cummins track record? Duramax track record? You tell me.

Ford 6.0 Powerstroke is a Navistar VT 365
Ford 6.4 Powerstroke is a Navistar Maxxforce 7.

The Ford 6.7 Scorpion was designed and built by Ford. All previous engines were built by Navistar, including the 7.3.

Ford has tweaked ALL of the diesels since they have used them from Navistar. The only one maybe not tweaked, and even then I would not bet on it is the IDI6.9. The IDI7.3 max HP/torque from navistar is 175/335, I have one, pretty gutless overall in a 26K navistar MDT. For tweaked it to 185/385 to keep up with the 6.5td specs. The turbo idi7.3 was also a tweaked motor, as that motor was never designed to have a turbo on it, as was the idi6.9. BUT a lot of folks put one on it, including Ford for a year. With a few overheat issues if you had the auto and AC option. You got one or the other, or similar overheat issues the GM had with the 6.5td.

The T444e/7.3psd was maxed at 235/620 from navistar and ~2800 rpm. Ford took it to 275 and the upper 500 lb range with 3500 rpm.

Do not recall what all Ford did to the 6.0 ad 6.4, but I am pretty sure the let them also go beyond the 2800 navistar limited them to to get into the 300+ hp range. The 6.0 was an intermediate motor tween the 7.3 and 6.4, never to be put into production for long.

Marty

I had an 88 F-250 Custom with the 7.3 IDI... and as I recall, it was a California model, and was not even 175 HP, something like 170 or 168HP, if I recall correctly, to make CARB happy. 260k miles on it when I sold it with 5speed overdrive manual for $5000 in 2001. Delvac 1300 always 15w-40... 21 to 22 mpg empty on highway at 60-65 mph, lots of times to Mammoth Lakes and back to L.A.

Could very well have been that low. The 5.9 had a 160/380-400 spec IIRC when it first came out. With the IDI 7.3, there were three HP specs, IIRC 135, 155 and 175. Mostly put in bus's doing local school routes. Did not need a lot of HP to move loads to 26K, with speeds to 35-45 mph typical. A diesel with gas power specs when Navistar got out of building gas engines. Price a bit more than gas, but not enough to scare folks. IIRC it was a $2K option for my rig. The DT360 equal to a B5.9 would have been over 6K for a 185/500 or so torque rig. I have 135K on a 92, not sure a 500K mile motor is any better at $6k extra vs a 100K mile motor for a general mileage stat before rebuild with my 7.3. Still runs, but it is tired.

Are you sure you had a 7.3 in 88? or was that one of the first years? thought it was a 6.9 about then......but memory could be screwing with me too!

Marty

[OldGreaser]

If the original poster is still following this, I have a 2011 6.7 with 96,500 miles on it. I tow an 18,000 lb 5th wheel with a pin weight of 4,000 lbs, verified with individual wheel weights. Trailer has been towed about 38,000 miles.

The problems I've experienced that were fixed under warranty:
-windshield air squeal, started around 50k miles. Windshield resealed.
-intermittent diesel odor in cab. Repaired an exhaust leak.
-windshield washer fitting broke.
I suffered a battery failure that I think was premature, around two years. This wasn't warranted.
Tire life has been excellent. My first set went 83,000 miles. I had them rotated twice in that time, which included cost of popping tires off of rims. Oil changes are done when computer says it's time, usually around 8-9,000 miles. I ask for fuel filter & water trap changes every 2nd change.

Ownership experience has been outstanding. Upholstery still looks new, all electronics work flawlessly, no annoying squeaks or rattles, no failed light bulbs, runs like new except slightly better fuel mileage.
Biggest complaint is the rear brakes will often squawk in parking lot maneuvers. I am on my 2nd set of pads, wondering if I should have gone aftermarket to reduce noise. Beyond that, I wish maintenance was cheaper and I wish I got better mileage.
FWIW, I test drove all three options extensively and thoroughly liked them all. I wanted to buy the Ram, but back in 2011 the 3500 wasn't rated for my trailer. I thought the ride was a bit smoother than Ford, and they offered me a screaming deal. Chev/GM drove well, but they wouldn't deal, so that left Ford which gave me an excellent deal. It has worked out well for me.

