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F53 suspension upgrades

two_travelers
Explorer
Explorer
We have a 27'Winnebago Vista and like others are not satisfied with the handling. In a recent Motor Home magazine article they detailed the upgrades to a larger coach by Henderson that was interesting.
I contacted them regarding what was needed for our model. They recommended a stiffer front sway bar, a radius rod and Koni FSD shocks. Seems, they feel, the CHF could lead to a component failure. While not cheap, I am considering it as the coach does have handling issues. I have a Safe T Steer installed, a rear trac bar and recently had a thorough wheel alignment that improved steering/handling greatly.

I never heard of a radius rod, but according to Henderson, it's job is to keep front leaf spring from moving forward/backward or side to side thereby improving steering and body roll. I never heard of a radius rod. Is any one familiar with this?
26 REPLIES 26

FloridaRosebud
Explorer
Explorer
So let me add some more here. First, trying to get an F-53 chassis to handle great is like trying to put lipstick on a pig. Isn't gonna happen. Now, that said, There are mods you can do that will enhance the handling. For me, I've done the following.

1. 4 wheel alignment and weigh the MH. Adjust air pressure per the Toyo tables (not what the guys at the tire shop say)
2. Roadmaster True-center for the steering
3. CHF
4. Poly bushings on stock anti-sway bars
5. Rear Hellwig anti sway bar
6. Rear trac bar
7. New Koni KSD shocks

It already had Firestone air bags, which allow me to properly level the MH once we are loaded up and ready to go. So short of a front trac bar, or jumping into the Liquid Suspension (high dollar) mods, I'm pretty much done. So does it handle better? Absolutely. Semi's rarely push me around (other than the empty rolling parking lots), and cross wind issues are no problems under 15-20mph. Koni shocks improved the ride so it is not as jarring. I still have issues with those pesky little 12-14 foot box trucks, as I can feel them when they blow by (I still haven't figured that one out), but now I could drive with one hand (not that I do), and I can go farther each day before I'm ready for my adult beverage. So for us, it was worth it, as we both love the MH and have plans on keeping it for a long time. YMMV and all that. For me, I would get the air bags over the Sumo springs, as the air bags help you adjust the ride height. Sumos are fixed.

Sorry for the long post....

Al

billyray50
Explorer
Explorer
irishtom29 wrote:
FloridaRosebud wrote:
If you are having issues with winds (and we all do)...

Al


I don't.


Why?

irishtom29
Explorer
Explorer
FloridaRosebud wrote:
If you are having issues with winds (and we all do)...

Al


I don't.

irishtom29
Explorer
Explorer
Don't worry, anything you do will make a "day and night" difference.

billyray50
Explorer
Explorer
FloridaRosebud wrote:
If you are having issues with winds (and we all do) you need a rear trac bar, as the springs/airbags will offer you minimal help here.

Al


X2

FloridaRosebud
Explorer
Explorer
If you are having issues with winds (and we all do) you need a rear trac bar, as the springs/airbags will offer you minimal help here.

Al

TWZMYJP
Explorer
Explorer
I have done the CHF (both front and rear) and tuned the tire pressures based on actual loaded corner weights. It made a notable difference, but it still wants to dart in gusty winds, and also has a tendency to lean to the passenger side. I am debating between Sumo springs and air bags... The airbag route seems to be a little less expensive depending of course on the compressor setup, but I like the idea of no maintenance with the Sumos. I know exactly what and how an airbag setup will perform, but I've never run Sumos so I'm a little nervous to spend the money on them? Anyone have a direct comparison story?
'18 Jayco Alante 31R

rgatijnet1
Explorer III
Explorer III
Richard,
I gave links to PROFESSIONAL RV alignment shops that have equipment you have probably never touched. Just because you have never worked in a well equipped shop is no reason to try to discredit shops that have an outstanding reputation in the RV world. Perhaps you guys should stick with small vehicles and leave the
RV's and trucks to the PROFESSIONALS. Even the FMCA link mentioned how the rear axle can be adjusted on a gas coach but I'm sure that you and Dodge guy have years of experience back when a lot of things were not possible. Time marches on and has left the two of you behind.

RLS7201
Explorer II
Explorer II
dodge guy wrote:
RLS7201 wrote:
rgatijnet1 wrote:
Before I would spend any money on bolt-ons I would do the basics first. In other words load the coach exactly as it is when you travel with full fuel and fresh water(if you fill your tanks for travel), as well as food and clothing. Then have ALL four corner weighed and adjust your tire pressure according to the manufacturer's specs. The next would be to take it to an alignment shop, while the coach is still loaded for travel, that can deal with motor homes and get a front and rear axle alignment or a thrust angle alignment. Some shops will tell you that your rear axle is not adjustable when they DO NOT have the equipment available to set the trust angle on an RV chassis. It can be adjusted.
After you have done these things, and you still are not happy with the way the coach drives, then try some add-ons, one at a time.



