3000W Chinese Gensets Info.

[professor95]

professor95 wrote:
EDIT ADDED 45/5/2013- When this thread started in March of 2005, I never expected to see it survive this long or amass the quantity of information that has been shared here.

In the eight year run of this thread we have amassed almost 10,000 postings and surpassed a million views. This creates somewhat of a dilemma for anyone who has just discovered the forum.

Since the amount of information is virtually overwhelming, I suggest you set your preferences for this thread to read "newest first" and then begin to page backwards.

What you will find in these pages is a wealth of info on virtually any make or model of Chinese manufactured synchronous (non-inverter) generator in the 3,000 watt performance class. Info will include how to rewire series coils to parallel to obtain maximum wattage from a single 120 volt outlet. Tips on further reducing sound levels, how to care for these generators, which ones are "RV ready" and provide the best overall performance for the dollar invested. Which companies NOT to deal with, where the best prices are, how to safely wire the generator into a home or RV, how to check your RV for electrical faults, sources for generator accessories, which 20/30 adapters are safe to use and which are not. How to convert a gasoline generator to propane or NG. This is only the beginning. The forum has a life of its own with the focus sub-topic switching frequently. Still, the main topic of utilizing the amazing, inexpensive Chinese gensets is always there. The amount of creativity and innovation presented in these pages is indicative of the talents shared in the diverse backgrounds of the folks who make up our combined RV community.

Many of the original brands and models of Chinese gensets mentioned in the introduction and early pages of the thread have since disappeared. New EPA and CARB emissions requirements, company bonds assuring the emissions warranty will be honored even if the company goes out of business, and fierce competition in the industry have changed the playing field. Champion Power Equipment has become the apparent "trophy team" providing an ever expanding retail outlet, an ample parts supply, a strong warranty and excellent customer service. CPE has continued to improve their product and now offers a new model (#46538) with exclusive convenience, safety and performance features aimed at the RV market. Big names like Cummins/Onan, Honda and Generac all now have Chinese built open frame synchronous gensets available. Ironically, the prices often found on these gensets has not significantly changed during the past eight years - even with the devaluation of the American Dollar and new EPA/CARB requirements.

I also encourage you to use the search function and even the advanced search options to find information. Key works such as "rewiring", "PowerPro", "Champion", "Onan Homesite", "Duropower", "ETQ", "Jiung Dong or JD", "Tractor Supply", "Costco", "Lowe's" and "Home Depot" are all examples of keywords that will give you specific information on different models being sold by retailers today.

Or, you can fill your glass with your favorite beverage (keep more close by - maybe some munchies as well :D, sit back at your computer, tell your wife (or significant other) that you will see her in the morning and spend the next 10 or so hours reading through the postings.

No one on the forum gets mad if you ask a question that is a repeat. Please do not hesitate to post to the forum. All questions are considered important and those active on the forum will do their best to respond with a valid answer.

Also note we are not out to knock the Honda, Yamaha, Kipor or other brands of high end digital gensets. We recognize the quality of these products and their suitability for quite, efficient RV use. But, there is a flood of reliable, inexpensive and comparatively lower cost gensets coming out of China that are excellent alternative choices for the RVer wanting power to run an air conditioner, microwave, etc. without excessive noise or breaking the budget.

Oh, one last thing. The folks on this forum are true gentlemen. We do not flame one another or the product discussed - period. Ugly contributors usually have their comments and remarks ignored by our masses. It is not a forum to start arguments to obtain a clear win. We do disagree on many issues, but we have all agreed to do that in a respectable manner.

We now have the introduction of more and more inverter gensets. There is a rather extensive thread named "The Official Unofficial Champion 2000i Generator" on this forum. Today, I added info on the new Champion 3100i inverter genset. Discussion on this product may get moved to its own thread at a later date.

Many have looked upon this thread with distain saying Chinese is cheap and doomed to failure. I remember saying exactly the same thing about Japanese products a few decades back. But, over the past eight years the track record for Chinese built generators has shown otherwise.

Please, join us in a fascinating journey down the Chinese built genset road of knowledge.

