A little uncomfortable with my set up...

[95jersey]

Let me explain...

I went from a Wildwood travel trailer (22ft, 3600lbs) to a Jayco 273 Toy Hauler (31ft 6500lb, 12ft high). My tonque weight went up significantly from probably a few hundred lbs to 1000lbs. Not to mention, putting in 250-750lbs of dirt bikes behind the rear axle.

My truck is a new 2018 F150 with the 3.5TT, 10 speed, and best towing package you can get on an F150 (extra payload, rear axle upgrade, etc). It is a beast and I could not even feel my Wildwood behind me. My truck specs fully support the load of the trailer with room for safety, but I am not here to discuss specs, but more or less tow feel on highway. Please don't recommend a 250/2500, not going to buy another truck at this point.

Towing the 22ft Wildwood was a walk in the park, I didn't even need a WD hitch. I could do 75mph without blinking. The experience with the Jayco is not so nice. It gently sways and pushes me around just a little, at highway speeds (65+). Not anything significant or dangerous, just unpleasant and requiring your attention. The 18 wheelers passing by are a real joy. I have a HD-WD hitch, airbags on the truck, and 2 anti-sway bars as well. It is set up as good as it is going to get. It is 100% level and the truck has the HP to pull it without question.

I am thinking 2 factors are causing the uncomfort at highway speed (the sheer height 12ft+, and the 31ft length). I am sure the higher tonque weight and 750lbs of dirt bikes loaded past the rear axle isn't helping.

I am thinking of selling it and downgrading to a smaller unit (maybe 20-26ft toy hauler, and in the 5000lbs or less range). Before I go down this road, is there anything I am missing to make my current set up handle better? Also, if I just go down 3-4 feet in length and 1500lbs in weight, will that even improve my situation? Or am I going to have the same problem with the increased height? Would hate to downgrade and have the same **** problem.

[Bedlam]

Call Torklift concerning their Hero receiver - Support: (844)369-9358. The fact that you have a crew cab half ton which is not popular with truck camper hauling most likely is the reason they have not verified fit. This company is expensive, but their tech and application support along with warranty justifies it.

[95jersey]

I went to etrailer and there were no aftermarket hitches over 1200lbs and torklift doesn't make one yet for my truck.

So now at the minimum, I need a new hitch and WD system combined in excess of $4000. I can spend less money getting a new trailer. I prefer something smaller anyway, not only for ease of towing, but being able to fit in tighter places.

[BarneyS]

If you are set on keeping your existing truck, get an aftermarket receiver. They can carry over 2000 lbs of tongue weight. Some may even be higher.

I replaced the receiver on my old 2002 F250 diesel with one rated to carry 2550lbs.
It made a big difference in the way my vehicle towed our heavy trailer.

By the way, the Hensley hitch WILL make your rig tow well. I know it is expensive but worth the money for a good towing experience. I purchased mine new for a bit over $3000, used it heavily for about 13 years, and sold it for well over half of what I paid for it. Not very expensive when you look at it that way. 🙂

Edit: I noticed that you have a F150. I don't think you will find a hitch to fit that truck that will give you much over 1000-1200lb tongue weight except for the one posted above.
Barney

[Bedlam]

That is why I suggested going to this receiver if you can get handling addressed:

https://www.torklift.com/rv/superhitch/superhitch-hero



You will not get instant failure with your OEM, but you will get accelerated wear and fatigue before failure.

[95jersey]

Here is another way to propose the question based on all the great information provided in this thread...

IF and I mean IF, I was to consider keeping the trailer and upgrading my WD system, is it not a mute point based on the fact that my measured tongue weight is higher than the rating of my trucks OEM hitch?

Ford Hitch rating 1200lbs (with WD)
Measure Jayco tongue 1280lbs (no water, no bikes)

I mean add 50 gallons of water even if the tank is over the axles, I would imagine that number will just go up.

Or is the 1200lb rating just a recommendation, not necessarily gospel??

[bikendan]

95jersey wrote:

191 What? FR has numerous divisions and over 100 different brands.

http://www.forestriverinc.com/product-details.aspx?LineID=226&ShowParent=1&ModelID=3658#Main

The benefit of this toy hauler is that I can mount the bikes in a more forward position (in front of the axle) as it has an open floor plan. In my current TH, I have no choice but to mount the bikes post axle.

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

That's a Salem 191SSXL toyhauler.
Did you notice it's Salem West? Which means it's not sold on the East coast.

[95jersey]

goducks10 wrote:
You'll your arse on selling or trading in. Have you thought about getting a Pro Pride or Hensley Arrow hitch? That would make the combo feel like it was on rails. BTDT. Might be able to find a used one.
I used one with a 2010 F150 and a 7300 lb 31' TT. Towed as well as my current 2500 and 5th wheel.
I believe they have a 30 day money back guarantee.

Wow, $2700 for a hitch...****. I mean ****...