Tell us how you adjust the rear thrust angle on a gas chassis with no provisions for adjustment? The spring hangers are bolted to holes in the frame, the spring draw bolt head aligns with a hole in the axle tube. There are no cams, no adjustable rods, etc.

Richard


Glad I'm not the only one. I do alignments daily. Rarely is the solid rear axle out of alignment. If it were it's very minor. Anything more and something is bent.



Thanks for jumping in dodge guy. I spent 11 of my younger years in the alignment business and still do alignment service on a call in basis and that patch shown by rgatijnet1 is just that, a patch. If the rear on our gas coaches needs adjustment then there are other problems also. Sure glad the non-professionals keep up professionals in line. 😞

Richard
95 Bounder 32H F53 460
2013 CRV Toad
2 Segways in Toad
First brake job
1941 Hudson

dodge_guy
Explorer II
Explorer II
links don't work. and yes the factory puts the chassis together within spec, the only way it would change is from worn parts or an accident. I`ve seen some of the fixes out there, some good, some not so good. like the nylon shims that go behind the wheel bearing on a rear beam axle of a front wheel drive car to fix a toe/camber issue. I refuse to work with stuff like that!
Wife Kim
Son Brandon 17yrs
Daughter Marissa 16yrs
Dog Bailey

12 Forest River Georgetown 350TS Hellwig sway bars, BlueOx TrueCenter stabilizer

13 Ford Explorer Roadmaster Stowmaster 5000, VIP Tow>
A bad day camping is
better than a good day at work!

rgatijnet1
Explorer III
Explorer III
dodge guy wrote:
rgatijnet1 wrote:
RLS7201 wrote:
rgatijnet1 wrote:
Before I would spend any money on bolt-ons I would do the basics first. In other words load the coach exactly as it is when you travel with full fuel and fresh water(if you fill your tanks for travel), as well as food and clothing. Then have ALL four corner weighed and adjust your tire pressure according to the manufacturer's specs. The next would be to take it to an alignment shop, while the coach is still loaded for travel, that can deal with motor homes and get a front and rear axle alignment or a thrust angle alignment. Some shops will tell you that your rear axle is not adjustable when they DO NOT have the equipment available to set the trust angle on an RV chassis. It can be adjusted.
After you have done these things, and you still are not happy with the way the coach drives, then try some add-ons, one at a time.



Tell us how you adjust the rear thrust angle on a gas chassis with no provisions for adjustment? The spring hangers are bolted to holes in the frame, the spring draw bolt head aligns with a hole in the axle tube. There are no cams, no adjustable rods, etc.

Richard


The rear axle is attached to the springs with U-bolts that can be loosened to allow the axle to be moved as necessary to get it in to perfect alignment. You don't move the springs but the rear axle itself can be moved. Here is a link to Brazels which gives some details on the services they offer. There are other alignment shops that have the ability to give a gas or a diesel pusher RV a 4 wheel alignment. Brazels 4 wheel alignment on a gas chassis
Here is another link: FMCA alignment
Here is another place that can do the alignment as can any shop that has Hunter equipment designed for thrust angle alignment: Hendersons
Another place: Sunshine Service


No! The rear axle is located on the springs with pins. If the axle can be moved then it is unsafe and shouldn’t be driven. Axles need the pins to properly locate the axle. Other wise it would move on the spring under acceleration or braking. And the u bolts are not strong enough to keep it from moving.


Even after giving a bunch of links to talk with someone that do alignments for a living, there are still some people that are stuck in the past that do not believe there is any possible way to adjust axles that they believe cannot ever be changed. Some people keep up with the times and understand that modifications can be made for very little money that allows an alignment tech to adjust the rear axle to obtain perfect alignment without compromising any safety issues. Here is a picture of one mod that actually creates "pins" that are adjustable. Anyone that thinks that a straight axle that is 12-20 feet behind the front axle is in perfect alignment when it leaves the factory needs to go back to school. As I mentioned, the shops that tell you it cannot be adjusted/aligned just do not have the equipment to do it so they come up with all kinds of "excuses" to convince you it is impossible. Note that the picture is from 2009. This is not NEW tech.

dodge_guy
Explorer II
Explorer II
rgatijnet1 wrote:
RLS7201 wrote:
rgatijnet1 wrote:
Before I would spend any money on bolt-ons I would do the basics first. In other words load the coach exactly as it is when you travel with full fuel and fresh water(if you fill your tanks for travel), as well as food and clothing. Then have ALL four corner weighed and adjust your tire pressure according to the manufacturer's specs. The next would be to take it to an alignment shop, while the coach is still loaded for travel, that can deal with motor homes and get a front and rear axle alignment or a thrust angle alignment. Some shops will tell you that your rear axle is not adjustable when they DO NOT have the equipment available to set the trust angle on an RV chassis. It can be adjusted.
After you have done these things, and you still are not happy with the way the coach drives, then try some add-ons, one at a time.



