Class A with tag axle - beware of $1000. fine in AZ!

P Kennedy wrote:
So 4 pages on one post and 7 pages later on this post and what I see is Arizona has greed issues easily circumvented by not buying fuel in Arizona or using the commercial lanes at fuel stops designed to accommodate large vehicles. I can't see where by filling the odd time in the commercial lanes where the extra road tax cost is going to kill anybody. Stupid old truckers have been playing this game for years at a fuel cost way beyond anybody here per day, per mile, per month and per year. To truly say it is going to cost you $1000 fine you need a victim who has been #1 a ticket and #2 took it to court and lost with an explanation from the presiding judge. Interpretation of what the law says requires an experienced Arizona traffic lawyer or judge, anyone fit that bill here on this thread? By the way we are now paying $1.39 Cdn = $5.22/gal x $1.09 exchange = $5.70/gal.

So what you're saying is people on an Internet forum designed to discuss issues related to RV's, and who are discussing an issue directly related to RV's and the cost of fuel, should just quit talking about it and don't go to Arizona which is one of the most popular destinations for RV's in the winter months? Or if they do go to Arizona, instead of pulling in to one of the many thousands of gas stations that also sell diesel fuel, they should instead go find a truck stop and get in line behind the trucks filling up 500 gallon tanks and just pay the extra 8 cents because they weren't allowed to discuss the issue on an Internet forum and get to the real truth of the law? Did I get that right?

All this activity and outrage on an extra $8 (on 100 gal)!! :R Maybe everyone should be looking at what they pay on April 15th every year and get a little excited about that!

Let me add some more confusion. I think the law is clear that only a "use class" vehicle has to pay the extra tax. What is confusing is what exactly is a use class vehicle.

This first definition is the current AZ law taken from their official website:

"Use class motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle that uses use fuel on a highway in this state and that is a road tractor, truck tractor, truck or passenger carrying vehicle having a declared gross vehicle weight of more than twenty-six thousand pounds or having more than two axles."

This is a definition of Use Class vehicle in Az that I found on a document that was dated in 1998. Whether they are quoting from the actual statute at the time or not I don't know:

"Use class vehicles include a road tractor, a truck tractor, a truck, having a declared gross vehicle weight of more than 26,000 pounds or having more than two axles or a passenger carrying motor vehicle designed to seat more than 20 occupants."

So as we can see, assuming this is an actual quote of the law from 1998, RV's would not be included as a use class vehicle back then. So the question is why did they change the wording of the law and what is intended by it? Based on the older law referring to the 20 occupants, I'm under the impression that in fact "Passenger Carry Vehicle" is intended to mean a vehicle carrying passengers for hire or for commercial purposes. If that is the case, then I don't think the use tax law applies to motorhomes at all, even if you have three axles.

So 4 pages on one post and 7 pages later on this post and what I see is Arizona has greed issues easily circumvented by not buying fuel in Arizona or using the commercial lanes at fuel stops designed to accommodate large vehicles. I can't see where by filling the odd time in the commercial lanes where the extra road tax cost is going to kill anybody. Stupid old truckers have been playing this game for years at a fuel cost way beyond anybody here per day, per mile, per month and per year. To truly say it is going to cost you $1000 fine you need a victim who has been #1 a ticket and #2 took it to court and lost with an explanation from the presiding judge. Interpretation of what the law says requires an experienced Arizona traffic lawyer or judge, anyone fit that bill here on this thread? By the way we are now paying $1.39 Cdn = $5.22/gal x $1.09 exchange = $5.70/gal.

jlabr2 wrote:

Francesca Knowles wrote:

msmith1199 wrote:
In a nutshell, I know how to read laws, and the way this one is written is not clear at all. If it has me confused, than it's a confusing law.

Will highlighting the language help?

17. " Light class motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle that uses use fuel on the highways in this state but EXCLUDES a road tractor, truck tractor, truck or passenger carrying vehicle having a declared gross vehicle weight of more than twenty-six thousand pounds or having more than two axles.


37. "Use class motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle that uses use fuel on a highway in this state and that is a road tractor, truck tractor, truck or passenger carrying vehicle having a declared gross vehicle weight of more than twenty-six thousand pounds or having more than two axles.

And are not both of these examples found in the Commercial Vehicle part of the law? If so, I take it that the law pertains to only commercial vehicles.

And clearly you understand the confusion here. Based on my reading of the law and the language used (Such as "declared gross weight" which is a term used for commercial vehicles) I think the intent of the AZ legislature was to impose this tax on large commercial vehicles. However, their failure to properly define the vehicles they intended to tax has clearly led to some confusion both by RV owners and the people in AZ who enforce these laws.

