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12V Inline System Fuse

_1nobby
Explorer
Explorer
On my new to me TT, there was a 12V 30A fuse near the battery tray.

When I followed the 12V wiring under the trailer, I found the 12V electrical box with an additional 12V 30A fuse before the box.

Do I need both? These fuses are the auto-reset 2 post 30A style.

Seems redundant.
19 REPLIES 19

_1nobby
Explorer
Explorer
myredracer wrote:
Here's my thoughts based on what I can see in the photo.


Thank you.

_1nobby
Explorer
Explorer
beemerphile1 wrote:
For clarity, that "electrical box" is normally referred to as a J-box or junction box.

Without tracking down each and every wire it is impossible to figure out what is being done.

Here is one theory. The CB in the picture is original and a previous owner added the one at the battery not being aware of the pictured one.


Agreed.

beemerphile1
Explorer
Explorer
For clarity, that "electrical box" is normally referred to as a J-box or junction box.

Without tracking down each and every wire it is impossible to figure out what is being done.

Here is one theory. The CB in the picture is original and a previous owner added the one at the battery not being aware of the pictured one.
Build a life you don't need a vacation from.

2016 Silverado 3500HD DRW D/A 4x4
2018 Keystone Cougar 26RBS
2006 Weekend Warrior FK1900

myredracer
Explorer II
Explorer II
Here's my thoughts based on what I can see in the photo. Apologies for being wordy. It is still difficult to tell without more info. and maybe another photo or two. You will have a TT with the coupler on the bottom of the A-frame tubing. Not many brands/models have that. I know Jayco does. I don't know enough about the brands/models with that type of A-frame to know if the circuit breakers and junction box are normally exposed or hidden behind the underbelly material (coroplast). Maybe someone relocated all the wiring to behind the coroplast??

Yes, it does look like someone has been in there making modifications. Doesn't look quite like factory work. Someone went to the trouble of taking down the coroplast to do it too. Have not seen splices with those open-end crimp connectors used before. It's not good practice to hide wiring connections and components but don't know if any of the TT manufacturers actually do this. Does keep it away from the elements tho.

It looks like the red wire heading off to the battery is a #6 gauge (looks fatter and has a blue ring terminal) and the wire after the breaker is a #8 gauge with red terminal (#8 would be typical for one or two batteries) plus what looks like a #10. There is normally one red wire after the circuit breaker that connects to the converter, the wire in the cable from the 7-pin TV/TT connector and to the brakes, tailights and marker lights all in one BIG splice (blue marrette). The connection to the brakes and breakaway switch is of course, critical for safety and wiring needs to be done to ensure it's integrity.

I don't see any fat red wires after the junction box which would suggest either a solar panels or inverter.

There is the #8 (?) wire after the breaker and #10 (?) that are spliced inside the junction box. Can't tell from the photo what's connected to what. If the incoming to the breaker is a #6, there isn't an ordinary crimp or twist-on (marette) type connector to splice a #6 and the other wires to. What I think is that the PO ran a #8 and # 10 wire after the breaker so he could use a readily available wire nut or crimp connector. Maybe the breaker ratings were changed?? I don't know how you tell because the ones I've seen don't have the rating marked on them.

Not sure why the splice in the box has tape wrapped around it like that. No tape on the other splices. Maybe you should take the tape off to make sure it's okay? It looks like a twist-on connector under the tape? That's a connection where I think it'd be good to solder before putting a cap on it. Maybe take the connector off and make sure the connection is properly done (it's not hard to make a mess of it with stranded wires too).

Maybe the PO had upgraded the batteries and had a lot more amp-hours and felt the need to do something with the breaker? Maybe it's not a 30 amp and a larger rating?

I see a ground lug inside the box with all the ground wires (white) connected to it. Not so sure I like the self-tapping screw through the lug and box and then to the frame. A good ground connection is very important. It may very well be okay, but if it were me, I'd take the box off and see if the PO sanded paint off the frame to make a good connection (don't rely on just the screw threads). There also appears to be a ground lug with a single black wire attached to the frame just ahead of the metal box, which must be the ground from the battery. They usually ground batteries to the frame close to the battery (less time and material). Inspect the lug and make sure it is in good condition and that paint was sanded off the frame behind it.

Any wires entering/exiting the box need to have a grommet or something to protect the wiring from being damaged. Not sure there are grommets on all the wires? Same through the frame. Looks like there's a green/white cable unprotected through the frame, but the manufacturers like to do that...

