Shopping for used 5er, comparing used Artic Fox and Komfort

[Bluebeard]

My wife and I are in the market for a used 5th wheel. We are not interested in the fancy 40 foot behemoth, we are looking for something no longer than 26 feet. We travel down a lot of dirt roads, and I want to be able to turn around in a limited space if need be. My question is we are comparing a 2002 Arctic Fox 20-5N and a 2004 Komfort 25 FS. Most of our travels will be boondocking and we typically go out in late fall to the mountains, where it is usually pretty cold in the mornings and evenings- with occasional snow. Any plusses or negatives about either? My wife found one of those "pissed consumer" websites that was doing a pretty good job bashing the new arctic foxes, but since this is pretty old stuff, I figured any of the weak stuff would have been replaced by now- although both trailers look to be in pretty good shape.

Also, does anyone know of another used brand of that vintage that has a slide out bedroom along with the living area slide out? We looked at an older Komfort that had it, but it was pretty beat up- I was just wondering if anyone else did that with that small sized trailer.

One of our big issues is interior storage- which is really valuable in the small trailers. If anyone has any suggestions for a smaller 5th that uses its space really well, let me know. We have 2 big dogs so we want to have a lot of floor space for them to lay while we are inside.

Thanks for any input.

[n7bsn]

Bluebeard wrote:
Yeah, the stairs was the first place I looked. The guy who owned it didn't even know that was there.

We were visiting some folk in a campground in Moab UT, that drove from Texas to Florida to buy their 2nd-hand Fox. I was walking around in it, talking about stuff and flipped one of the stair's up with my toe.

The were both shocked as neither knew the steps opened.

[Bluebeard]

Yeah, the stairs was the first place I looked. The guy who owned it didn't even know that was there.

[n7bsn]

Bluebeard wrote:
By the way, we bought the 2002 25-5N- it was in immaculate condition, for $8k- we figured we got an ok deal.

Any of you who have had one of these, are there any hints or tips you can offer to improve our "experience" of this thing? Anything I need to change, or improve upon? Looks like I need to get a solar panel to charge the batteries, at a minimum. I am curious if anyone modified it in any way to "improve it". Not spending much time in a small 5'er ever, I'd like to hear other's experiences of mod's they may have done.

I don't think any of us "24-5N" owners got back to you on this...

We added a fold-up door between the closet/bath-room and main area. This gave us a "changing room" I could stand up in.

We brought the solar lead down via the refer vent and connected to the power-box.

The charge controller is the Charge Wizard, your PD converter is under the main closed, towards the front.

You know that the "steps" open for more storage right? I kept a set of "grungy" cloths there for "just in case"

I swapped out the old mechanical thermostat for an electronic, did a much better job of keeping temps even.

The cabinet between the closet and the dinette has a dead space below it. I used a zero-clearance saw and cut the "base" of that away. Then put firing in and made the base removable. Nice -really- obscure place to put things.

Well, that and the stairs, I've meet more then one "2nd" owner of Nash/Arctic Foxes that didn't know that Northwoods frequently builds storage into the stairs.

[Bluebeard]

I think I may have found an '06 Duramax, but it has a 3" lift on it. Will the Arctic fox still work on the truck if it has a small lift like that? Personally, I don't care for lifts, but I may have to settle for it and maybe take it off if it doesn't work out. Do you guys tow with a lift? This trailer has the springs UNDER the axle.

[goducks10]

Super nice V10 F250 up the road from me.

http://www.skylineforddirect.com/used/Ford/2009-Ford-F-250+Super+Duty-salem-keizer-e6bfaaf90a0a00e03...

[coolbreeze01]

For +- 26', a bumper pull trailer would have as much room and free up your truck bed for a quad, kayak, fishing gear or whatever sounds like fun to you. Is 45,000 miles too many on a 2008? Enjoy the search.

[MrD]

bluebeard,

The only problem with our A/F 245N trailer was the bath room was a little small. So one small thing we did was to put up a curtain rod and curtain just at the top of the stairs. one of the spring loaded types. that way we could open the bathroom door and change in front of the wardrobe area in private. we owned our for 10 years with no problems.

Mike

[laknox]

Bluebeard wrote:
Thanks for the advice Lyle. Unfortunately my wife won't let me buy a truck with more the 60k on it. I'll offer you an exercise in futility by suggesting trying to find a 06' or'07 with less than 60k on it and paying less than the cost of what the truck would have cost new. It's crazy. There is literally NOTHING within 400 miles of me (the ones I do find are too long, smoker's cars, Black, or have some other issue). I am sitting here with cash hoping to catch something as it pops up on craigslist.

I'm finding '06/07 Duramaxes in the $25-35k range around here. Can't say I've found any < 60k miles, but =my= D'max didn't really break in until about 75k anyway. I started pricing out a new GMC Sierra 3500HD SRW 4x4 Crew Cab and quit adding options at $65,000, so there's NO way I'd even consider a new truck. For that money, I'd look for a tricked-out Sport Chassis Freightliner. 🙂 Yes, a gasser will be cheaper, but given your altitude and grades, a diesel, IMO, would serve you better.

