3000W Chinese Gensets Info.

[professor95]

professor95 wrote:
EDIT ADDED 45/5/2013- When this thread started in March of 2005, I never expected to see it survive this long or amass the quantity of information that has been shared here.

In the eight year run of this thread we have amassed almost 10,000 postings and surpassed a million views. This creates somewhat of a dilemma for anyone who has just discovered the forum.

Since the amount of information is virtually overwhelming, I suggest you set your preferences for this thread to read "newest first" and then begin to page backwards.

What you will find in these pages is a wealth of info on virtually any make or model of Chinese manufactured synchronous (non-inverter) generator in the 3,000 watt performance class. Info will include how to rewire series coils to parallel to obtain maximum wattage from a single 120 volt outlet. Tips on further reducing sound levels, how to care for these generators, which ones are "RV ready" and provide the best overall performance for the dollar invested. Which companies NOT to deal with, where the best prices are, how to safely wire the generator into a home or RV, how to check your RV for electrical faults, sources for generator accessories, which 20/30 adapters are safe to use and which are not. How to convert a gasoline generator to propane or NG. This is only the beginning. The forum has a life of its own with the focus sub-topic switching frequently. Still, the main topic of utilizing the amazing, inexpensive Chinese gensets is always there. The amount of creativity and innovation presented in these pages is indicative of the talents shared in the diverse backgrounds of the folks who make up our combined RV community.

Many of the original brands and models of Chinese gensets mentioned in the introduction and early pages of the thread have since disappeared. New EPA and CARB emissions requirements, company bonds assuring the emissions warranty will be honored even if the company goes out of business, and fierce competition in the industry have changed the playing field. Champion Power Equipment has become the apparent "trophy team" providing an ever expanding retail outlet, an ample parts supply, a strong warranty and excellent customer service. CPE has continued to improve their product and now offers a new model (#46538) with exclusive convenience, safety and performance features aimed at the RV market. Big names like Cummins/Onan, Honda and Generac all now have Chinese built open frame synchronous gensets available. Ironically, the prices often found on these gensets has not significantly changed during the past eight years - even with the devaluation of the American Dollar and new EPA/CARB requirements.

I also encourage you to use the search function and even the advanced search options to find information. Key works such as "rewiring", "PowerPro", "Champion", "Onan Homesite", "Duropower", "ETQ", "Jiung Dong or JD", "Tractor Supply", "Costco", "Lowe's" and "Home Depot" are all examples of keywords that will give you specific information on different models being sold by retailers today.

Or, you can fill your glass with your favorite beverage (keep more close by - maybe some munchies as well :D, sit back at your computer, tell your wife (or significant other) that you will see her in the morning and spend the next 10 or so hours reading through the postings.

No one on the forum gets mad if you ask a question that is a repeat. Please do not hesitate to post to the forum. All questions are considered important and those active on the forum will do their best to respond with a valid answer.

Also note we are not out to knock the Honda, Yamaha, Kipor or other brands of high end digital gensets. We recognize the quality of these products and their suitability for quite, efficient RV use. But, there is a flood of reliable, inexpensive and comparatively lower cost gensets coming out of China that are excellent alternative choices for the RVer wanting power to run an air conditioner, microwave, etc. without excessive noise or breaking the budget.

Oh, one last thing. The folks on this forum are true gentlemen. We do not flame one another or the product discussed - period. Ugly contributors usually have their comments and remarks ignored by our masses. It is not a forum to start arguments to obtain a clear win. We do disagree on many issues, but we have all agreed to do that in a respectable manner.

We now have the introduction of more and more inverter gensets. There is a rather extensive thread named "The Official Unofficial Champion 2000i Generator" on this forum. Today, I added info on the new Champion 3100i inverter genset. Discussion on this product may get moved to its own thread at a later date.

Many have looked upon this thread with distain saying Chinese is cheap and doomed to failure. I remember saying exactly the same thing about Japanese products a few decades back. But, over the past eight years the track record for Chinese built generators has shown otherwise.

Please, join us in a fascinating journey down the Chinese built genset road of knowledge.

This is the question I posted that got it all started back in March 2005.......

