The slide awning was getting tattered and I should have removed it. But it was still helping some. Went to put the slide out and it got hung up somehow. Had to go cut it off to get the slide out. There was a loud noise when the awning hung up. Not sure where but probably in the slide mechanism. The slide then went all the way out on the hydraulic side but sits about three inches in from the wall on the other side. Been trying to diagnose it and getting nowhere. An rv tech told me today that in cases like these they sometimes jump the track. That would makes sense. No pins have been sheered and the slide moves in and out like always. I cannot find any obvious slippage on the adjustments. The gears look good to me and lubrication made them work better like before. This is lippert rack and pinion on a dining room slide that's supposed to sit flush with the floor. Now it does on one side and not the other. Concerned that I need to fix this soon before it causes another problem. Any thoughts?

I assume this is a hydraulic slide and the two rack and pinions under the slide are used to keep the slide in line as it moves in and out. when the awning caught and the ram continued to push, it lifted the slide allowing the rack to lift off the gear on at least one side and stop moving while the other side continued to be pushed by the ram. then the slide dropped back down on the gears misaligned which was probably the bang you heard. I would lift the slide with a jack until the rack is just off the pinion on the side farthest from the ram then jog the ram in or out until the slide is properly aligned with the trailer wall then lower the jack allowing the rack to engage the pinion in proper alignment .that should fix it assuming I understand the problem.

Well that's pretty much what I'm thinking happened. Just not 100% sure it can happen. It doesn't look to me like the rack can lift that high. I don't think i need to jack it though. I think I can put it out as far as it goes, remove the sheer pin, push the bad side out, and then replace the sheer pin. If I keep track of how many teeth turn while pusing it out, I can probably get it back to where it was if it doesn't work. When the slide comes in, is it supposed to hit on top first and then square up on the botton as the rod comes in all the way? I'm thinking I can watch how it comes in to make sure it's behaving right. If something seems wrong, I can just put it back to close to how it was and start over with a different theory.

Hi Bill,I do not know the Lippert hydraulics but I do know a fair amount in the Lippert electric rack and pinion.If you jumped teeth, and that is an if, when the gear rack is exposed from the camper (I'm assuming you have enclosed tanks) look for traces of any kind of damage. Scared teeth, dings etc. If it did jump track OR if the slave side arm slid, then when the camper opens or closes you should see the slave driven side act different then the master rack side. Meaning, when the slide is full out, take a tape measure and measure from wall of camper to slide flange on both the front and rear at the same spot. The number should be the same. (I would say, within 1/16" but not 1/4"). You "might" see that on closing, the slave side is not closed all the way tight but the master rack side is.I'm assuming, don't know, the hydraulic cylinder is pushing and pulling the master rack. Yes/no? and if so then the master rack arm can't change location by and overload unless something bent. But the slave rack which is driven from the master rack can move in the gear drive. On my slave arm, there is an adjustment at the end of the arm where it connects to the slide room. It has slots. This may have come loose and slipped. Check for witness lines of dirt or rust moved. See this pic, I do not know if yours is like this but the slave rack should have some kind of adjustment. There are 2, 1/2" bolts (vertical) in the end of the arm. There are slots on themOn mine, the camper wall opening is not large enough to jack up the camper and allow the rack to move from the pinnion. And the opening in the slide frame will not allow that either for the slide arm to raise up to disengage the teeth. The only way on mine to reset teeth, is to unbolt the square shaft drive from the master rack and turn the square shaft to move the slave rack in 1/4 rev's. Man, if you jumped teeth and really did that, something needs to leave tracks of jumping. Check the rack and pinion gear assembly and see if something is affected there. In this area on both the master and slave rack. You would think you would of sheared the bolt on the square shaft first or the hydraulic safety relief would or tripped. Hope this helps and please report back findings. Pic's help greatly. John

This does help a lot. We got another big snow storm and I've been thinking it through with the info here. I don't really see how it could jump the track for the reasons you mention. More likely would be a problem in the gear. I had figured out I can turn it with a wrench and watch what happens. If I see anything suspicious, once I know it closes right, I'll just buy the new part. It's only about $30. Do you think I need to replace both if I replace one?There are two adjustments on the end of each arm. One is the one you showed but without the markings. I checked that as soon as it happened and I could find no evidence of it sliding. It's painted and dirty, so you would think I'd see something if it did move and it would have had to move nearly three inches. The other adjustment seems to be tilt. The only way that can move is by turning a bolt. There was no way for that to happen. I will take the measurement you mentioned. I'm sure it's off but it wont hurt to know exactly how much. Then I'll try to run it out with a wrench. I should probably remove both sheer bolts first. Maybe it sheered in a strange way and it just looks like they are intact. I was certain one had sheered because that's what's supposed to happen. They look good but you can't see inside obviously.Yes, the hydraulic rod just pushes and pulls one side. I don't see any advantage over an electric motor other than it being possible to put all slides out/in at once. I've never had a desire to do that because I like to pay attention when a slide is moving. Maybe I get under there Saturday. Snow just turned over to hard rain. Thanks again for the information. I could also call lippert now that I think of it. I think they made the landing jacks on our previous fifth wheel. I got stuck once 150 miles from the nearest town. They not only walked me through the repair, they also sold me the parts wholesale saving me over $200. I was really impressed. I think it was them but its been a long time.

