Alrighty gents... and a few ladies... looking at an 09 F350

dave17352 wrote:
ninerbikes I answered your survey so what did you come up with. Do they replace the old pump with a new improved pump if there is problem? What do you think of stanadyne?
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You drive through Denver going to the Rockies? There's numerous places in Denver to buy 10 gallons of biodiesel before you tow up the grade. Do a google search in Denver, CO for biodiesel, One near Commerce City, one near Aurora, CO

I'd keep your truck.
I'd slow down to 55- 57 in that 20 mph headwind.
I'd run biodiesel blend, however you have to get it, in the summer, and any time you tow in temps above 80F. Even if you only add a quart every 24 gallons, it helps tremendously with lubricity in your fuel.

I can't comment on Stanydyne additive. I can say that Power Service Power Kleen white bottle additive, the 96 oz size at Wal Mart, will keep your fuel dry. Put in 8 ounces every fill up, to keep condensation out of your fuel tank, and keep your fuel tank full, as much as possible when you are storing the truck a lot without doing much driving.

Never run your fuel tank gauge below 1/4 tank, that HPFP uses the fuel as coolant, you need fuel as coolant, and 1/4 tank of fuel is the minimum acceptable level of coolant for your HPFP.

I'd run that motor in a gear going up the grades like I-70 where you can always accelerate in a healthy manner, no matter how steep, if you add in more throttle at the pedal. If you can't accelerate in the gear you are in, drop it down gears, until you can, and slow down. Somewhere on that motor, while trailering, on the torque band, is a sweet spot, where the motor makes enough torque, enough horsepower, that you aren't marginalizing the whole powertrain system. Find it, and live within it's means. Diesels are very good about letting you know when you are working them, and when you are overworking them, let your tach and how the throttle responds to added input be your guide. If you get nothing or not enough from added input, you're not where you need to be speed wise, gear wise, and load wise. Downshift and slow down. Let the motor work at a range it's comfortable with, not at a death rate.

If you lose a HPFP, Chevy GMC will take care of you. File the online complaint with NHTSA, just to be safe, and to help NHTSA keep complete records on this issue with this Bosch fuel pump design. They sold all of us a Bill of Goods, they deserve what they have coming to them in warranty claims.

ninerbikes I answered your survey so what did you come up with. Do they replace the old pump with a new improved pump if there is problem? What do you think of stanadyne?
.

Turtle n Peeps wrote:

I've never claimed that Bosch was going to do something about this.

You said "NHTSA" was going to do something way back then. You seem like you think they still will.

I said way back then "no they won't" and still say they won't.

How long are we going to have to wait until the NHTSA does something?

Bottom line is: First gen Bosch pumps are junk just like first gen Bosch LB7 injectors. That was a 5 grand job.
Did NHTSA do anything about first gen LB7 Bosch injectors? Nope. Did they do anything about 6.0 diesels? Nope. Are they going to do anything about first gen CP4 pumps? NOPE!!

Jump up and down all you want about this pump issue. It's good exercise. :B

As long as the case at NHTSA remains open, and NHTSA keeps holding Ford, Chevy, GMC and whoever's feet to the fire, I am good with it. The file case is still open, after 5 years. Vw and Audi keep on fixing them... and folks keep filing complaints to NHTSA, so that wheel keeps on squeaking, and VW keeps on having to grease it.

Bosch keeps eating it too, on all those pumps. I view Robert Bosch as the Lucas "prince of darkness" for german sector cars. They've been making failure prone junk******for MAF's since 1998 in Vw product, falure prone condenser packs per spark plug in 1.8T Turbo's for ever, and on, and on, and on.

When human lives get lost and someone gets killed by a failed HPFP... the lawyers are going to have a field day with Robert Bosch with offering a HPFP that was not "fit and suitable for use" on north American D975 520 wear scar micron fuel. It's called fraud. Their pump requrements demand 460 micron fuel, America's fuel is 520 micron wear scar, not enough lubricity, yet they still brought the pump to market here in the USA, knowing the lack of lubricity in our fuel.