This is the question I posted that got it all started back in March 2005.......

Randy

For a little over a month now, I have been somewhat intrigued by the availability of a 3000 watt, 6.5 HP generator at Pep Boys and Northern Tool for under $300.00. The engine on this generator looks identical to a Honda 6.5 HP OHV engine. Knowing that the Chinese have become very adept at “cloning” reputable technologies from other manufacturers, I was not surprised at the similarities. Neither store could give me any information on the generator nor did they have a “running” display model.

I have done a little research. This is what I have discovered:

Many of these generators are imported by ELIM International (www.eliminternational.com) out of Buffalo, New York from Jiung Manufacturing in China. (The unit at Northern is identical but carries the JIUNG name.)

The engines are indeed a Chinese knockoff of the popular 6.5 HP 196cc Honda Engine. “Supposedly” Honda has licensed the engine technology to the Chinese manufacturer of the product.

The Chinese company that makes the ELM3000 generators is a rather large, diverse, long-standing company with a reputation for “above average quality” Chinese made products (Jiung Manufacturing). There are many more Chinese companies making almost identical gensets.

The generators at PepBoys do have a six month limited warranty. But, it is only on the engine (not the generator) and requires paying for shipping to and from Buffalo. Probably not a very practical thing to do if you have warranty issues.

ELIM does supply replacement parts (a PDF parts manual is available on the ELIM web site). No prices are given for replacement parts nor is there an “availability listing”.

The generator head itself is a brushless design. The only really significant wear parts in the generator are the bearings – most likely universally available.

The published dB rating is 67 at 23 feet. This is “reasonably” quite for a generator of this size as most comparabl.... The 67 dB rating is the same as Honda gives their 3000 watt CycloInverter with a “look alike” eng...

[professor95]

I think the confusion may be over what you have shared and the bulletin on how to start and use the generator if the battery is dead.

So, yes, apparently there are three bulletins. One on the charge diode, another on the battery wire install and the last on the dead battery start issue.

[W8NONU]

I thought there was another tech bulletin or supplement to the owner's manual so I emailed CPE. They sent the following technical bulletin stating this was the only one they had.

Technical Bulletin
Number: 2030002
Charge Diode Replacement Model (46538)

(Note: Read instructions completely before performing service)

Issue Date: 08/09/2010

1) Make sure fuel valve is in the off position.

2) Remove black (–) lead from battery with 10mm wrench,
socket or Phillips screw driver.

3) Remove red (+) lead from battery. Remove the battery
from the unit and place a safe distance away.

4) Remove the 4 corner bolts from the front panel to access
the charge coil diode.

5) Remove the plastic control box cover located on the far
left corner (2 screws).

6) Remove the white wire harness connector attached to the
diode box found on the far left of the control box.

7) Connect the new charge coil diode to the wire harness
harness connector. The original charge diode does not
need to be removed.

😎 Replace and secure the control box cover (2 screws)
followed by the front panel (4 bolts).

9) Re-attach the ground cable to the ground terminal inside
front panel between the panel and from mount.

10) Replace the battery into the battery box.

11) Re-connect the red (+) cable to the battery followed by
the black (–) cable.

12) If the battery does not have enough charge to electrically
start the unit, use the recoil starter and allow it to run
for approximately 2 hours to re-charge. Once the battery
has been re-charged the unit will start with the wireless
remote or using the ignition switch located on the power
panel.

TECH TIPS:

–– When not using the unit for more than one day make sure to flip the ignition switch to the “Off” position.

–– When not using the unit for more than one week, remove negative cable from battery.

–– When not using the unit for extented periods of time, the battery should be removed and stored in a cool dry place. A 12V
automatic battery charger with automatic trickle charging capability should be used to charge the battery. Maximum charging
rate should not exceed 2 amps. Follow the instructions included with the battery charger. The battery should be fully charged
at least once per month (Note: A Float Charger will maintain the battery condition over long storage periods).

[professor95]

W8NONU wrote:


Was there another Tech Bulletin for the 46538 other than the on on 09.08.2010? I tried looking at the CPE website and couldn't find anything.

