Keystone Furnace and outdoor stove WONT LIGHT HELP!!!!!!!

[dblworkingmom]

OK in the fall we purchased our 2010 Keystone Laredo 291TG. The first time out the furnace worked, though we did not check the outdoor stove and we only started it briefly and waited for it to blow warm air then shut it off (just checking if it worked). A few outings later we needed to use the furnace due to the temp dropping over night, BUT no heat 😞 so furnace was not working just blowing cold air for about 30 seconds. BIG bummer. I figured ok this is our last trip we must be almost out of propane the indoor stove would light but I has assumed we did not have enough propane to get back to the furnace, refilled the tanks this spring (they were almost full to begin with) and still NO furnace and this weekend found that the outdoor kitchen stove would not light either. We can smell propane at the outdoor kitchen but can not get it to light. Does anyone know what the problem could be? Is there a valve I might be missing? Sure hoping not to have to take our "new" baby into the shop already 😞 any Help would be greatly appreciated!

[westend]

Check inlet and exhaust ducts to make sure there are no obstructions. Check sail switch for proper operation. Make sure there is voltage from thermostat to furnace control board. Check high limit switch for passing voltage.

Adequate 12V current must be available for the blower to operate and move the sail switch. If you have a weak battery, replace before doing any furnace troubleshooting.

[DiskDoctr]

dblworkingmom wrote:
Super Bummed guys, resetting the lines worked for our outdoor kitchen, as well as the water heater but still no furnace 😞

Well, that is a start 🙂

What do you have for a propane regulator? The furnace is likely your largest user of propane volume, so they will push the tank and regulator more than anything else.

When you are using propane, feel your tanks and regulator with your hands. Are the cold? Are they frosty?

The furnace also needs a sufficient flow of intake air from the outside vent. Check with a light to see if there is anything inside the tube.

Dust and webs and bugs, whatever can partially block the intake.

Also make sure nothing has fallen down on/around the furnace from inside. Sometimes papers will fall out of the backs of drawers and interfere.

[dblworkingmom]

Super Bummed guys, resetting the lines worked for our outdoor kitchen, as well as the water heater but still no furnace :(. Going to pull out the furnace this evening and make an attempt to diagnose the problem, rumour has it I can hook it to a basic propane bottle and a battery, to test it before I reinstall the whole unit, but that makes me a bit nervous any one ever done this?? Why don't they make these things with an access panel to the front of the heater any more sooo silly!!!! Our access panel is inside the camper under the bunks and it opens to the back of the heater from what I read I actually have to detach the propane and wiring and pull the whole unit out to service it. I suppose this is the Dealers way to make it more likely you will have a pro service the unit. Any helpful tips guys? I will take some photo's this evening as I go, to see what else could be up thanks again this thread has been great.

[RoyB]

jauguston wrote:
Roy,

FWIW we have been using a small Mr-Buddy heater plumbed to our onboard propane tank for the last 10 years in three different motorhomes. We run it 24/7 when it is cold and are still healthy. Our detectors have never come on except when I test them. We leave a roof vent slightly cracked open to satisfy the instructions provided with the heaters that a fresh air opening equal to a 3" diameter hole is provided.

Jim

Jim we do basically the same here using the single 1LB propane canister model MR BUDDY heater... I just got gun-shy reading all the comments from everyone about what the problems could be. Of course we have a couple of real good rv'ers on here that are CO Poisoning survivors which makes one really look at the MR BUDDY type heaters in another light. I have used them way back in my Tent camping days and run a many of 1lb propane canisters thru them. No issues here as well. There is just something basically wrong with cracking windows and vents and run a heater at the same time haha... Only recently I started shutting them down when we go to sleep at night... We like the covers and the zipped up sleeping bag halfs on the POPUP trailer beds... We definitely don't get cold haha...

I really want to install one of those CAT propane heaters that have outside venting capability... Talked with a couple of users -one with a TC floor space and he said it would run them out of his TC with good clean heat... I like that idea.
would look like this install...



Google Images

I also have looked into doing the HYDRONIC type hot water heater and that would really be my best bet getting the somewhat smaller amount of heat we need. It is definitely very safe to use,,, This is all run in an closed hot water loop. Would have to experiment on how much propane will be needed to keep the hot water heater hot all the time... The only thing would be to run the propane a few times thru the night perhaps to keep the hot water at a thermostat setting since it is a closed loop. The two axial DC fans on it don't draw very much current as well... This is most likely the way we will go when we finally pull out the propane furnace... Will be something like this drawing...


Roy's image

Roy Ken

[dblworkingmom]

RoyB wrote:
If you have a propane tank problem does the stove top also not light up OK... The same propane tank feeds both stove top and furnace

AT least that is the way my propane system works...