Another example, they use the term "passenger carrying vehicle" but I can't find anyplace in AZ law that defines that. If you Google search that phrase you see it used to identify vehicles such as limos and buses which are designed to carry people for hire. That is how I think AZ also intends for it to be used other wise why say "Passenger Carrying?" Why not just say "...or any vehicle weighing over 26,000 pounds?" Why does the phrase "passenger carrying" need to be in there unless they intended it to mean a vehicle designed specifically for carrying passengers like a bus?

Under Federal law, the term passenger carrying vehicle is used to mean a vehicle carrying passengers for hire.

I guess it pertains only to commercial vehicles because just about every diesel longer then 36' weigh's more then 26,000 and that is with two axles. Mine is only 38'and it weigh's 30K. So if it pertains to everybody commercial or none, who determines what the coach weigh's when you pull into a gas station. Some coaches will vary considerably in weight even though they are the same length.
I do remember seeing the stick on the fuel pump and it did say something about the weight of the coach, but I do not remember reading anything pertaining only to commercial vehicles.
I will be going to Laughlin for a Gulf Stream rally Oct 25. So I will check it out. We sure do not want a $1000. fine. I would be so mad I probably would say some choice words to governor Brewer.

Francesca Knowles wrote:

msmith1199 wrote:
In a nutshell, I know how to read laws, and the way this one is written is not clear at all. If it has me confused, than it's a confusing law.

Will highlighting the language help?

17. " Light class motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle that uses use fuel on the highways in this state but EXCLUDES a road tractor, truck tractor, truck or passenger carrying vehicle having a declared gross vehicle weight of more than twenty-six thousand pounds or having more than two axles.


37. "Use class motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle that uses use fuel on a highway in this state and that is a road tractor, truck tractor, truck or passenger carrying vehicle having a declared gross vehicle weight of more than twenty-six thousand pounds or having more than two axles.

No it won't. Please tell me what the definition is of a "Passenger Carrying Vehicle?"

Francesca Knowles wrote:

msmith1199 wrote:
In a nutshell, I know how to read laws, and the way this one is written is not clear at all. If it has me confused, than it's a confusing law.

Will highlighting the language help?

17. " Light class motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle that uses use fuel on the highways in this state but EXCLUDES a road tractor, truck tractor, truck or passenger carrying vehicle having a declared gross vehicle weight of more than twenty-six thousand pounds or having more than two axles.


37. "Use class motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle that uses use fuel on a highway in this state and that is a road tractor, truck tractor, truck or passenger carrying vehicle having a declared gross vehicle weight of more than twenty-six thousand pounds or having more than two axles.

And are not both of these examples found in the Commercial Vehicle part of the law? If so, I take it that the law pertains to only commercial vehicles.

Bob&AnnaMarie wrote:

lbligh wrote:

Bob,

I will guarantee you that the posting at each pump exists and it is very clear. The posting details ALL exceptions. An example would be non-profits. A non-profit is exempt. They could be driving a tank and as long as it is registered to a non-profit organization, they are exempt from the tax. If they had intended to include RVs they would have listed them just as they did all other exceptions. They also detail exactly what is included. Any vehicle over 26,000 lbs or more than two axles.

Well God bless you if you read everything that is posted on gas pumps every time you pull in to fuel up. I have to admit that I usually look for Diesel #2 and the credit card slot. I do not really expect to find notices that I cannot use a given pump. And maybe the stations we used in Benson and Yuma were legal for us. Like I said, I just don't really spend a lot of time reading fuel pumps. I never realized there was a financial risk to just pumping fuel. I do now.
Bob

Bob,

I think that you misunderstood my comment. Like you, I don't read everything posted on a pump. However, I have read the notice in question. I was simply stating that the notice, when read, is very clear.

Safe travels.

msmith1199 wrote:
In a nutshell, I know how to read laws, and the way this one is written is not clear at all. If it has me confused, than it's a confusing law.

Will highlighting the language help?

17. " Light class motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle that uses use fuel on the highways in this state but EXCLUDES a road tractor, truck tractor, truck or passenger carrying vehicle having a declared gross vehicle weight of more than twenty-six thousand pounds or having more than two axles.


37. "Use class motor vehicle" means a motor vehicle that uses use fuel on a highway in this state and that is a road tractor, truck tractor, truck or passenger carrying vehicle having a declared gross vehicle weight of more than twenty-six thousand pounds or having more than two axles.