There will never be a recall. I hear there are folks that are wrecking their pumps just before going out of warranty, to get the newer updated version, instead of the 1st generation pump sitting in their vehicle.

I've never claimed that Bosch was going to do something about this.

You said "NHTSA" was going to do something way back then. You seem like you think they still will.

I said way back then "no they won't" and still say they won't.

How long are we going to have to wait until the NHTSA does something?

Bottom line is: First gen Bosch pumps are junk just like first gen Bosch LB7 injectors. That was a 5 grand job.
Did NHTSA do anything about first gen LB7 Bosch injectors? Nope. Did they do anything about 6.0 diesels? Nope. Are they going to do anything about first gen CP4 pumps? NOPE!!

Jump up and down all you want about this pump issue. It's good exercise. :B

Turtle n Peeps wrote:
All a receipt proves is that you bought fuel from me on that day at that time. Big deal. :R

It does not prove you went to another station 30 minutes later and put 2 gallons of gas in the tank or went to another station one hour later and got a load of water or other contamination in your fuel.

That's the problem with fuel contamination. Usually by the time your engine stops or your HPFP takes a dump 5 more, 50 more or 500 more loads of fuel have been dropped and all of your evidence is gone. Sample my tanks all you want because the evidence is gone. Even if you did find contamination in my tanks I would argue that it was not there when "you" filled up and that is what "you" would have to prove. Good luck with that.

I said over 2 years ago that the NHTSA was more than likely not going to do anything about this. I also said that Bosch was going to quietly fix this problem and it will all go away. (Except for the people that have a first gen Bosch pump 12k bill coming to them.) :E

You and others on this site were jumping up and down saying that they WERE go to do something and two years later you're still jumping up and down saying they WILL do something. Guess what? I was right back then and I'm still right to this day, over 2 years latter.

If the NHTSA did not do anything about 3/4 of a million/ 1 billion $'s worth of junk truck engines they sure as hell are not going to do anything about a few thousand junk pumps.

The first gen CP4 pumps are the new 6.0 of pumps.

I've never claimed that Bosch was going to do something about this. I know german companies will deny, deny, deny that there is ever a problem with their product, it's their engineering tradition. It cost Hitler the war, all that denial from his Generals. It's german culture. I can cite the same mentality from a german 13 speed geared hub manufacturing for bikes, when I blew mine up in under 400 miles of mountain biking... they denied, denied, denied, fought me tooth and nail to cover it under warranty... and then I got on Facebook and MTBR, and the internet, and lo and behold, I was not alone, there indeed was a manufacturing defect that was showing up... a very expensive axle part with flats manufactured on it for shifing indexing was the first part that they sub'd out to another contractor to make for them, and the QC just wasn't there that the design required to shift properly. Too sloppy, the QC.

And from all that I've read, Bosch had huge QC issues with dirt getting in the HPFP assemblies while putting them together, in what was old East Germany... formerly the soviet bloc. When they shifted production to Hungary, a huge % of the early HPFP failures went away. Some new polishing standards, finish standards on bearing surfaces, and ceramic coating procedures were changed, to make a better, more reliable and robust finished product.

I still feel the design is failure prone, and abuse, thrashing and full throttle applications aggravate the failure rate. Drive it like a car or commuter, and it's fine, treat it like a construction tool like all it is there for is to make you money, and it's going to fail, sooner, rather than later. This is not a commercial grade HPFP... it's a daily driver to and from work HPFP.

