โMar-02-2005 06:20 AM
professor95 wrote:
EDIT ADDED 45/5/2013- When this thread started in March of 2005, I never expected to see it survive this long or amass the quantity of information that has been shared here.
In the eight year run of this thread we have amassed almost 10,000 postings and surpassed a million views. This creates somewhat of a dilemma for anyone who has just discovered the forum.
Since the amount of information is virtually overwhelming, I suggest you set your preferences for this thread to read "newest first" and then begin to page backwards.
What you will find in these pages is a wealth of info on virtually any make or model of Chinese manufactured synchronous (non-inverter) generator in the 3,000 watt performance class. Info will include how to rewire series coils to parallel to obtain maximum wattage from a single 120 volt outlet. Tips on further reducing sound levels, how to care for these generators, which ones are "RV ready" and provide the best overall performance for the dollar invested. Which companies NOT to deal with, where the best prices are, how to safely wire the generator into a home or RV, how to check your RV for electrical faults, sources for generator accessories, which 20/30 adapters are safe to use and which are not. How to convert a gasoline generator to propane or NG. This is only the beginning. The forum has a life of its own with the focus sub-topic switching frequently. Still, the main topic of utilizing the amazing, inexpensive Chinese gensets is always there. The amount of creativity and innovation presented in these pages is indicative of the talents shared in the diverse backgrounds of the folks who make up our combined RV community.
Many of the original brands and models of Chinese gensets mentioned in the introduction and early pages of the thread have since disappeared. New EPA and CARB emissions requirements, company bonds assuring the emissions warranty will be honored even if the company goes out of business, and fierce competition in the industry have changed the playing field. Champion Power Equipment has become the apparent "trophy team" providing an ever expanding retail outlet, an ample parts supply, a strong warranty and excellent customer service. CPE has continued to improve their product and now offers a new model (#46538) with exclusive convenience, safety and performance features aimed at the RV market. Big names like Cummins/Onan, Honda and Generac all now have Chinese built open frame synchronous gensets available. Ironically, the prices often found on these gensets has not significantly changed during the past eight years - even with the devaluation of the American Dollar and new EPA/CARB requirements.
I also encourage you to use the search function and even the advanced search options to find information. Key works such as "rewiring", "PowerPro", "Champion", "Onan Homesite", "Duropower", "ETQ", "Jiung Dong or JD", "Tractor Supply", "Costco", "Lowe's" and "Home Depot" are all examples of keywords that will give you specific information on different models being sold by retailers today.
Or, you can fill your glass with your favorite beverage (keep more close by - maybe some munchies as well :D, sit back at your computer, tell your wife (or significant other) that you will see her in the morning and spend the next 10 or so hours reading through the postings.
No one on the forum gets mad if you ask a question that is a repeat. Please do not hesitate to post to the forum. All questions are considered important and those active on the forum will do their best to respond with a valid answer.
Also note we are not out to knock the Honda, Yamaha, Kipor or other brands of high end digital gensets. We recognize the quality of these products and their suitability for quite, efficient RV use. But, there is a flood of reliable, inexpensive and comparatively lower cost gensets coming out of China that are excellent alternative choices for the RVer wanting power to run an air conditioner, microwave, etc. without excessive noise or breaking the budget.
Oh, one last thing. The folks on this forum are true gentlemen. We do not flame one another or the product discussed - period. Ugly contributors usually have their comments and remarks ignored by our masses. It is not a forum to start arguments to obtain a clear win. We do disagree on many issues, but we have all agreed to do that in a respectable manner.
We now have the introduction of more and more inverter gensets. There is a rather extensive thread named "The Official Unofficial Champion 2000i Generator" on this forum. Today, I added info on the new Champion 3100i inverter genset. Discussion on this product may get moved to its own thread at a later date.
Many have looked upon this thread with distain saying Chinese is cheap and doomed to failure. I remember saying exactly the same thing about Japanese products a few decades back. But, over the past eight years the track record for Chinese built generators has shown otherwise.
Please, join us in a fascinating journey down the Chinese built genset road of knowledge.
This is the question I posted that got it all started back in March 2005.......
Randy
For a little over a month now, I have been somewhat intrigued by the availability of a 3000 watt, 6.5 HP generator at Pep Boys and Northern Tool for under $300.00. The engine on this generator looks identical to a Honda 6.5 HP OHV engine. Knowing that the Chinese have become very adept at โcloningโ reputable technologies from other manufacturers, I was not surprised at the similarities. Neither store could give me any information on the generator nor did they have a โrunningโ display model.
I have done a little research. This is what I have discovered:
Many of these generators are imported by ELIM International (www.eliminternational.com) out of Buffalo, New York from Jiung Manufacturing in China. (The unit at Northern is identical but carries the JIUNG name.)
The engines are indeed a Chinese knockoff of the popular 6.5 HP 196cc Honda Engine. โSupposedlyโ Honda has licensed the engine technology to the Chinese manufacturer of the product.
The Chinese company that makes the ELM3000 generators is a rather large, diverse, long-standing company with a reputation for โabove average qualityโ Chinese made products (Jiung Manufacturing). There are many more Chinese companies making almost identical gensets.