Paul always drops me an e-mail when tech bulletins such as the one on 09.08.2010 are issued. I am not aware of any others at this time.

[W8NONU]

professor95 wrote:

Paul Cole wrote:
Here is a grounding disconnect cable that we will provide to all purchasers of the model 46538 wireless.



We are only preventing accelerated discharge by the addition of this cable. There are no defects that proper battery maintenance won't resolve. The cable makes it much easier. The use of a float charger will give them longer durations of battery protection. Using the float chargers offered by www.harborfreight.com (search - float charger) will be the cheapest insurance to maintain battery life. Tell anyone with this model to provide registration of their warranty or if it is already registered, we will send this cable at no charge. A call to our customer service weekdays will satisfy our ability to provide this cable.

Thanks,

Paul Cole
Sr. Tech
Champion Power Equipment

This was an e-mail I received earlier today.

WOW. Talk about proactive. How many companies do you know that will do this? This is a much better solution than my "alligator clip" posted earlier.

Thank you for all the updates, prof. Just called CPE and requested the disconnect...1-877-338-0999 spoke with Gina.

Was there another Tech Bulletin for the 46538 other than the on on 09.08.2010? I tried looking at the CPE website and couldn't find anything.

[tvman44]

Well said professor.

[professor95]

waybo418 wrote:
I put my opinion in JC. But you know what they say about opinions.....

I'm not JC, but you did good!

If you spent 20 years as a LEO you know that bad attitudes from both sides are to be expected. But, no matter what you say and do or even what punishment may be dealt, those attitudes often remain (my son is an LEO - 16 years now).

I'll go back and read that thread to get my funnies for the day, but have no desire to make any more contributions.

That said, one of my more emphatic statements is, "It is not important to have the quietest generator in the CG, what is important is not having the loudest."

The Champion open frame generator is really no quieter than other Chinese brands with the same size/style engine and low tone muffler. Compared to a 2,000 watt inverter half it's size and usually with 1/4 the load, the Champ can appear extremely loud. Unfortunately the open frame Champ has to run at 3,600 rpm all the time regardless of load.

But, I would hardly put the Champ in the same class as a "contractor generator". Contractor generators are usually 5,000 watts or more so they can run two Skill saws at once. The engines are much larger and you will not see a low tone muffler, but rather a tin can with holes in the end bolted to the manifold. They roar at 77 to 85 dbA or more and are truly unwelcome in any camping situation where there are other campers. Why some of those guys want to put the 3,500 watt Champions in with the contractor generators only speaks to how ignorant they are to the differences.

It is kinda' like the speeder you would most likely go after to ticket is the fastest car in the pack. People will complain about the loudest genset. It is human nature 😄

Some folks buy strictly by name brand (not all, thank goodness). Certain name brands have come to be considered "elite" and thus carry a certain amount of owner prestige. You know, I have a Rollex - you have a Timex. I have a New Honda SUV - You have an old Pontiac Mini-Van. My jeans are designer brand from chic clothing boutiques - yours come from Wal-Mart. My dog has a pedigree - yours is just a mutt. And..... so on and so on.

Could it possibly be that this quirk of human nature and behavior has anything to do with only buying red or blue? Maybe NOT spending 4x as much for 1/2 of the power appears to be a poor decision because the "name" is wrong - not because it is said to be a few dbA quieter.

"Made in China" is still a bad word. It conjures up images of cheap, unsafe and poor quality to many people. Chinese products have been blamed for costing America jobs. In some cases this is true. Sadly, Americans don't want or buy American products - they cost too much. (But we still complain about imports).

I'm old enough to remember the Japanese electronics and automobile revolution. When you heard "made in Japan" you immediately thought of cheap, inferior made goods. The old Paradigm shifted - pretty darn fast, I might add. It is shifting again and Chinese made goods are loosing their reputation of inferiority. Actually, to our chagrin, some pretty darn good stuff is being made in China. The current crop of portable generators is only one example.

