3000W Chinese Gensets Info.

[professor95]

professor95 wrote:
EDIT ADDED 45/5/2013- When this thread started in March of 2005, I never expected to see it survive this long or amass the quantity of information that has been shared here.

In the eight year run of this thread we have amassed almost 10,000 postings and surpassed a million views. This creates somewhat of a dilemma for anyone who has just discovered the forum.

Since the amount of information is virtually overwhelming, I suggest you set your preferences for this thread to read "newest first" and then begin to page backwards.

What you will find in these pages is a wealth of info on virtually any make or model of Chinese manufactured synchronous (non-inverter) generator in the 3,000 watt performance class. Info will include how to rewire series coils to parallel to obtain maximum wattage from a single 120 volt outlet. Tips on further reducing sound levels, how to care for these generators, which ones are "RV ready" and provide the best overall performance for the dollar invested. Which companies NOT to deal with, where the best prices are, how to safely wire the generator into a home or RV, how to check your RV for electrical faults, sources for generator accessories, which 20/30 adapters are safe to use and which are not. How to convert a gasoline generator to propane or NG. This is only the beginning. The forum has a life of its own with the focus sub-topic switching frequently. Still, the main topic of utilizing the amazing, inexpensive Chinese gensets is always there. The amount of creativity and innovation presented in these pages is indicative of the talents shared in the diverse backgrounds of the folks who make up our combined RV community.

Many of the original brands and models of Chinese gensets mentioned in the introduction and early pages of the thread have since disappeared. New EPA and CARB emissions requirements, company bonds assuring the emissions warranty will be honored even if the company goes out of business, and fierce competition in the industry have changed the playing field. Champion Power Equipment has become the apparent "trophy team" providing an ever expanding retail outlet, an ample parts supply, a strong warranty and excellent customer service. CPE has continued to improve their product and now offers a new model (#46538) with exclusive convenience, safety and performance features aimed at the RV market. Big names like Cummins/Onan, Honda and Generac all now have Chinese built open frame synchronous gensets available. Ironically, the prices often found on these gensets has not significantly changed during the past eight years - even with the devaluation of the American Dollar and new EPA/CARB requirements.

I also encourage you to use the search function and even the advanced search options to find information. Key works such as "rewiring", "PowerPro", "Champion", "Onan Homesite", "Duropower", "ETQ", "Jiung Dong or JD", "Tractor Supply", "Costco", "Lowe's" and "Home Depot" are all examples of keywords that will give you specific information on different models being sold by retailers today.

Or, you can fill your glass with your favorite beverage (keep more close by - maybe some munchies as well :D, sit back at your computer, tell your wife (or significant other) that you will see her in the morning and spend the next 10 or so hours reading through the postings.

No one on the forum gets mad if you ask a question that is a repeat. Please do not hesitate to post to the forum. All questions are considered important and those active on the forum will do their best to respond with a valid answer.

Also note we are not out to knock the Honda, Yamaha, Kipor or other brands of high end digital gensets. We recognize the quality of these products and their suitability for quite, efficient RV use. But, there is a flood of reliable, inexpensive and comparatively lower cost gensets coming out of China that are excellent alternative choices for the RVer wanting power to run an air conditioner, microwave, etc. without excessive noise or breaking the budget.

Oh, one last thing. The folks on this forum are true gentlemen. We do not flame one another or the product discussed - period. Ugly contributors usually have their comments and remarks ignored by our masses. It is not a forum to start arguments to obtain a clear win. We do disagree on many issues, but we have all agreed to do that in a respectable manner.

We now have the introduction of more and more inverter gensets. There is a rather extensive thread named "The Official Unofficial Champion 2000i Generator" on this forum. Today, I added info on the new Champion 3100i inverter genset. Discussion on this product may get moved to its own thread at a later date.

Many have looked upon this thread with distain saying Chinese is cheap and doomed to failure. I remember saying exactly the same thing about Japanese products a few decades back. But, over the past eight years the track record for Chinese built generators has shown otherwise.

Please, join us in a fascinating journey down the Chinese built genset road of knowledge.

This is the question I posted that got it all started back in March 2005.......

Randy

For a little over a month now, I have been somewhat intrigued by the availability of a 3000 watt, 6.5 HP generator at Pep Boys and Northern Tool for under $300.00. The engine on this generator looks identical to a Honda 6.5 HP OHV engine. Knowing that the Chinese have become very adept at “cloning” reputable technologies from other manufacturers, I was not surprised at the similarities. Neither store could give me any information on the generator nor did they have a “running” display model.