The generators at PepBoys do have a six month limited warranty. But, it is only on the engine (not the generator) and requires paying for shipping to and from Buffalo. Probably not a very practical thing to do if you have warranty issues.
ELIM does supply replacement parts (a PDF parts manual is available on the ELIM web site). No prices are given for replacement parts nor is there an โavailability listingโ.
The generator head itself is a brushless design. The only really significant wear parts in the generator are the bearings โ most likely universally available.
The published dB rating is 67 at 23 feet. This is โreasonablyโ quite for a generator of this size as most comparabl.... The 67 dB rating is the same as Honda gives their 3000 watt CycloInverter with a โlook alikeโ eng...
โJun-06-2008 08:31 AM
toprudder wrote:
In fact, if done correctly, the cooling effect will be more efficient. The Onan in my MH will actually overheat if the door is left removed, since it depends on the ducted airflow being forced through the interior to cool everything.
โJun-05-2008 10:43 AM
โJun-05-2008 10:39 AM
โJun-05-2008 08:45 AM
Old & Slow wrote:
Where is de' Prof, Maybe writing another tall story about that "Flux Capacitor" home brew by de' Wiz... Maybe he is on a around de' world ride on that new Nuke Powered Champ.?
โJun-05-2008 08:40 AM
Old & Slow wrote:
Professor95
Well finally you admit Champion is correct in the Owners Manual. No modifications. It's like the Constitution of the United State of America.
โJun-05-2008 07:22 AM
โJun-05-2008 07:08 AM
luv2travelnow wrote:
hi all im new to this topic so dont get mad at me i own one of these champion genny great buy and i have had mine certified for the campground were i camp 65db at 18 feet my ?? is how did you quiet your unit down other than ideling it down thank you in advance
Dan
โJun-05-2008 07:00 AM
Old & Slow wrote:
Sounds like a bad idea. Need pictures and testing temps with 90/100% ambient. 62 dBA? Owner's manual states 3' (feet) of space needed around the genset. Too much radient heat.
โJun-05-2008 06:54 AM
Dickson Sr. wrote:
Actually, the former. I need a box to ship my generator. I've checked the yellow pages and on line. After contacting the $500 shipper. I went on line and checked how much Fedex charges to ship a box with my dimensions and weight, $108. So the box costs $392. Any ideas?
โJun-05-2008 05:08 AM
Old & Slow wrote:
What do you think, Bob?
Floyd
โJun-05-2008 04:13 AM
toprudder wrote:Old & Slow wrote:
Sounds like a bad idea. Need pictures and testing temps with 90/100% ambient. 62 dBA? Owner's manual states 3' (feet) of space needed around the genset. Too much radiant heat.
The secret is in ducting the air through the enclosure. Simply putting a box over the generator is not a good idea, since the same air will circulate through the generator time after time, getting hotter each time. However, draw the air in one side, blow it through the engine and genhead then exhaust it out the other side - no reason this won't work IF DONE PROPERLY.
I have always been of the opinion that no extra fan would be needed. There is already a fan that draws air in through the engine, and another in the genhead. Duct all of that air properly and it should work fine. The Prof seems to think that will work as well.
In fact, if done correctly, the cooling effect will be more efficient. The Onan in my MH will actually overheat if the door is left removed, since it depends on the ducted airflow being forced through the interior to cool everything.
Bob R.
โJun-04-2008 08:56 PM
โJun-04-2008 07:35 PM
professor95 wrote:Dickson, Sr. wrote:
OK guys...I need help. I need ideas on how and where to get a box made up for my generator. Who to ship it by? Called one place and they want $500 to make a box and ship. Seems a bit much, no?
I'm a little confused here. Are you looking for a box to ship a generator in or someone to make you a box (sound enclosure) for your generator and ship it to you?
If it is the latter, who out there is making and shipping sound enclosure boxes?
While my current sound enclosure works extremely well, if I had it to do over again I would take an entirely different approach. My experiments and research have shown that a simpler and extremely effective enclosure can be made from Hardi-Baker 1/2" cement board (do not use other brands). The board is water proof, fire proof, paintable and (easily) cut with a carbide tooth circular saw. The fuel tank needs to be raised about 3" by sawing off the top of the frame and inserting 1/2" water pipe nipples. The frame is boxed on all sides but the bottom, which is left open with at least 2" of air space all around. The mufler is boxed out of the inner air space. Aluminum "L" is used as the ties for corners that do not meet the genny frame. The genny end is extended with a coffee can to the outside to bring cooler outside air across the windings and AVR.. The air intake on the engine end is ducted to the shroud as in my current design. NO ADDITIONAL FAN IS NEEDED if the bottom perimeter is left open (wheel kit provides this with no additional mods or risers). Cost? About $50 for materials - paint and screws included.
Expect sound levels of 62 dBA with this enclosure - very acceptable in any campground.
Downside is added weight and you must be careful with concret backer board as it can be cracked or broken if hit in unsupported areas.
โJun-04-2008 07:22 PM
Old & Slow wrote:
Sounds like a bad idea. Need pictures and testing temps with 90/100% ambient. 62 dBA? Owner's manual states 3' (feet) of space needed around the genset. Too much radient heat.
โJun-04-2008 05:50 PM