One last thought - My camper has a washer and dryer. It has an electric fireplace. It has a central vacuum. It has an automatic electric awning. It has a Sleep Number bed. It has a 32" LCD TV in the living room and a 26" LCD in the bedroom. It has two rooftop air conditioners. It has a porcelain potty. Does this is any way make me a big shot camper better than someone else? I think not. If I wanted a Honda or Yamaha I could afford one, but I see no need to pay for their advertising. It is not just money, it is preferences as well. I'm no better a camper than the guy in a pup tent or worse than the one with a bright red Honda.

Lastly, why am I writing this? Honestly, I don't know. I started writing while I was waiting for the guy that is here to clean the carpets, and it just kept going, and going. I do that occasionally - I guess I must have the Energizer gene in me. Anyway, he is here now so I will shut up. :B

[waybo418]

I put my opinion in JC. But you know what they say about opinions.....

[jasult]

professor95 wrote:

gramps1941 wrote:
I get coupons by email weekly . I got one in mail. Regular price is $19.99

Gramps

OK. Thanks. I'll look through my HF fliers.

The 20% off coupons are usually in Good Sam Highways magazine. I have used them on more expensive items. They come in handy too.

Professor - I always clip out the 20% coupon out of the magazines and keep one in wallet as well. You can just print the coupon from the link I posted as well if need in hurry.

[class_A_wannabe]

msmd1 wrote:
I charged the battery overnight and when reinstalling it, found a 4" white wire coming from the back of the left end of the control panel hanging loose. I cannot seem to find anywhere it should be connected. :?

When I got my 46538 from Costco it had a defective AVR. When troubleshooting the problem with the Champion tech on the phone noticed the same white wire stubbed out behind the control panel. Was told it was an antenna for the remote.

Last week I gave it the once a month test startup & found the battery dead also. Gave it a good overnight feeding with the vectron automatic & in the morning it cranked over the first time I hit the remote. Now I have the neg disconnected until I can pick up a harbor freight special. Thanks Champion for the quick comeback to the problem. A true customer oriented company comes through again...

[professor95]

gramps1941 wrote:
I get coupons by email weekly . I got one in mail. Regular price is $19.99

Gramps

OK. Thanks. I'll look through my HF fliers.

The 20% off coupons are usually in Good Sam Highways magazine. I have used them on more expensive items. They come in handy too.

[gramps1941]

I get coupons by email weekly . I got one in mail. Regular price is $19.99

Gramps

[jasult]

professor95 wrote:

gramps1941 wrote:
Harbor Freight has a New 1.5 amp 3-stage onboard Charger/Mainter
That works great on Riding Mower Batteries & Out board Motor Batteries.
Item # 99857 With coupon $9.99 would be good for generator batteries.

Gramps

Thanks for the info. Where does one find the coupon?

coupon

[professor95]

gramps1941 wrote:
Harbor Freight has a New 1.5 amp 3-stage onboard Charger/Mainter
That works great on Riding Mower Batteries & Out board Motor Batteries.
Item # 99857 With coupon $9.99 would be good for generator batteries.

Gramps

Thanks for the info. Where does one find the coupon?

[gramps1941]

Harbor Freight has a New 1.5 amp 3-stage onboard Charger/Mainter
That works great on Riding Mower Batteries & Out board Motor Batteries.
Item # 99857 With coupon $9.99 would be good for generator batteries.

Gramps

[professor95]

Paul Cole wrote:
Here is a grounding disconnect cable that we will provide to all purchasers of the model 46538 wireless.



We are only preventing accelerated discharge by the addition of this cable. There are no defects that proper battery maintenance won't resolve. The cable makes it much easier. The use of a float charger will give them longer durations of battery protection. Using the float chargers offered by www.harborfreight.com (search - float charger) will be the cheapest insurance to maintain battery life. Tell anyone with this model to provide registration of their warranty or if it is already registered, we will send this cable at no charge. A call to our customer service weekdays will satisfy our ability to provide this cable.

Thanks,

Paul Cole
Sr. Tech
Champion Power Equipment

This was an e-mail I received earlier today.

WOW. Talk about proactive. How many companies do you know that will do this? This is a much better solution than my "alligator clip" posted earlier.