Refused entry with a truck & camper

Moisheh -- "When the Hologram permits were very new there were lots of problems." From what I'm reading here over time, this pick up truck problem has been going on for about two years at the border; Mexican citizens are smart people, and it doesn't take two years for them to train, learn, and properly interpret a border regulation that has been on the books a good while. Otherwise, it would be insulting their intelligence. No, there is something else going on here happening randomly along the border. Patience is not the better part of virtue in this case. If it continues on a regular basis, it is about time this issue comes out of the shadows and into the political sunlight along with some media attention. It may culminate in only a published State Department warning available for ALL tourists to read, but at least everyone will know the official position on the issue.

Since someone sent me pictures of the labels/tags/stickers showing the weight rating of their pickup I am now wondering if every pickup out there doesn't have these same weight information things somewhere. The one I was sent that said “TRUCK CAMPER LOAD INFORMATION” and “CARGO WEIGHT RATING" is probably what the Mexican law means by "capacidad de carga" - at least that is what my research has led me to think.

The guys at the border are reading the GVWR sticker on the door frame and using that as the "capacidad de carga" and I do not think that is what is meant by the law. This is why people are being turned away.

If you are a pickup truck owner could you look around your vehicle to try to find these labels or whatever they are and post here what you find. The ones I was sent were from a GM vehicle and the "Cargo Weight Rating" was inside the glove box - perhaps on the door? The GVWR was on the door frame somewhere. I am hoping every pickup truck has these labels with that same sort of wording. If you are interested in clearing this up I will put together information to whoever is on the other of the email address at aduana to try to get something written up that might explain all of this and resolve this issue once and for all.

Please post your make and model etc. along with the GVWR and then whatever other label you might find and what it says and what the weight shows. Everyone says this only applies to pickup trucks so there probably won't be these labels in motorhomes - mine does not have one.

Well I will see what happens at Reynosa in 3 weeks.

The Reality Of Aduana


"No tiene valor lo que crees. Aquí y ahora soy la única ley."

Jeez Brian you sure make it hard to read your posts. So much copy and paste of nothing essential.
You accuse others of muddying the waters but you should know by now that even if it is law doesn't mean it will be enforced properly or at all. Some interpretations are based on which entry point you choose. This is definitely about pick up trucks! How many motor homes have you heard have this problem?
You need a hobby. LOL

Thanks for all your help and support. The folks who need help out here could never do it without your valuable input.

I will say it again: In Canada and in the USA many things are at the discretion of the customs official at the border. It is probably the same in Mexico. When the Hologram permits were very new there were lots of problems. Mostly because the border personnel did not under stand he new regs. SAT had an ombudsperson in a booth at the Nogales truck crossing. This person was a real employee with excellent knowledge of the new rules. We were having a problem and she spoke to the fellow issuing the TIP and Voila. All was good. I don't know if they still offer that service but you can ask to speak to a supervisor. Tequila: Did you ever find out if the problem with the Churches was the truck size or the paperwork?

Moisheh

Jeez Brian you sure make it hard to read your posts. So much copy and paste of nothing essential.
You accuse others of muddying the waters but you should know by now that even if it is law doesn't mean it will be enforced properly or at all. Some interpretations are based on which entry point you choose. This is definitely about pick up trucks! How many motor homes have you heard have this problem?
You need a hobby. LOL

I just received a PM from someone referencing a thread from just about a years ago about this whole thing. Sounds like the same process of contacting the same email address I am trying to get info from.


https://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/28990688.cfm

Posted: 08/08/16 02:49pm

After a lot of research and reading on this I contacted Banjercito and rec'd the following response:

"REGARDING YOUR EMAIL,
THE LAW SINCE NOVEMBER 2015, WAS WRITTEN BY ADUANAS AN STATES THAT VEHICLES WITH A GVWR OF UP TO 3.5 TONS OR 7,716 LBS CAN ENTER THE COUNTRY WITH A TEMPORARY IMPORT PERMIT FROM BANJERCITO, IF THE VEHICLE EXCEEDS THAT WEIGHT BASED ON THE GVWR SPECIFIED BY THE MAKER OF THE VEHICLE, IT MAY NOT BE IMPORTED THROUGH A TEMPORARY IMPORT PERMIT.

FUTHERMORE, WE´D LIKE TO REMIND YOU THAT BANJERCITO MUST FOLLOW THE LAW.

IF YOU HAVE AN ISSUES OR QUESTIONS, PLEASE CONTACT ADUANAS SAT TO VOICE YOUR CONCERNS 1877 44 88 728 OPTIONS 7,2,2,1,1 OR CIITEV_ADUANAMEXICO@SAT.GOB.MX."

I then phoned Aduana and spoke to a fellow who identified himself as a Supervisor in the Vehicle Import area. He told me they are very aware of the situation as they are getting numerous complaints from RVers who are being refused TIPs at the border. He explained that it is NOT their intention to prohibit pickups over 7716 lbs as long as they are for personal, not commercial, use. He said the rules are being misinterpreted by the border people ( Banjercito) and we had a good discussion about GVWR and "cargo capacity". He gave me an email address and asked me to send photos and details of my vehicle to them to examine, and he said they will send back instructions on what to do to avoid getting a hassle at the border.