Luckily enough, I bought my trailer way under retail. I could sell it right now for a few thousand less than any other advertised 273 of the same year on the internet and still be ahead.

I think the only downside of this model is you have no choice but to mount the bikes behind the axle, vs other models where you can mount them at or in front of the axle.

Also, no hitch is going to fix the fact that my hitch is rated a 1200lbs and my current set up without water and bikes is 1280lbs. That is very close for comfort.

But you suggestion and experience is VERY welcome.

[goducks10]

You'll your arse on selling or trading in. Have you thought about getting a Pro Pride or Hensley Arrow hitch? That would make the combo feel like it was on rails. BTDT. Might be able to find a used one.
I used one with a 2010 F150 and a 7300 lb 31' TT. Towed as well as my current 2500 and 5th wheel.
I believe they have a 30 day money back guarantee.

[95jersey]

191 What? FR has numerous divisions and over 100 different brands.

http://www.forestriverinc.com/product-details.aspx?LineID=226&ShowParent=1&ModelID=3658#Main

The benefit of this toy hauler is that I can mount the bikes in a more forward position (in front of the axle) as it has an open floor plan. In my current TH, I have no choice but to mount the bikes post axle.

[LarryJM]

95jersey wrote:
FINALLY some useful information. Over the weekend I took the RV to my dealer to get winterized and asked them to weight the tongue.

drum roll...1280lbs (no bikes, no water, but fully loaded otherwise).

I don't know when I will be able to get to a CAT scale, as I am booked every weekend until late November. So for now, this is all we got.

So I am definitely exceeding the WD hitch rating (1000lb) at minimum.

A fact, but more of a "rim shot" vs drum roll and not very useful since the weight DOES NOT represent a normally fully loaded and ready to camp trailer. I also doubt you had all normal food and clothes for a normal trip, but that's a pure guess on my part.

Finally, I would guess less than one percent of folks are high in either their GUESSTIMATE or belief in what the TW and/or total weight of their unweighed trailer is with that 99 percent surprised HOW MUCH things really weighed once they get that CAT scale ticket.

Larry

[demiles]

There is no tests for lateral wind loading in SAE j2807. Drop the airbags, they raise the truck up off the heavy bottom overload springs. Airbags provide no lateral stability so the truck is only supported by the top thin soft springs.

[bikendan]

95jersey wrote:
What do you guys think about the specs on this trailer? Forest River 191. Do you think I will have the same issues? It is about the same height, but 5 feet shorter and 1350lbs lighter and under 1k tonque weight.

Dimensions
Length 25.75 ft.
Width 8 ft.
Height 11.83 ft.
WeightDry Weight 5,150 lbs.
Payload Capacity 3,522 lbs.
GVWR 8,710 lbs.
Hitch Weight 710 lbs.

191 What? FR has numerous divisions and over 100 different brands.

[Durb]

A couple of comments not mentioned:

The distance between your coupler and the center of the axles is approximately 2.5 times longer than the distance from the rear of the trailer to the center of the axles. Roughly translated, 750# of garage weight will unload your tongue about 300#.

Your WDH head is adjusted way down meaning your bars are about maxed out, in my mind, not up to the job. When you add air bag air and lift the rear you are defeating the WDH and the problem worsens. Lends one to believe some of the problem is with the hitch. I would like to see a hitch sufficient to run minimal air in your bags.

You mentioned you have twin sway bars but your picture doesn't show them hooked up. Those sway bars aren't the best and there are better hitches and solutions to stiffen up your hitch joint such as Reese dual cam.

Could be with an aluminum truck your (TV weight)/(TT weight) ratio is wrong and you are going to be pushed around no matter what you. Both Ford and many others towing that heavy say you should be OK. How does the trailer tow without the gear loaded?

Sway and wind drag increase greatly with speed. You may not be able to tow as fast with the larger trailer.

You have made a commitment to keep your hitch. If it were me, I would order a Hensley Arrow and set it up. If it doesn't solve all your problems then return it within 2 months and get all your money back. The price of the hitch will be less than the dollar beating you will take when selling your trailer. In my state, just the sales tax alone on changing trailers would pay for the hitch. Others have reported that the towing comfort and security with that hitch is phenomenal. The most important thing, if it works your wife will be happier with the larger trailer.

[carringb]

A shorter toy hauler, might tow worse! Even if the overall weight is less, and tongue weight is lower, if the wheel-to-tailgate distance is the same, it'll actually be LESS stable then what you have now, once you load the toys.

The numbers you posted, while slightly above spec for the truck, probably aren't on their own causing the instability. I'm fairly certain the bikes in the back of the trailer are causing you to become tongue-light.

[95jersey]

Bedlam wrote:
Propane, batteries, water, personal items? Published tongue weight has none of those and 15 percent is an educated guess based on other TH’s with which I have experience.

My trailer had all those things when weighted.