For the newbies who are TT hunting this may be of some use.The dry weight on my 25 ft. Dutchman is listed at 5004 lbs. Tongue weight is said to be 462 lbs. (about 9%)Twice I weighed my rig with and without the TT before a trip. The first trip was local and the TT weighted 6040 lbs. of which 500 lbs. was the tongue weight, as measured by the increase in the TV axel weights.(about 8%) The second trip was an extended jaunt and we seem to have taken everything except the front door knob. The TT weighted 6420 lbs. of which the tongue weight was 840 lbs. (about 13%)Our family consists of two adults and a dog so there are not a lot of toys etc.So the message is, the dry weight is only a rough guide for comparing TT models, adding 1000 or 1200 lbs. to the dry weight and figuring 12% for tongue weight is a pretty good rule of thumb.Good Luck

Trailer GVWR times 12% for wet tongueIF tow vehicle can not handle GVWR of trailer than tow vehicle is too small or trailer is too bigThis way you will never have too much or not enough.

rbpru wrote:For the newbies who are TT hunting this may be of some use.The dry weight on my 25 ft. Dutchman is listed at 5004 lbs. Tongue weight is said to be 462 lbs. (about 9%)Listed where? Unfortunately many prospective newbie owners looking for a TT will look at brochure specs for the trailer they may be interested in and actually believe that it's listed dry weight reflects what that trailer will actually weigh as it leaves the factory, which is completely false as those weight ratings are based on a bone stock model with no options or accessories, in fact a version the manufacturer doesn't even build. Factory listed sticker dry weight is an entirely different thing and is the only dry weight rating that should be given any credence at all. If you're going to offer advice to newbies you need to be more specific. ;)

So true about the "brochure dry weights" vs the as built empty weight vs the loaded weight!As an example of our '16 Jayco 32 BHDS:Brochure weights:Trailer 7,600lbsTW ~920lbs (can't remember exactly at the moment.Yellow sticker weight w/ est battery weight added:8,000lbs (close enough to round off!)As loaded ready to camp. When I weighed we didn't have the boys clothes, few toys, tv, or dvd player in the bunk room, or the rear cargo hitch mounted with the bike rack and bikes. Or the shelves in the wardrobes or fence post sleeves mounted yet.Trailer 8,660lbsTW 1400lbsEstimated weight now since changes:Trailer ~9,200lbsTW - not sure if there was a change or not. Only a trip to the scale will tell. Possible a little lower due to the bike rack and bikes.

My dry weight was listed in the factory info. The only thing I thought the dry weight info useful for, was comparing it to other models. It is the same for towing capacity vs. max cargo. Two other important features rarely mentioned out side of this forum.

When shopping for an RV, I assume that it will weigh the GVWR when traveling. I totally ignore the dry weight.

Dry weight vs. ready to go weight. | Good Sam Community

dodge_guy
Explorer II
Nov 04, 2015
Campfire Time wrote:
SoundGuy wrote:

Of course you can! :( Rigs spec'd with so much CCC that very few would actually use could convince one it's necessary to go up a category in tow vehicle, say 3/4 ton instead of 1/2 ton, when in fact it wouldn't be required at all with a reasonable cargo load. If a trailer's GVW, loaded and ready to camp, is comfortably within it's GVWR then fine, use the GVWR as a worse case scenario, but if GVW with a practical load is several thousand pounds below GVWR then it would be a horrendous mistake to use GVWR as a guide in determining which tow vehicle category would be necessary to safely tow that particular trailer. Good grief, no wonder so many newbies find the subject safe towing so confusing! :S

You can really box yourself in a corner by using the method you are using. What you are suggesting is that a newbie guess at how much they will load in a trailer. How would they know? How would you know what they might load into their trailer? Talk about confusing! They won't really know until they get the trailer and weigh it, and it may be too late by then. Sure there are situations where one could be towing several thousand lbs below the GVWR. But that's going to be exception not the general rule. This is especially true when talking about smaller trailers, 24ft or so and less. Many trailers in this size range have less than 1000# of CC after the options are added.