Randy

For a little over a month now, I have been somewhat intrigued by the availability of a 3000 watt, 6.5 HP generator at Pep Boys and Northern Tool for under $300.00. The engine on this generator looks identical to a Honda 6.5 HP OHV engine. Knowing that the Chinese have become very adept at “cloning” reputable technologies from other manufacturers, I was not surprised at the similarities. Neither store could give me any information on the generator nor did they have a “running” display model.

I have done a little research. This is what I have discovered:

Many of these generators are imported by ELIM International (www.eliminternational.com) out of Buffalo, New York from Jiung Manufacturing in China. (The unit at Northern is identical but carries the JIUNG name.)

The engines are indeed a Chinese knockoff of the popular 6.5 HP 196cc Honda Engine. “Supposedly” Honda has licensed the engine technology to the Chinese manufacturer of the product.

The Chinese company that makes the ELM3000 generators is a rather large, diverse, long-standing company with a reputation for “above average quality” Chinese made products (Jiung Manufacturing). There are many more Chinese companies making almost identical gensets.

The generators at PepBoys do have a six month limited warranty. But, it is only on the engine (not the generator) and requires paying for shipping to and from Buffalo. Probably not a very practical thing to do if you have warranty issues.

ELIM does supply replacement parts (a PDF parts manual is available on the ELIM web site). No prices are given for replacement parts nor is there an “availability listing”.

The generator head itself is a brushless design. The only really significant wear parts in the generator are the bearings – most likely universally available.

The published dB rating is 67 at 23 feet. This is “reasonably” quite for a generator of this size as most comparabl.... The 67 dB rating is the same as Honda gives their 3000 watt CycloInverter with a “look alike” eng...

[ol_Bombero-JC]

toprudder wrote:

walkers2rad wrote:
JC,
Not to get too defensive here, LOL (take all of this with a grain of salt) you offer some obvious (jaded) points but Wow... I offer up a specific example along with test results and dismanteled pics and right off the bat I get the quality question and who is going to work on it schpiel? No shortage of honda guys here trying to justify spending three to four times as much for the same results while lugging more around is there? If anyone is skeered of it, cant work on it or dont need one then it is not for them and I think they can figure that out for themselves.
Of course if the electronics go out then yes I will have to deal with finding parts but it should be obvious who is going to work on mine. The seller says he stocks everything but you are right and who knows? I will put it to the test by asking for the RV panel.
Did you look up the listing... bother to read it, look at the FB and sales? I did and parted with a small amount of money for what I got and took a risk... I was just sharing the initial results. Should I go back to lurking and adding nothing or is more important to become a member of the posting whoooas that have nothing of value to add?
Just kidding... have a nice day doing what you do!
Thanks for the welcome to the boards:)

Since the post that prompted this reply has been edited out, I can only imagine what was said.

Walkers, please post the pics and any info on this generator. I for one am interested. Welcome to the forum.

Bob R.

~
~
WHOA UP THERE !! Top!

Nothing out of sorts, impolite or inflammatory - was said by me.
Nor was his new baby "bad mouthed".

Walkers (a new member w/ 4 posts) took offense to my suggesting
that he check on the service & parts availability of his e-Bay gen.

I must be more the Boy Scout "Be Prepared" type - I like to
know in advance where I'm going to take my: car, truck, M/Cs,
. . . and gen - if it breaks.

Should have guessed that, although new to the forums,
he certainly has read (lurking) of some of the folks
(on the forums) who have had bad experiences -
and (he) was well aware of the ability of any of us to become
a "generator supplier" - by having read same on this thread.

I don't have a Champ - bought an inverter type long before the Champ was available - but follow the thread for all the great electrical
info and shared knowledge.

As far as "jaded" - Walkers is right!
As I previously indicated to him, (complete with the qualifier "IMO") I'm leery of anything with moving parts purchased from e-Bay.

However - "jaded" is applicable to his own post in re:
"prized open frame jobs" vs his e-Bay purchase.
Looked like a pretty "cheap shot" to me.

Lastly, nope - didn't look up "his" seller.
Deleted my own post - as anybody that's been on here a while already has/had the same info . . . never thought that walkers probably did too.

Now - wish I had left it in!

JC

[MrWizard]

put them some place like 'picture trail' or 'photo bucket' and then copy and place the tag that has the [ img ] tag at each end of the photo URL [ /img ]
no thumbnails needed

[walkers2rad]

"BTW - I don't own one of the "prized open framed jobs" - never have."