bearsnob wrote:This does help a lot. We got another big snow storm and I've been thinking it through with the info here. I don't really see how it could jump the track for the reasons you mention. More likely would be a problem in the gear. I had figured out I can turn it with a wrench and watch what happens. If I see anything suspicious, once I know it closes right, I'll just buy the new part. It's only about $30. Do you think I need to replace both if I replace one?There are two adjustments on the end of each arm. One is the one you showed but without the markings. I checked that as soon as it happened and I could find no evidence of it sliding. It's painted and dirty, so you would think I'd see something if it did move and it would have had to move nearly three inches. The other adjustment seems to be tilt. The only way that can move is by turning a bolt. There was no way for that to happen. I will take the measurement you mentioned. I'm sure it's off but it wont hurt to know exactly how much. Then I'll try to run it out with a wrench. I should probably remove both sheer bolts first. Maybe it sheered in a strange way and it just looks like they are intact. I was certain one had sheered because that's what's supposed to happen. They look good but you can't see inside obviously. Hi again,I'm not following what gear you are referring too in the first paragraph in blue. Do you mean the pinion? I'm assuming so, just look at the teeth and if all is good, then OK. If damaged then yes change.You mentioned just turning the slide out with the wrench. Maybe a clarification here. On mine, and maybe yours, if both square shaft bolts are installed on the ends of the square shaft, you cannot use a wrench to crank out the slide. On mine, the motor ACME screw drive will prevent this. It locks the master rack/arm from moving. And the master arm/rack only moves if the electric actuator and the ACME screw drive runs. For me, I have to insert a hand crank on the actual ACME screw to move the slide manually in or out. Your hydraulic slide. I "think" yours shows up on page 28 of this user manual. You confirm. LCI hydraulic slide manualIf that is the one, yours master rack is locked in place by the cylinder where in my case the ACME screw drive and motor.Point being. Wrenching the square shaft with both square shaft drive bolts in will not allow the slide to move unless something is sheared off or partly sheared. Basic operation is, hydraulic cylinder moves the master slide arm. The master arm has a gear rack welded on the bottom of it and that rack drives a master rack pinion that then turns square shaft when the master arm moves. Then the square shaft drives the pinion of the slave rack and pushes/pulls the slave arm in or out. Now that said, if you are out of time and the slave rack is not compressing the slide totally upon retraction, then unbolting the master rack end drive bolt from the square shaft will allow you to turn the sq shaft with a wrench and push/pull the slave rack in or out. This is only due to the master pinion being unbolted. But the master rack never moves in this case. You can only turn by hand a short distance as the one end of the slide is moving and the other is not. You can also test if one of the square shaft bolts is partly sheared. Take each out and look at it. If you half sheared a square shaft drive bolt, that could be the bang. Then the slide is out of mechanical time due to the play in the drive bolt. Now the slide will not compress correctly against the camper and may not extend out equally either. Hope this helps and when the weather cooperates let us know how you made out. It is snowing here tonight too in Ohio...John

Slide alignment problem after awning hangs | Good Sam Community

33 Replies

bearsnob
Explorer
Feb 26, 2017
It all seemed pretty solid but I'm thinking there will be something not perfect and I'll probaby replace. That said, I hit it with the PB Blaster before bring the slide in and it came in like it was new. Surprised me. So there is still life in this assembly but I don't want to be messing with it again in two years.
JBarca
Nomad II
Feb 26, 2017
Your gaining Bill. 2 steps forward.

By chance did you look/feel for bronze bushing play on the pinion gear shaft ends plates? Curious if they are worn or not.

Keep at it, your gaining. The cross shaft telescoping being froze up, not surprising especially if the shaft assembly is outside the frame where road splash can get at it easier causing more corrosion. I was shocked mine came apart. For sure grease or anti seize it well when you put it back together.