It's not uncommon to have two of those mini circuit breakers near the battery. If there is/was an electric tongue jack, a second breaker is used for power to the jack. That's what we have from the factory. Funny thing is, the dealer installed an UltraFab jack to replace the original factory one which failed (within days of getting the TT new) and the UF jack has it's own encapsulated mini breaker so the jack actually has 3 breakers in series the way it's wired!

More more I look at the photo, I would guess that someone has definitely been in there changing things around. Don't see anything oddball or wrong as far as a wiring schematic goes, but the execution of the work and intention is somewhat questionable. I'd recommend that you trace the wiring as best you can and make a sketch. FWIW, if you have a circuit breaker near the battery which is exposed to the elements, they do make a completely encapsulated auto-reset one (Pollak 54-930). There's also a boot available (JEGS sells them). If you want to relocate the box & breaker to where it's accessible, you can use a PVC watertight junction box like in the 3rd photo.



westend
Explorer
Explorer
Somebody had a need to splice in another (+) phase and after cutting the main feed, installed another circuit breaker to make the connection.
'03 F-250 4x4 CC
'71 Starcraft Wanderstar -- The Cowboy/Hilton

_1nobby
Explorer
Explorer
This what is under the front left corner of the trailer.

The other breaker was on the A frame near the battery tray.




myredracer
Explorer II
Explorer II
#1nobby wrote:
FOR CLARIFICATION:

Circuit breakers are both on the positive from the battery.
One is near the battery and the other is under the trailer just before an electrical box that the battery feed passes through as well as the tow vehicle harness.....all 12V.

I can't honestly see the need for both 18" apart.


Can you post a photo?

_1nobby
Explorer
Explorer
FOR CLARIFICATION:

Circuit breakers are both on the positive from the battery.
One is near the battery and the other is under the trailer just before an electrical box that the battery feed passes through as well as the tow vehicle harness.....all 12V.

I can't honestly see the need for both 18" apart.

LarryJM
Explorer II
Explorer II
westend wrote:
Best practices is to have circuit protection within 18' of the positive battery terminal. Someone my have upgraded that cable and followed that schedule. You only need one circuit breaker to protect the main feed from the positive battery terminal.


CORRECT and while most don't realize it many auto battery installs used to use as the first wire on the positive battery lead except for the starter a fusable link that looks just like a normal wire, but acts like a fuse. I have two of those resetable CBs on my trailer. One is for the main battery going to the converter and the other is for my slide which can draw a large current momentarily if you run the motor into the stops.

For the OP be careful about simply removing one of those since you need to make absolutely sure that they are in fact redundant and not protecting two separate items.

Larry
2001 standard box 7.3L E-350 PSD Van with 4.10 rear and 2007 Holiday Rambler Aluma-Lite 8306S Been RV'ing since 1974.
RAINKAP INSTALL////ETERNABOND INSTALL

westend
Explorer
Explorer
#1nobby wrote:
OK...thx everyone.

Yes...I should have said Circuit Breaker.

There is one 12" from the battery positive and then another about 18" from that downstream near the 12V electrical box.

No electric stabilizers.
There is nothing wrong with having the two circuit breakers. Any large fault will trip the one closest to the junction box. Any short between the farthest breaker and the one nearest the battery will protect the wire from the battery to the first breaker.

The only issue with having two of the cheap-ass canister breakers typical to RV installation, is that you are doubling your odds of a breaker failure. It does happen.

For the best situation, remove both and replace with one of these: CB encapsulatedYou can even get one with a manual trip that will serve as a disconnect switch.
'03 F-250 4x4 CC
'71 Starcraft Wanderstar -- The Cowboy/Hilton

beemerphile1
Explorer
Explorer
Protection should be near any power source. Generally that means the line is protected at the battery and at the converter, they are both power sources.

I'm not sure what you are calling the "12V electrical box".
Build a life you don't need a vacation from.

2016 Silverado 3500HD DRW D/A 4x4
2018 Keystone Cougar 26RBS
2006 Weekend Warrior FK1900

_1nobby
Explorer
Explorer
OK...thx everyone.

Yes...I should have said Circuit Breaker.

There is one 12" from the battery positive and then another about 18" from that downstream near the 12V electrical box.

No electric stabilizers.

westend
Explorer
Explorer
Best practices is to have circuit protection within 18' of the positive battery terminal. Someone my have upgraded that cable and followed that schedule. You only need one circuit breaker to protect the main feed from the positive battery terminal.
'03 F-250 4x4 CC
'71 Starcraft Wanderstar -- The Cowboy/Hilton

Boon_Docker
Explorer III
Explorer III
If they are in series between the batteries and the "electrical box", no need to have two of them.