The indoor stove top works (closest item to the propane) the oven does not light, the outdoor stove does not work, have not dewinterized so not sure about water heater yet. Going to try a "reset" tonight and go from there, if I have to I may end up pulling the heater out and checking the sail switch. Like you suggested.

[jauguston]

Roy,

FWIW we have been using a small Mr-Buddy heater plumbed to our onboard propane tank for the last 10 years in three different motorhomes. We run it 24/7 when it is cold and are still healthy. Our detectors have never come on except when I test them. We leave a roof vent slightly cracked open to satisfy the instructions provided with the heaters that a fresh air opening equal to a 3" diameter hole is provided.

Jim

[RoyB]

If you have a propane tank problem does the stove top also not light up OK... The same propane tank feeds both stove top and furnace

AT least that is the way my propane system works...

[dblworkingmom]

DutchmenSport wrote:
Will the outdoor stove lite with a match?

No dutchmen it wont that's what makes me think its more of a propane pressure problem than a furnace problem at least I hope so lol

[DutchmenSport]

Will the outdoor stove lite with a match?

[RoyB]

If you are seeing a good blue flame when using the stove top this will tell you your propane tanks is working correctly.

All of the propane furnaces have a safety switch in front of the furnace blower that blows against what they call a SAIL SWITCH. If this switch does not operate properly it will close the propane valve feeding the furnace and shutting it down like you are seeing... This sail switch is mounted in line with the blower duct and could pick up a big bunch of debris etc and may need cleaned up to operate properly...

I always make sure my stove top burners are working good and the 12V DC Furnace fan is blowing good before starting up my propane furnace. About the only thing left to inspect is the SAIL SWITCH action.

The Furnace blower fan does operate from the 12V Battery System so it can be used when you are off-grid somewhere. It will draw around 5-6AMPS DC Current and will run down your battery in one nights of furnace use with no shore power available. Something you need to consider if you are without shore power or generator somewhere...

I also carry a couple of Electric OIL FILLED heaters with us our trips as a plan-B for heat... We will plug an extension cord into the the pedestal 20A Service just to operate the stand alone Electric heater.

Same goes for when camping off grid somewhere. We will use a smaller propane heater like the MR BUDDY series for heat when we are up and awake. When we go to bed we will get under the covers haha. Too dangerous to run a Mr BUDDY heater when you go to sleep. You just might not wake up due to CO poisoning...

I really hate our propane furnace as its blower is way to loud for our small foot print POPUP trailer and it also produces WAY TOO MUCH heat. Runs us completely out of the trailer when it is running hehe... One of these years I want to remove my propane furnace and replace it with a Hot Water HYDRONIC type heater.

Roy Ken

[dblworkingmom]

DiskDoctr I'm pumped!!! Thank you so much I hope this works will be trying it tonight!!! Let you know how it goes, don't want to have to pull the whole darn furnace out since for some stupid reason they have the access door to the back. Of the furnace but not to the front. @Mandalay we had it hooked up, not boondocking at least not with the furnace yet.

[Mandalay_Parr]

You must have good solid 12 volts to operate the furnace. Fan speed must be top notch.
If need be a mobile tech could help.
Are you plugged in or boondocking?

[DiskDoctr]

Probably air in the lines.

Here's how I do it. Use a BBQ lighter.

Reset the system. Turn off the fridge. Turn off the propane tanks, hold the lit lighter over the stove burner and turn on the burner. Let it run until no more propane or air comes out of the line. This reduces the pressure on the "leak protection valve" in the propane tanks.

Disconnect the propane lines from each tank. Wait about a minute or two and reconnect them.

Make sure all propane appliances are OFF. Stove, fridge, furnace, hot water heater.

SLOWLY open one valve on a tank. If you hear a SNAP, then it was too fast and the leak protection engaged and shut off the flow. The valve should be opened completely. Repeat if you have a second tank.

Go inside and use lit BBQ lighter over a burner and turn that burner on high. Don't let the air blow out the flame. When the air is purged, the propane burner will light. Leave it run and turn on all the stove burners and let them run about 20-30 seconds. Turn off burners.

NOW you can turn on fridge, make sure it lights. (you can hear a low roar near the outside fridge vent when running on gas)

NOW you can turn on the furnace. It may blow up to...maybe a minute(?) as it purges air from the line and gets happy with the safety sail switch and such. Then you'll hear it light.

I believe it is quite likely that you had air in the lines, or propane not flowing (leak detector valve closed?). The fridge and furnace have safety devices that can be troublesome if they repeatedly fail to light (as air is purged from the lines).

Lighting the stove burners first, each time the tanks have been off or disconnected, seems to be 100% reliable way to avoid such troubles.

You shouldn't need to reset the system each time, just purge the air after the tanks have been off or changed. But since you are having trouble, it is best to do the full procedure to test your furnace.

Hope this helps! Let us know how you make out 😉

(Hope this message gets posted. Stupid Captcha all over this site :G )