Lyle

[Bluebeard]

Very Opinionated. She doesn't get it that those trucks run for 500k miles and a truck with 100k is just broken in. She won't hear anything other and the pisser is that this isn't going to be a daily driver. I will drive it once a week, 150 miles to my mining claim and then occcasionally for trips. I cannot talk any sense to her, so it looks like I am resigned to spend $40k on a 2007 diesel with 40k miles on it. It's like looking for hen's teeth. The good news is in 10 years it will have 50,000 miles on it. Very annoying

[TXiceman]

Bluebeard wrote:
Unfortunately my wife won't let me buy a truck with more the 60k on it.

I wonder if she is a certified mechanic or just opinionated?

Ken

[Bluebeard]

Thanks for the advice Lyle. Unfortunately my wife won't let me buy a truck with more the 60k on it. I'll offer you an exercise in futility by suggesting trying to find a 06' or'07 with less than 60k on it and paying less than the cost of what the truck would have cost new. It's crazy. There is literally NOTHING within 400 miles of me (the ones I do find are too long, smoker's cars, Black, or have some other issue). I am sitting here with cash hoping to catch something as it pops up on craigslist.

[laknox]

Bluebeard wrote:
Yeah, I upgraded the batts to 2-6 volt, so I am good there. Battery minder is a good idea, but I think a charge controller is the same thing, right? Did you do anything to change the cabinets? I was trying to think of a way to extend the kitchen counter when the slide was out. Also, I was thinking about adding a catalytic heater somewhere. In our old Keystone Cougar, when we were camping in a snowstorm, the heater fan was cycling all night long and although it didn't do such a good job of keeping the trailer warm, the constant cycling of the fan, kept us awake all night.

Does anyone have a schematic of the construction of the trailer? I'd like to find a good "cubby hole" to hide valuables when we aren't there. Any ideas? It would be nice to see the schematics of the unit to determine where there are enclosed spaces that aren't being utilized.

Rick, if you're going for shorter off-grid times, 2 6v golf cart batteries, with solar charging, can probably last you a week. Change =all= incandescent bulbs to LEDs, and you'll cut consumption a ton. A =good= solar charge controller can actually help increase charge efficiency when panels aren't at optimum angle, shaded or it's cloudy. I've always thought about adding some hidden locks to the bed platform to turn it into a semi-secure area, though have never done so. Anything truly valuable, take with you when you leave or don't bring it in the first place. We have a "safe" bolted to the floor of one of the wardrobes (factory option), that I could probably pop up with a medium wrecking bar. I do have a lock on it and can only think of 2 times I've used it in 11 years.

Lyle

[laknox]

Bluebeard wrote:
I assume a 2500HD gas or diesel is plenty to pull it? I live in the Sierras so everywhere I go is up or down. Actually, I am now shopping for a good used truck for hauling this thing- can I do it with a 2500 or should I shop for a 3500?. Is gas a viable option for towing this, or should I go with a diesel?

I've been told the Duramax '06 and '07 are the best- but being "Best" comes at a steep price (my wife will only let me buy a truck with less than 60k miles on it, so an '06 or '07 with that low miles on it is very expensive). Are any of the prior years good too? I was thinking of looking for the '05 to get the 5 speed allison- any reviews between towing with the 5-vs the 6 speed?

I know earlier engines had injector problems, do you think those early engine problems have been resolved by now?

Rick, I'd really look for a truck with the 6-speed Allie. Having that extra gear is really nice =and= can help with mileage. Also, on my '02, with the 5-speed, you can NOT manually select 4th gear or otherwise turn off OD; you go direct from OD to 3rd on a manual downshift. Absolutely f'ing STUPID decision on GM's part. Not sure if any of the later 5-speeds are the same way. GM actually has a build sheet for a manual OD cutoff switch and, when I looked into it a number of years ago, the local Chevy dealer wanted about $450 to do it. I balked, and have regretted it ever since. This is probably the biggest reason that I'd spring for some sort of full-blown programmer (Banks, Bully Dog, etc.), to be able to force the d/s point lower when on a grade. Also, if you're looking, get the turbo diesel. At those altitudes, you =need= that extra h.p. and torque. The downhill braking is much better than a gasser, too, even without an exhaust brake.

Lyle

[Bluebeard]

I'm not so much interested in hiding contraband, just cash and possibly protection- I'm not worried about border guards or police- just your run of the mill, idiot criminal. I saw the space under the steps, and was wondering if there was any other unique space that is hiding in the framework. It looks like the whole floor doesn't have a basement under it like the Cougar- unless the raised area underneath that doesn't have the water tanks in it is some sort of sub-floor. I'd like to get creative so I can feel safe my valuables aren't being disturbed.