Thanks

John
bearsnob
Explorer
Feb 26, 2017
Well, got the pinion assembly out. That was easy. The connecting arm dropped down but would not slide apart. Spayed it with penetrating oil but it didn't help. Turns out the bolt is hung up inside the shaft from the pinion assembly. Must be bent. It moves freely in the holes in the cross arm. I cut off the threaded side and tried to turn the bolt using the head. No luck tried everything I could think of. Wouldn't budge. Will try to slide the cross arm apart tomorrow, maybe using a ratchet strap to apply more force. If I can get that apart, it should be easier to get tho bolt out. If not, I'll just cut off the bolt head and drill it out. Getting there at snail speed. lol At least it was a nice warm sunny day. Being under there in 30 degrees and stiff wind was getting old fast. I'll have to inspect closer but the pinion gear assembly looked good. The rollers spun freely and it looked good in weak light. But I cant spin the gear until I get the bolt out. Such fun.
bearsnob
Explorer
Feb 24, 2017
Yeah, that helps. I was thinking it should be in. Ideally it would be fully out because it needs to be for me to try to correct the timing. I'll just hope that I can see why that bolt wouldn't come out and fix it so that it will come out when I run the slide out again. There's got to be a way even if I have to put in a narrower shear bolt for one trip. I'm hoping this one might actually be easy. I'm due for something being easier than I expected. ;)

When I get around to replacing the wear tabs, is that just a matter of disconnecting the inner arm, running it in past the wear tabs, replacing wear tabs, pulling the arm out and reconnecting in the same location? Or is it more involved? I won't be doing this now but thought since I'm down there fooling around, it won't hurt to have a general idea of how it's done.
JBarca
Nomad II
Feb 24, 2017
bearsnob wrote:
. Things are moving freely and the bolts should not be hard to get out. How should I brace the arm before taking the assembly out and do you have any tips beyond that?

Hi Bill,

Sounds like you have had a bugger of a time with that bolt. And laying on the ground working overhead. Not fun.

When you ask, how should you brace the slide arm when dropping out the pinion assembly, if that is what you are asking, then:

In my case, I had the slide all the way in when I pulled the pinion assembly out. The weight of the slide was held by the slide floor resting on the camper floor. On mine, there was no load on the pinion rollers. The pinion assembly came out real easy. No load at all.

BUT, that is my slide and the way the ends of the arms where adjusted. If your end of arms is higher then the slide floor, the arms may be holding up the slide floor load above the camper floor at the wall of the camper. You will need to watch for this. You can check if there is load on the pinion rollers by trying to spin them. If there is no load, they "should" spin by hand if they are not frozen up. With load, they won't and the bolts will come out real hard too. The slide arms while they can move some, should not drop out the bottom as there is a bent in edge on both sides still there to prevent fall out. Makes like a "C" shape. See mine. Yours should have those formed in edges too.

If the slide is fully out, the pinion rollers could have a good deal of load on them.

Ideally you take the pinion assembly out when the slide is fully retracted in. In may case, the pinions are inside the frame making it easy to do when the slide is in. Yours I believe are "outside" the frame. Is that correct?

If they are outside the frame and I'm assuming you need a little room to work in, then only put the slide out 8" to 12", just enough to work in there. Then you need to jack up the slide enough until you see the weight come off the arm and the pinion roller spins by hand. Then you know the weight is off the arm. Then you can take the pinion assembly out. If the pinion cannot be turned by hand, then weight is on the arm. (or it is frozen but you will see drags marks if the roller is frozen)

Do not jack the slide out in the middle of the floor area, no good there. There is no support. You have to lift at a wall area like the slide arm is doing. The wall ends are OK and the long wall is OK, just not out in the open area of the floor

Does that sound like it will fit your situation?

Here are some pics of me holding the slide up when I was fixing slide floor rot... NOTE: The slide is full out when I did this. The flanges where against the side of the camper and I had a concrete surface to jack from. In your case try try and get the jack as close to the slide as you can so something does not shift on the ground below you. I'm assuming you are on a dirt/gravel campsite

Hope this helps

John
bearsnob
Explorer
Feb 23, 2017
John, Nothing worked. I'm ready to drop out that pinion gear assembly as you suggested. Got the nuts off and penetration oil on the bolts. Things are moving freely and the bolts should not be hard to get out. How should I brace the arm before taking the assembly out and do you have any tips beyond that?

Can't wait to see why that shear bolt is such a bugger. I even jacked the slide up to try and get it out like that other fellow said would work for sure. Wouldn't budge. Broke my socket adapter trying to turn it. Put a pipe on a wrench for leverage and when the head of bolt was starting to break, I stopped. Good thing I have your method because that and drilling it out are pretty much the only options I see.

Thanks,
Bill
JBarca
Nomad II
Feb 21, 2017
Hi Bill,

No worries on the reply time. Hey, stuff happens... I figured you where up to your ears in something...

If this is really 2", OK that needs to get corrected for sure.

Bill wrote:
Right now they can't possibly be parallel because the slave rack is out of time by at least two inches.

I agree, get that taken care of. If it is really an entire 2" or even if 1 1/2", and it has been doing it a long time, that might be why the slide side wear plastic pad got burnt/tore out.