[Bionic_Man]

FishOnOne wrote:

ib516 wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:

marspec wrote:
I don't know if there's been any changes but I posted the following in February on another topic:

My son is the head Ford diesel tech at his dealership. Talked to him last night and asked about his experience with the 6.7. They have not had a single injection pump or turbo replacement. They have had a "few" EGR problems with service vehicles that had many hours of idle time. They did have an early one with a cam/valve problem. Ford replaced that engine with a new one and had it sent back for autopsy. Mine only has 12K towing a 16K fiver for over 10K but hasn't seen the inside of a dealership but for one oil change when I was on the road.

Since then I have just over 20K on my 6.7 with 17.5K of that towing with no problems.

In addition like I mentioned earlier my cousin is a long time Ford diesel tech starting in '93. The dealership he works at sells Ford, Chrysler, Jeep, RAM. He basically now works full time on RAM cummins trucks simply because the repair work in the Ford shop has dropped significantly since the 6.7 PSD has been introduced. In addition this dealer sells ~ 4 Power Strokes to 1 Cummins yet there's more techs working in the Chrysler shop.

His experience on warranty repairs between Ford and RAM is that he never had a problem with Ford denying warranty and their process is fairly simple, and with Chrysler there's more red tape he has to go thru to get approval. One thing common is both manufactures are frugal with the time they pay for a particular warranty repair.

This guy would disagree with your cousin:

"I ran some reports last night and we have done a couple 2011 and 2012 engines. I was really stunned at the amount of radiators and DPF's that had been done. More the radiators. DPF's dont really suprise me. most of these trucks are bucket trucks and that is a totally different ball game when it comes to reliablility. Specially with all the idle time they get. Heres the thing though and im not totally knocking Ford and you guys are prolly going to crenge when i say this but i have SEVERAL Dodge bucket trucks with Cummins and have had Zero issues with them. I was looking at the data on those and we have several 2010 trucks pushing 200k that have only had oil changes, brakes, and tires. I know one thing. I am so tired buying injectors for 6.0's and replacing all of the fuel systems on the 6.4's. Oh that was another thing. I have seen several of the 6.7 trashed fuel system due to "WATER IN THE FUEL". What the hell is that about? Well i know what its about but no one will do anything about it."

When challenged about his info and who he works for, he posted:

"I work for one of the larger land line telecommunications companies in the nation. We are in 48 states. Most of our diesels are bucket trucks and spend a lot of time idling or in high idle. High idle doesn't seen to be enough of a load to work the emissions on these trucks. I've been watching some of our long haul trucks that do a lot more road time and they seem to do better than the ones that stay in the air. These things aren't grocery gitters and I really think people are buying diesels for the wrong reasons. The diesels today aren't the diesels of yesterday. They need to be worked. We are buying 850 new vehicles this year and 60 of them are F-450's and will be gas. We have done lots of analysis and between the cost of maintenance and repair cost gas is a better option. When I have to replace an engine in a bucket diesel I try to buy running complete that way all the fuel system and emissions is covered under warranty. We buy Jasper but they only offer a 6.0 in a running complete. Which is about $15k. I'll buy a 6.4 and have Jasper supply all the other parts to cover every thing under the warranty. I have talked to a lot of people who oppose Jasper but I have never had them deny warranty and it doesn't matter where the truck is at."

FORD DIESEL FORUM LINK

Point is, you can find horror stories about almost any vehicle - especially these days. It's all in what you want to see & believe.

My opinion is that the big 3 diesels all have their own issues these days, mostly related to the emissions junk on them, or because of the horsepower & torque wars that are raging among them.