I then sent an email to the Aduana email address he gave me and included photos of my 1 ton pickup as well as a photo of my doorpost sticker showing my GVWR of 11,600#. I asked if I could get a TIP and if there was anything special I needed to do. Here is a translation of the response I received from Aduana:


"Good afternoon, you do not need to submit any type of document issued by us, if you like you can submit this email, however you will not have any problem at the time you request your permission for temporary importation, once the staff of the Customs Office has made a physical inspection of your vehicle and verify that it is a vehicle for the transport of passengers and not a vehicle for cargo transportation, unfortunately this procedure only can be done in the CIITEV modules at the border and not by internet."


No doubt there will still be some people who will experience problems at the border BUT it is clear from Aduana (and they are the ones who make the rules) that private non-commercial pickups CAN be issued a TIP even if they are over the 7,716# limit. It may take some arguing in some cases but stick with it and we should all be OK.




The response was via email. Here is the Spanish version, exactly as I received it today:



RE: Necesito algo de ayuda
CIITEV_AduanaMexico
12:49 PM

To: xxxxxxx
CIITEV_AduanaMexico@sat.gob.mx

Buenas tardes, no es necesario que tenga que presentar ningún tipo de documento expedido por nosotros, si usted gusta puede presentar este correo, sin embargo no tendrá ningún problema al momento de solicitar su permiso de importación temporal, una vez que personal de la Aduana haya realizado una inspección física de su vehículo y se compruebe que se trata de un vehículo de transporte de pasajeros y no una vehículo exclusivamente de transporte de carga, desgraciadamente este procedimiento solamente lo podrá realizar en los módulos CIITEV de la frontera y no por internet.



RE: I need some help
CIITEV_AduanaMexico
12:49 PM

To: xxxxxxx
CIITEV_AduanaMexico@sat.gob.mx

Good afternoon, it is not necessary that you have to present any type of document issued by us, if you like can present this mail, however you will have no problem when applying for your temporary import permit, once Customs staff has carried out a physical inspection of your vehicle and it is verified that it is a passenger transport vehicle and not a vehicle solely for the transport of cargo, unfortunately this procedure can only be done in the CIITEV modules of the border and not online.

Note as above post I got from the obscure law. The translation could be wrong and someone will surely correct me if it is. Note the word “CARGA” does translate here to “LOAD”. Also note terms such as “weight added to the vehicle” and “maximum weight of the load that a vehicle can transport safety conditions for which it was designed”. I do not know if that is the exact perfect translation or what their laws mean. That is what I am trying to help find out. Everything I can find - other than the guys at the border – says the law is about the CCC and not the GVWR or the GCWR or whatever. Does the word “carga” in Spanish translate to total vehicle legal limit? Or does it translate to weight of the load the vehicle is permitted to carry?

CARGA DE GRAN PESO O VOLUMEN Carga cuyo peso adicionado al peso vehicular

LOADING OF GREAT WEIGHT OR VOLUME Load whose weight added to the vehicle

CARGA UTIL Y PESO UTIL Peso máximo de la carga que un vehículo puede transportar en condiciones de seguridad y para el cual fue diseñado por el fabricante o reconstructor.

USEFUL LOAD AND UTILITY WEIGHT The maximum weight of the load that a vehicle can transport in safety conditions and for which it was designed by the manufacturer or rebuilder.

Do not use info on weights from GM websites as they are not factual. Every PU truck will have different empty weights due to options either factory, dealer or owner installed. BUT the GVWR is for real. GM ( or any mfr.) is telling you the vehicle is designed for that max GVWR. Forget about trailering as some of the trailer weight is on the trailer axles. The only consistent figure is the GVWR. My "tag" only shows the GVWR and the GAWR ( axle limits). It is not a commercial registered vehicle

NOTE - on the above photos there is a sticker that says "CARGO WEIGHT RATING 3,136 LB". That is the weight GM says this truck is rated to carry. To me that is “Capacidad de Carga”.

To my mind the definition of the term “Capacidad de Carga” refers to the weight of the cargo and not the gross weight of the vehicle. So I am emailing to try to get the Mexican definition of terms. As one of my posts above where I dug some words out of an obscure law the do make a distinction between the weight of the load and the weight of the vehicle when fully loaded - which they absolutely and positively do in the US for every truck I have ever driven - and I drove quite a few. They all show a TARE or empty weight.

As a professional you have to know your weights and your weight laws. You have to know what your truck weighs and you have to know the estimated weight of the shipment. Sometimes I was so close to the legal limit I had to calculate my fuel consumption and how much was in my tanks and how much I could put in the next time I fuel so my fuel did not put me over the legal limit. You better believe that any professional has to know their weights and at times get it down to the ounce. EXTREMELY IMPORTANT!