hep for brother

Wow, a lot of information and opinions here. The only think I want to add is that someone said that a pushrod engine reaches valve float at 4000 RPM. It's actually 5000 RPM.

(that could be changed with different valve springs, pushrods, and lifters. But, that's changing things from stock and I know that's not part of this conversation.)

cmack wrote:
Just a word on HP and torque ratings... what matters is at what RPM those numbers are made. A V6 may have the same or better numbers than a V8 but the V8 will generally make more HP & torque at lower RPMs (comparing non turbos) and that's what is needed to get moving from a dead stop. Rear end gearing also plays into how well a vehicle will tow.

:R

Yeah, right…

Its a good thing that the turbo folks never had to drive a vehicle before turbos were invented...

For what ever reason folks who tend to point out some supposed “flaw” of a non turbo gas engine having to run “high RPMs” in order to make max HP/TQ as a totally bad thing, they just don’t get it.

For MANY years Ford had a 300 CID inline 6 which while it didn’t have tons of HP, it had CONSIDERABLE torque and it was really a “bullet proof” engine that just ran and ran. It WASN’T FAST but it got the job done for MANY. That engine for MANY YEARS was the CHOICE engine for MANY SPRINT CAR owners to build up for racing.

Perhaps back in the days of three speed transmissions you might have been “right” but now days with 5 and 6 speed transmissions there is often a very small RPM spread between gears which means the engine RPM will be optimized better to the engine.

YES, that non turbo V6 is going to run higher RPMs more often but it will not hurt it.

YES when it does that it will use more gas (keep in mind the turbo ecoboost engine mileage DROPS to the SAME amount under heavy boost as a non boosted engine making mileage to be a moot point).

YES when that happens you will hear more engine noise.

NO it is not going to hurt the engine.

Would I load a V6 with 10K, NO but I do feel that the V6 is NOT LIMITED to a POPUP and it should be FINE with a HARD SIDED trailer as long as it is kept within a REASONABLE WEIGHT.

At the SAME time I would not even CONSIDER loading a turbo charged V6 (like the ecoboost) with a 10K load. Why you ask?

Simply put, you ARE putting a lot of strain on a smaller lower displacement engine that has many more complex (and expensive) parts, effectively FORCING the engine to work harder than a larger displacement non turbo engine (6.2). The ecoboost engine HAS to give off the same amount of HEAT in a smaller package, that in its self is an oxymoron when it comes to longevity.

That is why I mentioned 7K lbs – 8.6K lbs as ABSOLUTE MAX LOADED for the OPs vehicle, this would give you a trailer of say 5K-6K empty. There is MANY DECENT sized trailers in this weight class, heck the trailer I currently have is a 26ft 1980s and it weighs in at 5.5K empty. My first trailer was a 20ft 1980s and it weighed 3600 lbs empty and filled with our gear plus passengers in the truck we were upwards of 5K, the 97 truck we had pulled that pretty darn well.

The vehicle the OP has is no worse than many folks who are towing with small V6 SUVs and I don’t see those folks just towing popups. In fact the OPs vehicle is a BETTER towing “platform” than most SUVs.

I would go as light as possible but I would not say that the OP is limited to a popup like other folks contend.

dodge guy wrote:
Keep in mind that an inline 6 (gas or diesel) has always developed it`s torque down low! That is why nearly all OTR tractors have them!

While old inline 6s did develop high tq at low RPMs they HAD to since they were PUSHROD engines which once you crossed the 4K RPM threshold you were now risking “floating” the valves. Many of the inline 6s you are talking about also used LARGER displacements, bigger bore AND much longer stroke to achieve the output, they also topped out in BELOW 5K area as the redline.

The newer V6s use smaller displacements with smaller bore and stroke which allows them to be more NIMBLE, granted they will rev higher but the response is not as slow as the older inline 6s.

Type 6-cylinder, Dual Overhead Cam, 24-valve with Ti-VCT
Displacement 3.7L (214 CID)
Horsepower (SAE net) 302 @ 6500 rpm
Torque 276 lb.-ft. @ 4000 rpm
Compression Ratio 10.5:1
Bore and Stroke (in.) 3.7 x 3.4


The 1968 Ford 300 was a six-cylinder engine equipped with a single-barrel carburetor. The engine was first produced in 1965 and was largely based on the slightly smaller 240 engine. The engine is considered by some to be one of Ford’s most reliable six-cylinders of the era and was known more for its torque than its horsepower.

General Specifications

The 300 featured a stroke of 3.98 inches and a bore of 4 inches.

The compression ratio was 9:2.

The 300 produced 170 horsepower at 3,800 revolutions per minute and 283 ft.-lbs. of torque at 1,600 RPM.

Gdetrailer wrote:

That 3.7 V6 specs is actually almost ON PAR with our 2006 F250 with 3V 5.4 which has 300 HP, does a FINE job towing 7K of trailer and cargo up the same 7% grades.

NO, the 3.7 won't "perform" as well as the turbo version or a 6.2 but IT WILL get the job done.

I love bench racing too! Don't forget the mechanical advantage of torque multiplication the 2011 6-spd has over your 2006 4-spd too! Why even sell the more powerful engines?

A 3.7L V6 F-150 will tow nearly any high walled RV at 65mph in 3rd gear at 4000rpm all day long. Will it hold 4th gear at 3000rpm? Maybe. Will it hold 5th gear at 2200rpm? Nope. How many people want to cruise at 4000rpm, even 3000rpm with downshifts to 5500rpm when climbing? Some, but not many.

The 20 year old 4.9L inline 6 had peak torque in the 2000rpm range and fell flat on its face over 3000rpm. Today's base V6's make power peak torque, but over 4000rpm. At comparable 2000rpm, they are a lot lower than that old 300.

Keep in mind that an inline 6 (gas or diesel) has always developed it`s torque down low! That is why nearly all OTR tractors have them!

CavemanCharlie wrote:
On the farm we used to tow a livestock trailer full of hogs all over the place with a 86 F-250 that had the old 300 Inline 6 and a 4 speed manual. That was a great engine. We used it for 200000 miles and then sold it to the next guy. It still ran fine but, it was rusted out.

The new V6s have come along ways, but it will be hard to beat the reliability/longevity of that old 300 in line 6. With the 4 speed man, and granny gears, it sure could pull.

Jerry

On the farm we used to tow a livestock trailer full of hogs all over the place with a 86 F-250 that had the old 300 Inline 6 and a 4 speed manual. That was a great engine. We used it for 200000 miles and then sold it to the next guy. It still ran fine but, it was rusted out.

Well what weight tt should i recommend him? Something around 3500 lbs dry?

Just a word on HP and torque ratings... what matters is at what RPM those numbers are made. A V6 may have the same or better numbers than a V8 but the V8 will generally make more HP & torque at lower RPMs (comparing non turbos) and that's what is needed to get moving from a dead stop. Rear end gearing also plays into how well a vehicle will tow.

I agree, when I saw the base Tundra V6 had only like a 5000 ish lb tow rating I kind of scratched my head. The V6 in the Tundra had just a little less power than my 97 f150 with a 5.4.but my F150 had an 8000 lb tow rating.