I agree the radiators seam to be an unacceptable problem. Again I'll get to get an update from my cousin during the holiday as he keeps his finger on the pulse for both brands and I'll report what he's seeing as far as repairs goes for '14.

Well, I for one am sitting on pins and needles waiting on your report. I can't possibly predict what it will come back with. You are always so objective.:R

[Cummins12V98]

FishOnOne wrote:

AH64ID wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:


Also Ford ditched the cummins in the F650/F750!

Not according to Ford....

http://www.ford.com/commercial-trucks/f650-f750/

They are planning to drop it for the MY16 trucks, but those are not out yet. Initial info from Ford has the ISB available with more hp/tq than the 6.7 PSD.

Let me restate then... Ford is in the process of ditching the cummins engine and will only offer their V10 and 6.7 Power Stroke engines in the F650/F750 trucks.

In addition Ford is retooling a plant here in the US to build these F650/F750 trucks.

Built in the USA by a US company... :B

Now let's have full disclosure here. Where is that engine made that is going into the F650/750's?

Yes the same place my RAM is assembled.

[Cummins12V98]

FishOnOne wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:

blofgren wrote:

The Mad Norsky wrote:
1Longbow:

here is one more for your viewing pleasure. Comes from YouTube, PowerStroke help guy. He finally gets his hand on a 6.7L Scorpion engine.

Some insightful comments made during the video. He also covers the main bearings, and their lack of keying to hold them in place, as mentioned by a previous poster.

Link: PowerStroke help critiques the 6.7L Scorpion motor

Good god this video is an eye opener. The 6.7L is a definite improvement over the 6.0L and 6.4L but still a lot of inherent design issues. I think my jaw dropped when he stated that Ford fixed the front cover design by making it leak coolant externally rather than internally when cavitation wears through the cover. How about fixing the cavitation problem to begin with? This type of thing is exactly why I did not buy another Ford; buy a truck with inherent design issues. Maybe they will rear their ugly head while the truck is on warranty and you can go and fight with Ford about getting warranty coverage. OR, maybe they will rear their ugly head after the warranty is up and the owner is on the hook for a big repair bill. No thank you.

Thanks for the video; I am feeling even better about my choice to buy the Cummins now!

You my friend are the blind leading the blind... How do you know Ford has a cavitation problem with the water pumps on the 6.7 PSD? Because Bill said so? :S

Enjoy your tractor engine... :W (According to Gale Banks and not me!)

You keep saying that! I am proud to have owned three "tractor engines". The same engine that broke the land speed record in a Dakota known as the Banks Sidewinder.

Same engines that power large gen sets running 24/7 and large boats and motorhomes and let's not forget what is the ONLY DIESEL found in the F650/750 thru the model year 2015....CUMMINS!

I thought you once said racing isn't important to you! Which is it?

Also Ford ditched the cummins in the F650/F750!

Not until the 2016 MY. They got tired of me reminding everyone of this interesting fact.

There is a difference between racing and speed!

I enjoy cruising with my RAM Dually at 104mph on occasion at 2,300 rpm's. The speed limiter kicks in at that point. 🙂

Thanks for clarifying...I just archived your statement for future reference. :W

Oh great...now I have to stick to my "stories"

[Bedlam]

The F650 and F750 will have the 6.7 Powerstroke in the summer of 2015 and be called a 2016 model.

http://www.ford.com/commercial-trucks/f650-f750/2016/

[FishOnOne]

AH64ID wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:


Also Ford ditched the cummins in the F650/F750!

Not according to Ford....

http://www.ford.com/commercial-trucks/f650-f750/

They are planning to drop it for the MY16 trucks, but those are not out yet. Initial info from Ford has the ISB available with more hp/tq than the 6.7 PSD.

Let me restate then... Ford is in the process of ditching the cummins engine and will only offer their V10 and 6.7 Power Stroke engines in the F650/F750 trucks.

In addition Ford is retooling a plant here in the US to build these F650/F750 trucks.