I have done a little research. This is what I have discovered:

Many of these generators are imported by ELIM International (www.eliminternational.com) out of Buffalo, New York from Jiung Manufacturing in China. (The unit at Northern is identical but carries the JIUNG name.)

The engines are indeed a Chinese knockoff of the popular 6.5 HP 196cc Honda Engine. “Supposedly” Honda has licensed the engine technology to the Chinese manufacturer of the product.

The Chinese company that makes the ELM3000 generators is a rather large, diverse, long-standing company with a reputation for “above average quality” Chinese made products (Jiung Manufacturing). There are many more Chinese companies making almost identical gensets.

The generators at PepBoys do have a six month limited warranty. But, it is only on the engine (not the generator) and requires paying for shipping to and from Buffalo. Probably not a very practical thing to do if you have warranty issues.

ELIM does supply replacement parts (a PDF parts manual is available on the ELIM web site). No prices are given for replacement parts nor is there an “availability listing”.

The generator head itself is a brushless design. The only really significant wear parts in the generator are the bearings – most likely universally available.

The published dB rating is 67 at 23 feet. This is “reasonably” quite for a generator of this size as most comparabl.... The 67 dB rating is the same as Honda gives their 3000 watt CycloInverter with a “look alike” eng...

[The_Roamer]

In Champion's defense. They were very responsive on the phone. They did say if I'm not happy the would refund my money.

They suggested I try it with a short cord or a new one. I can't get to my trailer for two weeks, however I did plug in every thing I could try at home and it did fine. Then I tried a standard 10ga. 25' extension cord I have for my compressor and it did fine. The last thing I did was use the 25' 10ga and a 10' cheaply and it ran a blow dryer on high and a waffle iron (1000w) at the same time (as it should). Everything seemed fine.
Now I'm stuck....Do I have a******cord from Pilgrim or is it too long. Do I buy a new 25' at camping world or make my own short one? As others have said they use the long cord with no problems. I must have a bogus cord. And of course I left it up the hill so I can't check it.

I'll keep everybody posted as I don't want to give Champion a bad name if it's only a bad extension cord.

[Curly2001]

What happened to the WEN Power Pro generators? Are they any good and is anyone buying them now? What can they power as far as A/C units?
Thanks,
Curly

[MrWizard]

i ran mine in the rain last week, i usually try to cover the top with the compartment door ( the genny is on a sliding tray ), but got caught off guard, and I didn't go out to cover it up, no problems

[Mr__Tommy]

My friend had his Honda sitting in the back of his pickup the whole time we were camping - in the rain. It just sat out there getting soaked - and running. Anyone used their Champions in the rain? As in "no cover whatsoever"? I didn't bring mine on this trip but sorta wished I had because the sun never came out and our solar panels were taxed (3x75 watts). I don't as of yet have any kind of enclosure for my Champion. Any suggestions or experience with rain and an exposed generator?

[Wgeorge11]

There has been a lot of thought and effort re quieting the Champ, and posted in this forum. I recall the Professor was especially interested in the subject. A quick search turned up p286. Best do an indepth search as there are a lot of posts looking for sound abatement solutions over the past two years.

[Simi_Mike]

I just have to pipe in here....I picked mine up yesterday at the local Kragens for $299+tax. After I gave it a short warm up, with some new gas out of a clean tank, I plugged in the Trailer and flicked on everything I could think of. The Champ took it all (Like its name). It hardly sputtered when the A/C came on.
The noise was a little more than I had anticipated so I will be researching a lightweight sound enclosure for when I might need it. I think I could use it without in most daytime applications.
I did notice that most of the sound came from the crankcase and not the muffler. It should be easy to use some foam like the type used to quiet boat engines or A/C compressors, applied directly to the engine. Has anybody tried this? I may try running the genny with a thermometer against the crankcase without the foam and then with a thermometer imbedded in the foam to see how much heat the crankcase is rejecting.
Thank you to everyone for doing the hard work here,
Mike

[Wgeorge11]

I'm sure Champion wants satisfied customers. But keep in mind that your deal was with a retailer, not the importer/distributer. A reputable dealer, like Parts America, guarantees what they sell and will replace/refund within 30 days. Trust me, they mean it. They have just shipped to me a 3rd replacement unit which is in transit. The first two were visibly damaged (I never started either) including bent muffler/Gen supports, a broken fuel cock, broken control covers and air filter covers, and fuel leaks at the tank connection. I was unable to stop the leak on either tank. I talked with Adam at Champion who made some suggestions and sent me a box full of stuff (tank, covers, etc) without being asked. These I'll return.
My suggestion is to talk with the seller about replacement first. I assume you were sold an unopened box. That failing, go to Champion and cop a plea. Just remember, you bought from a dealer, not the importer. Whatever Champion does will be a good faith gesture on their part. Hope all goes well. Keep us posted re outcome

[Oldfordman]

The Roamer wrote:
My C46540 wont run $#%% My A/C stalls it. My wifes blow dryer stalls it. My 1200 watt micro stalls it. WTF? The only thing I can figure is the shore line is too long. I only have the one that came with the trailer. It's 25' long. Has anybody else had this problem? Or am I just missing something here. Do I need to get a 6' long cord? If so where?
PLEASE HELP!