And the out of parallel can wait. It will not fix itself if it is wrong unless you unbolt the slide floor from the slide arms mounting brackets. And the C channel welded in the frame are not moving any time soon...

Now that all this is coming together this might have been the wear time line. To early to tell just yet, but here goes as you can look and see is any of this fits.

I think your camper is a 2005 from you sig. Mine is a 2004. And you may have had more use on yours. I did not retire until last August so we had only been weekend warrior'ing it since 2003. I know that my bronze bushings are now worn in the pinion assembly. They are not worn enough to jump teeth, but worn enough I will replace them before I put the slide drive back together.

A "thought" on how this came about.

1. Over time the bronze bushings worn out or enough to lower the pinnion shaft. The master rack one may be worse worn then the slave.

2. As time went on, somewhere along the way, the slide jumped a tooth. Maybe not all at once, and maybe it happened several times to create 1" or 1 1/2" of the 2" being off on the slave rack. The teeth jumps being small went unnoticed.

3. With the slave rack accumulated off that far, that would put the slide in a bind so to speak being nonparallel on the slide moving in and out.

4. Since the master rack does not need the gear drive to work as the hyd cylinder pull/pushes that arm, I can see the slave rack side being behind on the retract motion. This "might" pull the master rack away from the sq shaft side and put excess pressure on the hyd cylinder rod side plastic wear pad. Over time of this happening, the pad wore out. This will also affect the slave side wear pad on the sq shaft side.

5. The awning event may have been the final straw to float this to the top. I do not recall which side, master or slave side, the awing got hung up on. If the slave side, that makes more sense and the added drag made it jump a few more teeth during that event. Not that you got all 2" in one jump, the awning may have only jumped 1/4" or 1/2". Enough that it was load enough you really heard it.

I doubt the master rack wear pad tore out or wore out in one big event. I'm thinking it took time, a good while, maybe a year or more. If the slide was starting to come out of time and kept being used that way, then over time that pad took the blunt of the wear and went out first.

Once you get past the bolt and get to your next place, then the reality of changing those wear pads will come to mind. While the bronze bushing in the pinion drives comes out pretty easy, to put new plastic wear pads in, the whole slide arm has to come out. Means with the slide all the way in OR with the slide fully supported and out, you unhook the end of the slide arm from the hyd cylinder or on the slave side, the pinion assembly and pull out the arm, change pads and then put it all back together. And reset up the slide. Before you get to this you need to document where all adjustments are and understand how to adjust the slide correctly when it goes back together.

Hope this helps and good luck

John
bearsnob
Explorer
Feb 20, 2017
I'm still trying to get that darn bolt out. It's not making a lot of sense why I can't but I have a few more tricks to try including yours. I should have just drilled it out but I keep thinking that if I can find the way to get it out, then I can fix the other ones too.

I'm remembering rub marks from the wear tabs in all locations where there are tabs but it's been a while. I'll double check in a bit and measure.

I'm thinking that before I check on how parallel the slide arms are, I need to get both sides pretty close to being in time. Right now they can't possibly be parallel because the slave rack is out of time by at least two inches. That means that side hits first when pulling the slide in and master rack side hits second. At one time the master rack side wasn't pulling all the way in. There was a gap of about half an inch. It was probably the fact that I used a dry graphite lubricant mainly on the pinions that it pulled in all the way last time.

The other thing that's happening is I'm in a RV park and they don't want you doing mechanical work on your rig. We just learned that we're back hosting the middle of next month. So my immediate goal is to get that bolt out, get timing as correct as possible, and lubricate everything really well so I have no problems getting the slide in when we leave and back out at our destination about 90 minutes from here. There I have a large shop at my disposal and rangers who will probably bring me anything I need if it isn't already there. So that's the plan right now.

Do you think I need to measure how parallel the arms are before I correct the timing problem?
bearsnob
Explorer
Feb 20, 2017
Darn it John. I'm feeling pretty stupid about now. I'm trying to do most of this on my phone and on a system that isn't mobile friendly. I was thinking you must have gotten sick or something because I hasn't seen a reply in a while. Then I just realized there was a second page now. You replied quickly as always and I wasn't aware. I'm really sorry about that. Please forgive me
JBarca
Nomad II
Feb 20, 2017
Also, mine has a grade 8, 1/4" bolt in the square shaft from Sunline who built my camper. Lippert made the frame and put their slide drive in it. So it might have been Lippert who put my bolts in originally. One end is full body and no threads in the square shaft hole and the nut end has some threads. That grade 8 bolt shown by the 6 radial lines on the bolt head is not really a shear bolt setup. In my case, I do not have enough motor drive power to shear that bolt. My motor will either ratchet the overload clutch or the motor just stops as it ran out of power. Seems stalling this DC motor is OK.