Built in the USA by a US company... :B

[FishOnOne]

Cummins12V98 wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:

blofgren wrote:

The Mad Norsky wrote:
1Longbow:

here is one more for your viewing pleasure. Comes from YouTube, PowerStroke help guy. He finally gets his hand on a 6.7L Scorpion engine.

Some insightful comments made during the video. He also covers the main bearings, and their lack of keying to hold them in place, as mentioned by a previous poster.

Link: PowerStroke help critiques the 6.7L Scorpion motor

Good god this video is an eye opener. The 6.7L is a definite improvement over the 6.0L and 6.4L but still a lot of inherent design issues. I think my jaw dropped when he stated that Ford fixed the front cover design by making it leak coolant externally rather than internally when cavitation wears through the cover. How about fixing the cavitation problem to begin with? This type of thing is exactly why I did not buy another Ford; buy a truck with inherent design issues. Maybe they will rear their ugly head while the truck is on warranty and you can go and fight with Ford about getting warranty coverage. OR, maybe they will rear their ugly head after the warranty is up and the owner is on the hook for a big repair bill. No thank you.

Thanks for the video; I am feeling even better about my choice to buy the Cummins now!

You my friend are the blind leading the blind... How do you know Ford has a cavitation problem with the water pumps on the 6.7 PSD? Because Bill said so? :S

Enjoy your tractor engine... :W (According to Gale Banks and not me!)

You keep saying that! I am proud to have owned three "tractor engines". The same engine that broke the land speed record in a Dakota known as the Banks Sidewinder.

Same engines that power large gen sets running 24/7 and large boats and motorhomes and let's not forget what is the ONLY DIESEL found in the F650/750 thru the model year 2015....CUMMINS!

I thought you once said racing isn't important to you! Which is it?

Also Ford ditched the cummins in the F650/F750!

Not until the 2016 MY. They got tired of me reminding everyone of this interesting fact.

There is a difference between racing and speed!

I enjoy cruising with my RAM Dually at 104mph on occasion at 2,300 rpm's. The speed limiter kicks in at that point. 🙂

Thanks for clarifying...I just archived your statement for future reference. :W

[FishOnOne]

Cummins12V98 wrote:

goducks10 wrote:
Anyone know what the most used truck is for hotshot use? It would seem that those that purposely put major miles on their trucks would want the most reliable. If not the most reliable then the least expensive to fix.

I have nothing to back this up but my own observation over many years.

RAM #1 GM #2 and Ford #3.

Fish will tell you that is not true. He will site Company owned trucks.

I am talking guys that make their living with the trucks they personally own!

Just a few years ago it Ford #2 and GM #3.

Again I disagree... I can't even remember that last time I seen a GM truck used by a hot shotter or used as a oil field material hauler truck.

In addition most Hot Shotter's do run RAM/cummins but most are 5.9 with manual tranny's and if you do find one with a 6.7 cummins it's deleted in the previous gen trucks. I'm also seeing a ever growing number of 6.7 Power Strokes hauling oil field equipment on big goose neck trailers down to south Texas and the hot shotter's are also increasing. I've talked to some hotshotter's and several said they now run Fords because of improved fuel economy while keeping the emissions equipment in tack.

[AH64ID]

FishOnOne wrote:


Also Ford ditched the cummins in the F650/F750!

Not according to Ford....

http://www.ford.com/commercial-trucks/f650-f750/

They are planning to drop it for the MY16 trucks, but those are not out yet. Initial info from Ford has the ISB available with more hp/tq than the 6.7 PSD.

[Cummins12V98]

FishOnOne wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:

blofgren wrote:

The Mad Norsky wrote:
1Longbow:

here is one more for your viewing pleasure. Comes from YouTube, PowerStroke help guy. He finally gets his hand on a 6.7L Scorpion engine.

Some insightful comments made during the video. He also covers the main bearings, and their lack of keying to hold them in place, as mentioned by a previous poster.