Keep in mind that many people start out "packing light" then see all this extra available space and guess what? It's like the basement and garage. They find ways to fill the space. If they used your method of sizing, they run into decreased towing ability and complain about how bad their TV is. Why not size everything properly from the get go and have breathing room?

I've knowingly had 2 rigs very close to my capacities. Yes it worked, yes it was safe. But in both cases it was a less than stellar towing experience and very limiting on how far and what kind of terrain I could take my trailers on. I just don't like suggesting to newbies to skimp when they have a chance to size things comfortably.

Yes, but adding to 1200-1500 lbs to a trailer with a 1500lb CCC would put it at it`s GVWR. and that`s the reason 1200-1500lbs is a good number to add to the dry weight!
myredracer
Explorer II
Nov 04, 2015
It would be worthwhile looking at axle and tire ratings too before purchasing and comparing them to the GVWR. I looked at a TT on display recently and noticed that the axle and tires were loaded to within literally a few lbs of their rating (after deducting for est. TW). The tires and the axles won't have equal wt. on them. This isn't an uncommon situation and can eventually lead to bent axles and premature tires.

In the case of our make/model of TT, when fully loaded up for camping with the usual variety of stuff (nothing heavy like say tools), it's about 200 lbs away from the GVWR and that's with one battery and empty holding tanks. Wouldn't take much to go over the GVWR. Fortunately we are good on the tire and axle ratings. I would bet that a lot of TT's get unknowingly loaded up close to or even over the GVWR. Going to a scale is always a good idea regardless.
Campfire_Time
Explorer
Nov 04, 2015
SoundGuy wrote:

Of course you can! :( Rigs spec'd with so much CCC that very few would actually use could convince one it's necessary to go up a category in tow vehicle, say 3/4 ton instead of 1/2 ton, when in fact it wouldn't be required at all with a reasonable cargo load. If a trailer's GVW, loaded and ready to camp, is comfortably within it's GVWR then fine, use the GVWR as a worse case scenario, but if GVW with a practical load is several thousand pounds below GVWR then it would be a horrendous mistake to use GVWR as a guide in determining which tow vehicle category would be necessary to safely tow that particular trailer. Good grief, no wonder so many newbies find the subject safe towing so confusing! :S

You can really box yourself in a corner by using the method you are using. What you are suggesting is that a newbie guess at how much they will load in a trailer. How would they know? How would you know what they might load into their trailer? Talk about confusing! They won't really know until they get the trailer and weigh it, and it may be too late by then. Sure there are situations where one could be towing several thousand lbs below the GVWR. But that's going to be exception not the general rule. This is especially true when talking about smaller trailers, 24ft or so and less. Many trailers in this size range have less than 1000# of CC after the options are added.

Keep in mind that many people start out "packing light" then see all this extra available space and guess what? It's like the basement and garage. They find ways to fill the space. If they used your method of sizing, they run into decreased towing ability and complain about how bad their TV is. Why not size everything properly from the get go and have breathing room?

I've knowingly had 2 rigs very close to my capacities. Yes it worked, yes it was safe. But in both cases it was a less than stellar towing experience and very limiting on how far and what kind of terrain I could take my trailers on. I just don't like suggesting to newbies to skimp when they have a chance to size things comfortably.
LarryJM
Explorer II
Nov 04, 2015
SoundGuy wrote:
Campfire Time wrote:
While I agree that people can load different amounts of weight, by using the GVWR as a guide you will never be wrong on sizing your tow vehicle.

Of course you can! :( Rigs spec'd with so much CCC that very few would actually use could convince one it's necessary to go up a category in tow vehicle, say 3/4 ton instead of 1/2 ton, when in fact it wouldn't be required at all with a reasonable cargo load. If a trailer's GVW, loaded and ready to camp, is comfortably within it's GVWR then fine, use the GVWR as a worse case scenario, but if GVW with a practical load is several thousand pounds below GVWR then it would be a horrendous mistake to use GVWR as a guide in determining which tow vehicle category would be necessary to safely tow that particular trailer. Good grief, no wonder so many newbies find the subject safe towing so confusing! :S

The big issue with your train of thought is you haven't and realistically can't provide any concrete numbers as evidenced by you subjective use of "comfortably within it's GVWR", "reasonable cargo load", "practical load is several thousand pounds below GVWR", etc. IMO is you don't have several thousand lbs "SLOP" in towing capability then you are probably not going to have a "GOOD" towing combination that is comfortable to tow more than a couple of hundred miles at a time.