There are ID TEN T's already buying Dodge Eco diesels wanting to pull 7000 # dry 30 foot travel trailers with their new truck with that little 3.0 diesel motor. My crystal ball predicts early and complete demise and failure of the HPFP in those trucks, by Oct or November of 2014, perhaps into December too, once all the cumulative damage starts snowballing and killing the pumps from towing such weight with such a small pump for an engine in the summer heat up prolonged grades. You don't send a boy out to do a mans job. Go big, with the engine, or go home.
I run 50:1 biodiesel blend in all my diesel fuel. If my HPFP sh*ts the bed, my NHTSA complaint will be filed before the tow truck even arrives. I'll plug in my ELM 327 bluetooth, do a scan on my Torque Pro app on my smart phone, and if low fuel rail pressure or a P0087 or P0082 shows up in the trouble code scan, it's online instantly with NHTSA to file that complaint. I'll have more info for them once the dealership tears in to the fuel pressure sensor if metal bits appear in there. I'll be taking a diesel VW Touareg TDI loaner and finishing out my vacation, while VW sorts out with Bosch the warranty issue...

As I stated before.. you need to be smarter than the tech and the service advisor you are working with.

And I will be sharing on Facebook the blow by blow description of how VW is handling the whole project with the repair, with picture. Freedom of Information and all that. Exposure... it's a golden opportunity for VW to show "The Power of German Engineering" that they tout and advertise so much, along with their 10 year 100,000 mile power train warranty, since they believe so much in how good their product is... they get to prove it.

Parts will be coming from Germany, I expect 2 to 3 weeks down time if my Touareg ever loses it's HPFP due to failure.

All a receipt proves is that you bought fuel from me on that day at that time. Big deal. :R

It does not prove you went to another station 30 minutes later and put 2 gallons of gas in the tank or went to another station one hour later and got a load of water or other contamination in your fuel.

That's the problem with fuel contamination. Usually by the time your engine stops or your HPFP takes a dump 5 more, 50 more or 500 more loads of fuel have been dropped and all of your evidence is gone. Sample my tanks all you want because the evidence is gone. Even if you did find contamination in my tanks I would argue that it was not there when "you" filled up and that is what "you" would have to prove. Good luck with that.

I said over 2 years ago that the NHTSA was more than likely not going to do anything about this. I also said that Bosch was going to quietly fix this problem and it will all go away. (Except for the people that have a first gen Bosch pump 12k bill coming to them.) :E

You and others on this site were jumping up and down saying that they WERE go to do something and two years later you're still jumping up and down saying they WILL do something. Guess what? I was right back then and I'm still right to this day, over 2 years latter.

If the NHTSA did not do anything about 3/4 of a million/ 1 billion $'s worth of junk truck engines they sure as hell are not going to do anything about a few thousand junk pumps.

The first gen CP4 pumps are the new 6.0 of pumps.

How fast to you drive empty bed? 65 70
How fast do you drive trailering your trailer /5th wheel? 62
With a head wind of 20 mph? 62

Are you being passed regularly on the interstate by traffic, or are you passing everybody else? right in between

Are you retired and in no hurry to get anywhere? not quite retired but no hurry

What is the wet weight of your 5th wheel? 12k

How smooth a driver are you on the throttle and brakes? very smooth

How many miles do you get out of a set of brake pads? lots and lots

How anal are you about servicing your diesel by the book? And crossing all your T's and dotting all your i's? Fairly anal i do it by the book

Do you tow up and over the Rockies? yes we like the rockies but we are also now becoming more truck camper people

How many towing miles per year vs empty bed truck miles per year do you drive? 1/2 and 1/2

Can you get 10 gallons of B99 biodiesel locally and add a quart of it to every 12 gallons of diesel fuel you buy? no

Because all of these things affect my answer.

If you drive conservatively, slowly, don't push it hard up grades in the heat and slow down, mix some biodiesel in in the spring, summer and fall in your fuel, to about 50:1 or 100:1, then keep it.

If you drive like a bat out of hell, sell it. Treat it like a tool, it'll break, treat it like a fine instrument, and it will last, and is a keeper. A HPFP needs slippery fuel, like a 2 stroke needs oil in it's gas. That's where biodiesel comes in, especially under heavy loads and lots of fuel being burned, like when trailering.