Link: PowerStroke help critiques the 6.7L Scorpion motor

Good god this video is an eye opener. The 6.7L is a definite improvement over the 6.0L and 6.4L but still a lot of inherent design issues. I think my jaw dropped when he stated that Ford fixed the front cover design by making it leak coolant externally rather than internally when cavitation wears through the cover. How about fixing the cavitation problem to begin with? This type of thing is exactly why I did not buy another Ford; buy a truck with inherent design issues. Maybe they will rear their ugly head while the truck is on warranty and you can go and fight with Ford about getting warranty coverage. OR, maybe they will rear their ugly head after the warranty is up and the owner is on the hook for a big repair bill. No thank you.

Thanks for the video; I am feeling even better about my choice to buy the Cummins now!

You my friend are the blind leading the blind... How do you know Ford has a cavitation problem with the water pumps on the 6.7 PSD? Because Bill said so? :S

Enjoy your tractor engine... :W (According to Gale Banks and not me!)

You keep saying that! I am proud to have owned three "tractor engines". The same engine that broke the land speed record in a Dakota known as the Banks Sidewinder.

Same engines that power large gen sets running 24/7 and large boats and motorhomes and let's not forget what is the ONLY DIESEL found in the F650/750 thru the model year 2015....CUMMINS!

I thought you once said racing isn't important to you! Which is it?

Also Ford ditched the cummins in the F650/F750!

Not until the 2016 MY. They got tired of me reminding everyone of this interesting fact.

There is a difference between racing and speed!

I enjoy cruising with my RAM Dually at 104mph on occasion at 2,300 rpm's. The speed limiter kicks in at that point. 🙂

[Cummins12V98]

W4RLR wrote:

NinerBikes wrote:


Ford's track record with building diesels... 3 attempts now, since Navistar got smart and dumped Ford. 6.0, 6.4, now 6.7. Nothing has changed, when it comes to their engineers designing diesel engines.

Cummins track record? Duramax track record? You tell me.

Ford 6.0 Powerstroke is a Navistar VT 365
Ford 6.4 Powerstroke is a Navistar Maxxforce 7.

The Ford 6.7 Scorpion was designed and built by Ford. All previous engines were built by Navistar, including the 7.3.

And 6.9

[FishOnOne]

Cummins12V98 wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:

blofgren wrote:

The Mad Norsky wrote:
1Longbow:

here is one more for your viewing pleasure. Comes from YouTube, PowerStroke help guy. He finally gets his hand on a 6.7L Scorpion engine.

Some insightful comments made during the video. He also covers the main bearings, and their lack of keying to hold them in place, as mentioned by a previous poster.

Link: PowerStroke help critiques the 6.7L Scorpion motor

Good god this video is an eye opener. The 6.7L is a definite improvement over the 6.0L and 6.4L but still a lot of inherent design issues. I think my jaw dropped when he stated that Ford fixed the front cover design by making it leak coolant externally rather than internally when cavitation wears through the cover. How about fixing the cavitation problem to begin with? This type of thing is exactly why I did not buy another Ford; buy a truck with inherent design issues. Maybe they will rear their ugly head while the truck is on warranty and you can go and fight with Ford about getting warranty coverage. OR, maybe they will rear their ugly head after the warranty is up and the owner is on the hook for a big repair bill. No thank you.

Thanks for the video; I am feeling even better about my choice to buy the Cummins now!

You my friend are the blind leading the blind... How do you know Ford has a cavitation problem with the water pumps on the 6.7 PSD? Because Bill said so? :S

Enjoy your tractor engine... :W (According to Gale Banks and not me!)

You keep saying that! I am proud to have owned three "tractor engines". The same engine that broke the land speed record in a Dakota known as the Banks Sidewinder.

Same engines that power large gen sets running 24/7 and large boats and motorhomes and let's not forget what is the ONLY DIESEL found in the F650/750 thru the model year 2015....CUMMINS!

I thought you once said racing isn't important to you! Which is it?

Also Ford ditched the cummins in the F650/F750!