Larry
rbpru
Explorer II
Nov 04, 2015
I agree that a TV capable of handling the gross weight would be nice, but it is not going to happen.

The cost, upkeep and ride of my F-150 is quite enough.

I would like to have a dedicated TV but mine must also serve my daily needs.

When loaded I am at or near the max cargo but it has pulled and handled well for the last 13,000 miles.
Huntindog
Explorer
Nov 03, 2015
SoundGuy wrote:
Campfire Time wrote:
While I agree that people can load different amounts of weight, by using the GVWR as a guide you will never be wrong on sizing your tow vehicle.

Of course you can! :( Rigs spec'd with so much CCC that very few would actually use could convince one it's necessary to go up a category in tow vehicle, say 3/4 ton instead of 1/2 ton, when in fact it wouldn't be required at all with a reasonable cargo load. If a trailer's GVW, loaded and ready to camp, is comfortably within it's GVWR then fine, use the GVWR as a worse case scenario, but if GVW with a practical load is several thousand pounds below GVWR then it would be a horrendous mistake to use GVWR as a guide in determining which tow vehicle category would be necessary to safely tow that particular trailer. Good grief, no wonder so many newbies find the subject safe towing so confusing! :S
It is NEVER a horrendous mistake to have more truck than you need... It can be if you have less truck than you need.

These are guidelines, Not absolutes. Most newbies have a lot to absorb when getting into this... The numbers probably are not really understood by many.. GVW is a simple number that will keep one from making a big mistake... And if you are one of the few lucky ones that happen to have a lot of CC... Be thankfull. Most TTs are not that way. Therefore the guideline is a good one.

As for those that profess to know exactly how much weight thay will load... I find that hard to believe. My weight varies a LOT. Depends on just what activity I am doing, and how long. I just returned from a remote 21 day Boondocking/hunting trip.... I was very HEAVY. A quick dog trial weekend will have me a lot lighter..

I guess if all one ever does is sit around a campfire, then they may have an idea of what they will weigh... I rarely have time for a campfire.
rbpru
Explorer II
Nov 03, 2015
Almost all TV's will run out of cargo capacity before towing capacity. My F-150 will tow 9500 lbs but it can only carry 1411 lbs of cargo.

So if I put 1000 lbs of tongue weight on it plus the 200 lbs truck cap and me. I have to leave the wife and dog home.

Check the door post for your payload capacity subtract tongue weight and what is left is people and stuff capacity.
westend
Explorer
Nov 03, 2015
twxsby89 wrote:
After reading through this, I am concerned I may have ordered a bit much. I just ordered a new bumper pull travel trailer that weighs 7454 lbs. empty. My truck is rated to tow 9400. (meaning I can take 2000 lbs with me, right?) When I was discussing this with the dealer, of course, my truck would pull it with ease.
Is there a certain kind of weight distribution hitch I should get to help, added tranny cooler maybe? This is my first real trailer.
Thanks
Tom
Best to start your own thread, Tom. Figuring out trailer-truck combinations gets complicated. When asking about equipment list the year, brand,size, and model of trailer. Same for the truck. More information is better than less. Also, come prepared with the sticker weights of the cargo sticker on the driver's door jamb. That is the first thing you will be asked.
RavensFan24
Explorer
Nov 03, 2015
Campfire Time wrote:

Regarding the yellow sticker, that's the "As Shipped" weight which will always be more than the dry weight. That's because it takes into account the weight of options, which are not part of the dry weight. Depending on the manufacturer, things like the awning, AC, TV set, and even the spare tire are options.

When I got my Premier, we got every possible option and the brochure weight was higher than the yellow sticker weight. It was actually lighter by 200lbs.
twxsby89
Explorer
Nov 03, 2015
Started new thread