Never thunk it... not even for a second! So you business here is what again? Just kidding it is all in good fun I am sure! Whatever you have is fine I just cant justify spending anything near what you probably did when I have a built in 5500 onan for the serious generating.

*edited cause the pic did not show... I figure it out later tho read on...

[toprudder]

walkers2rad wrote:
JC,
Not to get too defensive here, LOL (take all of this with a grain of salt) you offer some obvious (jaded) points but Wow... I offer up a specific example along with test results and dismanteled pics and right off the bat I get the quality question and who is going to work on it schpiel? No shortage of honda guys here trying to justify spending three to four times as much for the same results while lugging more around is there? If anyone is skeered of it, cant work on it or dont need one then it is not for them and I think they can figure that out for themselves.
Of course if the electronics go out then yes I will have to deal with finding parts but it should be obvious who is going to work on mine. The seller says he stocks everything but you are right and who knows? I will put it to the test by asking for the RV panel.
Did you look up the listing... bother to read it, look at the FB and sales? I did and parted with a small amount of money for what I got and took a risk... I was just sharing the initial results. Should I go back to lurking and adding nothing or is more important to become a member of the posting whoooas that have nothing of value to add?
Just kidding... have a nice day doing what you do!
Thanks for the welcome to the boards:)

Since the post that prompted this reply has been edited out, I can only imagine what was said.

Walkers, please post the pics and any info on this generator. I for one am interested. Welcome to the forum.

Bob R.

[ol_Bombero-JC]

walkers2rad wrote:
JC,
Not to get too defensive here, LOL (take all of this with a grain of salt) you offer some obvious (jaded) points but Wow... I offer up a specific example along with test results and dismanteled pics and right off the bat I get the quality question and who is going to work on it schpiel? No shortage of honda guys here trying to justify spending three to four times as much for the same results while lugging more around is there? If anyone is skeered of it, cant work on it or dont need one then it is not for them and I think they can figure that out for themselves.
Of course if the electronics go out then yes I will have to deal with finding parts but it should be obvious who is going to work on mine. The seller says he stocks everything but you are right and who knows? I will put it to the test by asking for the RV panel.
Did you look up the listing... bother to read it, look at the FB and sales? I did and parted with a small amount of money for what I got and took a risk... I was just sharing the initial results. Should I go back to lurking and adding nothing or is more important to become a member of the posting whoooas that have nothing of value to add?
Just kidding... have a nice day doing what you do!
Thanks for the welcome to the boards:)

Wow!
Maybe a trip back to bed & get up on the other side!

Sorry to scratch your thin skin the wrong way!

BTW - I don't own one of the "prized open framed jobs" - never have.

JC

[Oldfordman]

magic43 wrote:
I need another Champion C46540. The best price that I have found is $399.00 with free shipping from www.partsamerica.com. They apparently are not offering a discount coupon a the present time.

Does anyone know of a better deal. There are no local auto parts stores etc. that carry them.

Thanks in advance.....Lynn

For those of you that live near a Schucks, Kragen, or Checker Auto Parts Store, keep your eye on the "In-Store" specials. Weekends have yielded some sales like "20% off any item in the store over $100 (regular posted price). This is usually posted on the door when these sales are in effect. Many of the Schuck's Stores here in the Pac Northwest have an abundance of stock on this generator and a "Sale" like this will lower the price to around $275 or so. Some stores even stock the LPG powered genset (larger and heavier than the 3500/4000 watt unit but nice for power emergencies at the house this winter.

[walkers2rad]

JC,
Not to get too defensive here, LOL (take all of this with a grain of salt) you offer some obvious (jaded) points but Wow... I offer up a specific example along with test results and dismanteled pics and right off the bat I get the quality question and who is going to work on it schpiel? No shortage of honda guys here trying to justify spending three to four times as much for the same results while lugging more around is there? If anyone is skeered of it, cant work on it or dont need one then it is not for them and I think they can figure that out for themselves.
Of course if the electronics go out then yes I will have to deal with finding parts but it should be obvious who is going to work on mine. The seller says he stocks everything but you are right and who knows? I will put it to the test by asking for the RV panel.
Did you look up the listing... bother to read it, look at the FB and sales? I did and parted with a small amount of money for what I got and took a risk... I was just sharing the initial results. Should I go back to lurking and adding nothing or is more important to become a member of the posting whoooas that have nothing of value to add?
Just kidding... have a nice day doing what you do!
Thanks for the welcome to the boards:)

[MrWizard]

please post the di-section pictures HERE, this thread can keep evolving, even we of the CCC , what to know more and be well informed

HEY Professor , Hows the new trailer

[ol_Bombero-JC]

Walkers -
Have a a nice day!

