Airstream Avenue - Need advice from owners

What is more important is the towing capacity of the van not its cargo capacity. Cargo capacity can be fudged with heavier springs etc. but that can not make up for a transmission or engine that is not rated for what you intend to tow.
You did not say if this is the Chevy or Mercedes the Chevy has an 8,000# towing capacity.

We don't have an Avenue (Roadtrek Chevy 190), but I think the weights are similar to the Roadtreks and Pleasure-way Chevies. Chevy lists the towing capacity at something like 8100#, but you won't be able to get there because your tongue weight will put you over on the gross weight of the van in most cases. Most folks find they can't get to gross combined weight without going over on gross for the van, and keep 10% tongue weight.

Most of the Chevy folks find that about 3500#, with 350# on the tongue is doable while staying within the weight specs for the van and towing capacity. You will find a bunch of folks that go over the rated specs without concern, but IMO, it just isn't a good idea.

Even with 3500#, you will get hot going up long grades, and will need good trailer brakes going down, due to inherent weaknesses of the Chevies in those catagories.

If towing, I'd highly suggest a transmission cooler, if one isn't already there.

I have a 2012 Airstream Avenue Suite built on a 2011 Chevrolet 3500 Van. The actual weights with full water and propane, two batteries, empty holding tanks, and completely stocked with food, clothes, pots, pans, etc. and outfitted for use with chairs, table, grill, leveling blocks, etc. are as follows:
1. Actual overall weight is 9000 lbs. The GVWR is 9600 lbs.
2. The front axle actual weight is 3900 lbs. The GAWR is 4300 lbs.
3. The rear axle actual weight is 5100 lbs. The GAWR is 6084 lbs.
4. According to Airstream, the CCC is 1382 lbs.
5. According to Chevrolet, the GCWR is 16000 lbs.
I hope this helps.

To the OP: I sent you a private message.

Thanks for all the replies, gentlemen.

In response to all the advice, let me give some more info.

The Avenue is built on a 2011 Chevy G3500 chassis with the 6.0L engine (has trans cooler). Chevy rates towing at 9,300 lbs. -- but there's no way I can tow that heavy. The tongue weight on a trailer that heavy will cause me to exceed GVWR.

The Roadtreks, depending on year, seem to be a little lighter than the Avenues. I think Airstream's cabinetry and finish materials are heavier. I'm not sure how the Pleasure-Ways weigh out. I'm planning on going up to GVWR on the van. My last employer ran all three brands of 1-ton vans, towing and hauling heavy equipment. As long as you stayed within GVWR and GCVWR and kept up on all the maintenance, the Chevys and Fords were fine. The unit-body Dodges rattled like mad after long-term towing of heavy loads (even within GVWR and GCVWR). 3,500 lbs. trailer weight and 350 lbs. tongue weight seem really, really light - unless its with the smaller V6 or V8 engines. The Chevy drivetrain is warrantied for 5 year / 100,000 miles when used within GVWR and GCVRW.

1382 lbs. CCC works out to be... (1382 lbs. CCC) - (500 lbs. passengers + snacks + on road entertainment stuff) - (100 lbs. water) - (75 lbs. WD hitch) = 707 lbs. left for tongue weight (propane is included in CCC according to Airstream). Maybe a little more, as Wayne has the Suite and I'm looking at a Lounge (the Suite model has full ensuite bathroom and a larger kitchen, whereas the Lounge just has two rows of seats).

Back that out for a 11% tongue weight results in a maximum loaded trailer weight of 6427 lbs. 9600 GVWR + 6427 is well below the 16000 GCVWR. GAWR-F/R looks within range at that weight. So I'm probably looking for a trailer with a dry weight of about 5500 lbs.

Am I doing this right?

Thanks in advance for any replies.

-edit for grammar and clarity-

I forgot to mention when I weighed, I had almost a full tank of fuel as well.

I am actually pretty surprised by the weights that Wayne got. Nearly every Roadtrek of the same size I have seen weights on come in at closer to 9300-9400# or higher, thus they have very limited weight left for tongue weight. I assume the weights are with a generator and people, as that is how most are outfitted.

Towing over 5K with a Chevy will require some work, however. The transmission and engine will both run hot with that much weight. It may need separate, fan cooled, aftermarket coolers for both the transmission fluid and engine oil, to get that heat load off the regular radiator. It will be tough to slow down if you live in the mountains.

The rear load capacity of the Chevy is based on the max tire loading, so if you are at max, you are also at max on the tires. Many folks claim that towing puts much higher strain on the rear tires because they have to handle extra side loads due to sway, so be aware. It is possible to go up to 265-75-16 tires on the Chevies to get more capacity.

Hippo, Don't forget to factor in all the options, gen-set, propane, awning, TV, extra battery, etc. Easily add 250 to 300lbs.

This thread is from a while back, but, it may help you.

http://www.rv.net/forum/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/24538195/gotomsg/24539021.cfm#24539021

Cheers.

Thanks for all the critical analysis. It has been very helpful in making sure I've got all my bases covered and don't make a stupid purchase decision.

I've always been leery of manufacturers' claims of weight. They are always too light. The absolute worst abuse I've seen is with Japanese racing motorcycles. In order to claim low weights, they will advertise weights of the motorcycles with no fluids - no gas, no coolant, no oil in the engine, no hydraulic fluids in the brakes/suspension, no water in the battery. The actual, "ready-for-the-road" weight ends up significantly higher. One couldn't hope to use a motorcycle in that condition in the "real world".

I really appreciate the real world comments from the owners. Due to the confusion between claimed and real world weights, I started digging into the info (special thanks to Wayne, whose numbers provide confirmation to Airstreams claims).

Airstream uses two sets of numbers. They use Unit Base Weight (UBW) and Net Carrying Capacity (NCC) in their advertising. Then they use Unloaded Vehicle Weight (UVW) and Cargo Carrying Capacity (CCC) on each van - "the UVW and CCC on the Cargo Carrying Capacity tag are weights for the individual vehicle AS BUILT with its options and certain water capacities". Also from the 2011 owners manual, "Airstream weighs the vehicle as finished and adds the weight of full tanks of liquid propane and chassis fuel."

Wayne has got 1382 lbs. CCC on his Avenue Suite. I've seen 1474 lbs. CCC on Avenue Lounges similar to the one I want to buy. I'm harassing the dealership to send me an actual pic of the sticker on the van.

Wayne's weighed numbers seem to confirm that the Avenues still have significant payload capacity after loading "for the road".

I will be trying to keep the Avenue as light as possible when towing - putting all luggage back in the trailer rather than the tow-vehicle and carrying minimal water. I may even have to put the spare tire back in the trailer because it will hit the trailer when backing up.

Wayne - will the spare tire fit under the sofa in the rear? Looks like it'd be a tight fit.

I re-figured with the latest CCC weight and get 824 lbs. payload left. At 11% tongue weight, that's a 7491 lbs. trailer. At 12% tongue weight, that's a 6867 lbs. trailer.