If the generator stalls on a light load then you have a fuel supply issue. Just like a plugged fuel filter on a truck that lets it run fine at idle and below 30-40 mph but pops and farts when you try to accelerate or go up a hill.

Sometimes all it takes to clear up the problem you have is to make sure that you have a good supply of fuel to the carb. Take the fuel hose loose at the carb, open the valve and see if there is a good flow of fuel from the hose (into a catch can of course). If not, turn off the valve and remove the filter at the bottom. Blow it out and try again. If there is a good flow, turn off the valve and remover the bottom bowl of the carb. Check for sediment. This is no big deal as the carb is about as sophisticated as a model-T carb if one learns how to do these things at home, it is SOOO much easier if you have a problem later.

As for the Lazy repaiman, just rember, the genset is designed to give you 29.2 amps all day long at 120V. with surges to 33 amps for short bursts. This is something that can be fixed with a little compressed air and patience, more likely than not.


(PS, I've seen this with Honda's too. Both the genset acting up and the repair centers being lazy)

[sand_crab]

I have read several posts about the db ratings of generators, it would seem to me that if you put a small muffler on the generator, say like one off a small car or cycle that you could appreciably reduce the noise level of the Generator, is this possible to do, and be effective?

[eightballsidepo]

The Roamer wrote:
YES, and waiting for a call back

I really feel for your plight.....guy.

I believe you deserve not a repaired generator, but a brand new replacement!

I'd be adamant about it. Tell the head honchos at Champion that you represent hundreds of fellow Champion owners on one of the biggest R.V. forums in the U.S.A. and that you'll tell them on that forum what kind of treatment your getting from their service folks, and you are very disappointed.

That'll shake'em up.

Champion doesn't need bad publicity........They're trying to get a foothold in the U.S.A. and if you convince them that you have a lot of clout on the internet, and will let a lot of people know that Champion doesn't support their product, you just may get some positive results. Just be very business-like in your approach with these folks........Don't lose your "cool" and you may get somethings done.

[Mr__Tommy]

Like everyone else, I will be eagerly awaiting the reply from Champion. Mine, of course, runs everything without breathing heavy.

However, I was 'camped' with a friend over the weekend and he had one of those spendy Hondas (3000i or something like that). It sure was quiet. But it sure did cost him a lot more than my trusty Champion. 😉

[The_Roamer]

YES, and waiting for a call back

[ChaosAgent]

The Roamer wrote:
Not according to them. The guy at Champion said it should run everything like you say. They sent me to the repair place here in Phoenix and the guy laughed at me. He said no way and anybody running those things are going to burn up the gen. or A/C micro or both. I tell you right now I'm spitten nails. I'm trying to retun it now.


WHAT A FREAKING JOKE!!!

So, about 100 people here say it will work fine.

The manufactor says it will work fine.

And some repair guy says it won't.

And who do you seem to believe?

Maybe he just doesn't want to work on it.

Have you called Champion and told them what he said?

[MFinCA]

The Roamer wrote:
Not according to them. The guy at Champion said it should run everything like you say. They sent me to the repair place here in Phoenix and the guy laughed at me. He said no way and anybody running those things are going to burn up the gen. or A/C micro or both. I tell you right now I'm spitten nails. I'm trying to retun it now.

If you look at this chart--it will tell you how much power is needed to run lots of things--including RV-related items.

http://www.hayesequipment.com/honda_generator_wattage_guide.htm

A Champion RV generator WILL perform as advertised. The repair guy is lazy. If you call Champion back and let them know what he said, they will straighten him out.

[The_Roamer]

Not according to them. The guy at Champion said it should run everything like you say. They sent me to the repair place here in Phoenix and the guy laughed at me. He said no way and anybody running those things are going to burn up the gen. or A/C micro or both. I tell you right now I'm spitten nails. I'm trying to retun it now.


WHAT A FREAKING JOKE!!!