What about the fact that I use stanadyne isn't that any good? Also if the pump gets replaced do they put the same POS back in. At this point trading etc I am going to spend at least 10k to begin with.

ricatic wrote:
exactly...my "koolaid" point was to point out that the TDI owners stopped drinking the Koolaid and fought back...the Blue Koolaid is so strong that any attempts to get a discussion started are always attacked and shut down by the Blue Koolaid Crowd...I am surprised they have not attacked this thread yet...

Back when my "Shameful Event" thread was active, I had several private emails from this site and the Ford Koolaid Site telling me their stories detailing the above treatment. The Ford Blue Koolaid Bunch(BKB) site is especially vicious when anyone dares to negatively question the antics and behavior of the Blue Oval... fights are started by the BKB and responses, no matter how civil, are removed and the poster punished...just ask niner bikes...you already know about my BKB exile

Regards

Ric... you can't fix stupid, and you can't change redneck fanbois. As we learned, it is what it is.

The folks that paid out of pocket for the repairs, that listened and demanded all their old parts, HPFP, injectors, rail collectors, every single old part, no cores to be turned in and remanufactured, that actually tore things down, are the victims that had eyes, and had skin in the game... if you don't have skin in the game, and you've never taken apart a failed HPFP and looked inside critically, then, IMHO... you've got no business commenting on what the problem is, and you can just STFU on the issue. Because you haven't had a failure, you have nothing to contribute to the failure threads. Look inside a pump, and see where things went wrong, do some failure analysis, and then feel free to chip in with what you've actually observed, hands on.

Oh, and pictures don't hurt either, they're worth 10,000 words in this case.







All of these parts, $4000 worth, are junk, plus the HPFP still waiting to be removed. This is for a V6, add the price of a couple more injectors if you drive a V8, probably $700 or 800 each.



Pictures are damning truth, they crush a Liberals defective reasoning process that is ruled by emotions instead of facts. Pictures don't lie.

dave17352 wrote:
Hey HPFP specialists should I keep my 2011 duramax with 25k on it or dump it! You guys got me nervous about this pump thing. I have run stanadyne performance formula since day one. I do drive easy cause I am a older feller. But should I trade this off for a gaser? I sure love pulling with a diesel! So how scared should I be of my HPFP?

Honest answers here, please.

How fast to you drive empty bed?
How fast do you drive trailering your trailer /5th wheel?
With a head wind of 20 mph?

Are you being passed regularly on the interstate by traffic, or are you passing everybody else?

Are you retired and in no hurry to get anywhere?

What is the wet weight of your 5th wheel?

How smooth a driver are you on the throttle and brakes?

How many miles do you get out of a set of brake pads?

How anal are you about servicing your diesel by the book? And crossing all your T's and dotting all your i's?

Do you tow up and over the Rockies?

How many towing miles per year vs empty bed truck miles per year do you drive?

Can you get 10 gallons of B99 biodiesel locally and add a quart of it to every 12 gallons of diesel fuel you buy?

Because all of these things affect my answer.

If you drive conservatively, slowly, don't push it hard up grades in the heat and slow down, mix some biodiesel in in the spring, summer and fall in your fuel, to about 50:1 or 100:1, then keep it.

If you drive like a bat out of hell, sell it. Treat it like a tool, it'll break, treat it like a fine instrument, and it will last, and is a keeper. A HPFP needs slippery fuel, like a 2 stroke needs oil in it's gas. That's where biodiesel comes in, especially under heavy loads and lots of fuel being burned, like when trailering.

Hey HPFP specialists should I keep my 2011 duramax with 25k on it or dump it! You guys got me nervous about this pump thing. I have run stanadyne performance formula since day one. I do drive easy cause I am a older feller. But should I trade this off for a gaser? I sure love pulling with a diesel! So how scared should I be of my HPFP?