Tell us how you adjust the rear thrust angle on a gas chassis with no provisions for adjustment? The spring hangers are bolted to holes in the frame, the spring draw bolt head aligns with a hole in the axle tube. There are no cams, no adjustable rods, etc.

Richard


The rear axle is attached to the springs with U-bolts that can be loosened to allow the axle to be moved as necessary to get it in to perfect alignment. You don't move the springs but the rear axle itself can be moved. Here is a link to Brazels which gives some details on the services they offer. There are other alignment shops that have the ability to give a gas or a diesel pusher RV a 4 wheel alignment. Brazels 4 wheel alignment on a gas chassis
Here is another link: FMCA alignment
Here is another place that can do the alignment as can any shop that has Hunter equipment designed for thrust angle alignment: Hendersons
Another place: Sunshine Service


No! The rear axle is located on the springs with pins. If the axle can be moved then it is unsafe and shouldn’t be driven. Axles need the pins to properly locate the axle. Other wise it would move on the spring under acceleration or braking. And the u bolts are not strong enough to keep it from moving.
Wife Kim
Son Brandon 17yrs
Daughter Marissa 16yrs
Dog Bailey

12 Forest River Georgetown 350TS Hellwig sway bars, BlueOx TrueCenter stabilizer

13 Ford Explorer Roadmaster Stowmaster 5000, VIP Tow>
A bad day camping is
better than a good day at work!

rgatijnet1
Explorer III
Explorer III
RLS7201 wrote:
rgatijnet1 wrote:
Before I would spend any money on bolt-ons I would do the basics first. In other words load the coach exactly as it is when you travel with full fuel and fresh water(if you fill your tanks for travel), as well as food and clothing. Then have ALL four corner weighed and adjust your tire pressure according to the manufacturer's specs. The next would be to take it to an alignment shop, while the coach is still loaded for travel, that can deal with motor homes and get a front and rear axle alignment or a thrust angle alignment. Some shops will tell you that your rear axle is not adjustable when they DO NOT have the equipment available to set the trust angle on an RV chassis. It can be adjusted.
After you have done these things, and you still are not happy with the way the coach drives, then try some add-ons, one at a time.



Tell us how you adjust the rear thrust angle on a gas chassis with no provisions for adjustment? The spring hangers are bolted to holes in the frame, the spring draw bolt head aligns with a hole in the axle tube. There are no cams, no adjustable rods, etc.

Richard


The rear axle is attached to the springs with U-bolts that can be loosened to allow the axle to be moved as necessary to get it in to perfect alignment. You don't move the springs but the rear axle itself can be moved. Here is a link to Brazels which gives some details on the services they offer. There are other alignment shops that have the ability to give a gas or a diesel pusher RV a 4 wheel alignment. Brazels 4 wheel alignment on a gas chassis
Here is another link: FMCA alignment
Here is another place that can do the alignment as can any shop that has Hunter equipment designed for thrust angle alignment: Hendersons
Another place: Sunshine Service

dodge_guy
Explorer II
Explorer II
RLS7201 wrote:
rgatijnet1 wrote:
Before I would spend any money on bolt-ons I would do the basics first. In other words load the coach exactly as it is when you travel with full fuel and fresh water(if you fill your tanks for travel), as well as food and clothing. Then have ALL four corner weighed and adjust your tire pressure according to the manufacturer's specs. The next would be to take it to an alignment shop, while the coach is still loaded for travel, that can deal with motor homes and get a front and rear axle alignment or a thrust angle alignment. Some shops will tell you that your rear axle is not adjustable when they DO NOT have the equipment available to set the trust angle on an RV chassis. It can be adjusted.
After you have done these things, and you still are not happy with the way the coach drives, then try some add-ons, one at a time.



Tell us how you adjust the rear thrust angle on a gas chassis with no provisions for adjustment? The spring hangers are bolted to holes in the frame, the spring draw bolt head aligns with a hole in the axle tube. There are no cams, no adjustable rods, etc.

Richard


Glad I'm not the only one. I do alignments daily. Rarely is the solid rear axle out of alignment. If it were it's very minor. Anything more and something is bent.
Wife Kim
Son Brandon 17yrs
Daughter Marissa 16yrs
Dog Bailey

12 Forest River Georgetown 350TS Hellwig sway bars, BlueOx TrueCenter stabilizer

13 Ford Explorer Roadmaster Stowmaster 5000, VIP Tow>
A bad day camping is
better than a good day at work!