JC

[walkers2rad]

I dont know if is exactly relavent to this discussion but I bagged a quiet and efficient 3kw fully digital sinewave inverter generator on e-bay for not much more than your prized open frame jobs... $465!
Maybe it is getting time for at least the new buyers to start looking in this direction as an alternative to this box building hobby. Problem with that is the more quiet you make it the less convienent it gets and it can never be as efficent as one of these. With gas prices where they are I think that you would make up the difference fairly quickly.
I suspect that the open frame jobs are getting less available because factories are going to start pumping these out like mad. Those companies arent stupid, they know that there is a huge market for the more efficient and quiet ones and people are willing to pay accordingly. These cover a much wider market and will attract people like me looking to save some gas running light to moderate loads and keeping hours off the big built in gen.

This carries with one hand like a 2kw honda with more than enough power to run the A/C... I wasnt sure if I wanted it but I put a low ball bid on it and got suprised! There is even some kind of three year warranty on the engine!
Links dont seem to work so you can go to e-bay and copy and paste this DIGITAL 3000 WATT GAS GENERATOR INVERTER QUIET PORTABLE you can search completed items and see what they are going for... seems like I was the first so they are starting to go for a bit more. I like that it is black so it will not show scuff marks, attract the wrong kind of attention like a yellow one or fade to pink like a red one.
I pretty much complety disected it before starting it for the first time yesterday and it seems to be fairly well made. Despite my curiosity it started first pull and I put it thru fairly extensive testing including running my A/C and it surpassed my expectations! I even overloaded it on purpose and did not have to restart it to get it generating again! I suspect that it will even start my A/C in the economy mode but I did not try it... however it did take a 1500 watt resistive load in the economy mode just fine.

If there is enough interest I will post the disection pictures along with running load meter and voltmeter readings. If so should I do it on this thread or start another one?
The only problem I have with it is that it did not come with the 30 amp rv recep like the listing says but I am going to ask the seller to nicely send me the correct panel... we will see how that goes!
Let me know.

[Old___Slow]

I keep thinking the last train out with a low low ticket price has left the station. here we are. $299 and i understand TS will sell you a 5 year service agreement for i think $49.95. just bring it back, no questions ask. i ordered my c46540 from partsamerica.com last year and have never needed service. many times i worried about the so called need to adjust the valve lash and a possible avr failure and on and on but the little bugger has survived a real stress test with all my crazy box building. got over heated several times but she keeps crankin' on the second pull. first it was insatalled in the factory genset compartment of a previous mh, now it's used in a genhouse for box building ideas and back up power. may need her this week. oh, the henhouse is painted 'yellow trimmed in black'

[richheck]

Tractor Supply Company has them for $299.00 here is a link to their web site
Champion 4,000 Generator

[budracer1]

magic43 wrote:
I need another Champion C46540. The best price that I have found is $399.00 with free shipping from www.partsamerica.com. They apparently are not offering a discount coupon a the present time.

Does anyone know of a better deal. There are no local auto parts stores etc. that carry them.

Thanks in advance.....Lynn

This may solve all my problems with my gen,maybe i should just get a champion like this one,do they run a 15k ac pretty well?Ive seen a lot of good feedback on the 3000 so this one should perform better right?

thanks Jason

[magic43]

I need another Champion C46540. The best price that I have found is $399.00 with free shipping from www.partsamerica.com. They apparently are not offering a discount coupon a the present time.

Does anyone know of a better deal. There are no local auto parts stores etc. that carry them.

Thanks in advance.....Lynn

[toprudder]

Regarding the 60v AVR input, I don't see why you could not use a small transformer to supply the necessary voltage to the AVR. If you want to rewire for 120v only output, then use a 2:1 transformer to reduce the 120v to 60 going to the AVR.