3000W Chinese Gensets Info.

[professor95]

professor95 wrote:
EDIT ADDED 45/5/2013- When this thread started in March of 2005, I never expected to see it survive this long or amass the quantity of information that has been shared here.

In the eight year run of this thread we have amassed almost 10,000 postings and surpassed a million views. This creates somewhat of a dilemma for anyone who has just discovered the forum.

Since the amount of information is virtually overwhelming, I suggest you set your preferences for this thread to read "newest first" and then begin to page backwards.

What you will find in these pages is a wealth of info on virtually any make or model of Chinese manufactured synchronous (non-inverter) generator in the 3,000 watt performance class. Info will include how to rewire series coils to parallel to obtain maximum wattage from a single 120 volt outlet. Tips on further reducing sound levels, how to care for these generators, which ones are "RV ready" and provide the best overall performance for the dollar invested. Which companies NOT to deal with, where the best prices are, how to safely wire the generator into a home or RV, how to check your RV for electrical faults, sources for generator accessories, which 20/30 adapters are safe to use and which are not. How to convert a gasoline generator to propane or NG. This is only the beginning. The forum has a life of its own with the focus sub-topic switching frequently. Still, the main topic of utilizing the amazing, inexpensive Chinese gensets is always there. The amount of creativity and innovation presented in these pages is indicative of the talents shared in the diverse backgrounds of the folks who make up our combined RV community.

Many of the original brands and models of Chinese gensets mentioned in the introduction and early pages of the thread have since disappeared. New EPA and CARB emissions requirements, company bonds assuring the emissions warranty will be honored even if the company goes out of business, and fierce competition in the industry have changed the playing field. Champion Power Equipment has become the apparent "trophy team" providing an ever expanding retail outlet, an ample parts supply, a strong warranty and excellent customer service. CPE has continued to improve their product and now offers a new model (#46538) with exclusive convenience, safety and performance features aimed at the RV market. Big names like Cummins/Onan, Honda and Generac all now have Chinese built open frame synchronous gensets available. Ironically, the prices often found on these gensets has not significantly changed during the past eight years - even with the devaluation of the American Dollar and new EPA/CARB requirements.

I also encourage you to use the search function and even the advanced search options to find information. Key works such as "rewiring", "PowerPro", "Champion", "Onan Homesite", "Duropower", "ETQ", "Jiung Dong or JD", "Tractor Supply", "Costco", "Lowe's" and "Home Depot" are all examples of keywords that will give you specific information on different models being sold by retailers today.

Or, you can fill your glass with your favorite beverage (keep more close by - maybe some munchies as well :D, sit back at your computer, tell your wife (or significant other) that you will see her in the morning and spend the next 10 or so hours reading through the postings.

No one on the forum gets mad if you ask a question that is a repeat. Please do not hesitate to post to the forum. All questions are considered important and those active on the forum will do their best to respond with a valid answer.

Also note we are not out to knock the Honda, Yamaha, Kipor or other brands of high end digital gensets. We recognize the quality of these products and their suitability for quite, efficient RV use. But, there is a flood of reliable, inexpensive and comparatively lower cost gensets coming out of China that are excellent alternative choices for the RVer wanting power to run an air conditioner, microwave, etc. without excessive noise or breaking the budget.

Oh, one last thing. The folks on this forum are true gentlemen. We do not flame one another or the product discussed - period. Ugly contributors usually have their comments and remarks ignored by our masses. It is not a forum to start arguments to obtain a clear win. We do disagree on many issues, but we have all agreed to do that in a respectable manner.

We now have the introduction of more and more inverter gensets. There is a rather extensive thread named "The Official Unofficial Champion 2000i Generator" on this forum. Today, I added info on the new Champion 3100i inverter genset. Discussion on this product may get moved to its own thread at a later date.

Many have looked upon this thread with distain saying Chinese is cheap and doomed to failure. I remember saying exactly the same thing about Japanese products a few decades back. But, over the past eight years the track record for Chinese built generators has shown otherwise.

Please, join us in a fascinating journey down the Chinese built genset road of knowledge.

This is the question I posted that got it all started back in March 2005.......

Randy

For a little over a month now, I have been somewhat intrigued by the availability of a 3000 watt, 6.5 HP generator at Pep Boys and Northern Tool for under $300.00. The engine on this generator looks identical to a Honda 6.5 HP OHV engine. Knowing that the Chinese have become very adept at “cloning” reputable technologies from other manufacturers, I was not surprised at the similarities. Neither store could give me any information on the generator nor did they have a “running” display model.

I have done a little research. This is what I have discovered:

Many of these generators are imported by ELIM International (www.eliminternational.com) out of Buffalo, New York from Jiung Manufacturing in China. (The unit at Northern is identical but carries the JIUNG name.)

The engines are indeed a Chinese knockoff of the popular 6.5 HP 196cc Honda Engine. “Supposedly” Honda has licensed the engine technology to the Chinese manufacturer of the product.

The Chinese company that makes the ELM3000 generators is a rather large, diverse, long-standing company with a reputation for “above average quality” Chinese made products (Jiung Manufacturing). There are many more Chinese companies making almost identical gensets.

The generators at PepBoys do have a six month limited warranty. But, it is only on the engine (not the generator) and requires paying for shipping to and from Buffalo. Probably not a very practical thing to do if you have warranty issues.

ELIM does supply replacement parts (a PDF parts manual is available on the ELIM web site). No prices are given for replacement parts nor is there an “availability listing”.

The generator head itself is a brushless design. The only really significant wear parts in the generator are the bearings – most likely universally available.

The published dB rating is 67 at 23 feet. This is “reasonably” quite for a generator of this size as most comparabl.... The 67 dB rating is the same as Honda gives their 3000 watt CycloInverter with a “look alike” eng...

[quabillion]

Say MrWizard, are you talking about the Honda line of inverter generators known as the EU series? You state "ui". Is this a typo, or some new model I havent yet heard of?

[MrWizard]

it is quieter than my champion
I have not done a side by side sound check YET, but i will

I will say that when running in efficiency mode doing nothing but powering my converter, the difference between HoneyWell & Honda is very small.

I don't have a Honda ui2000 for side by side, but i spent the week end at a large swap meet, where there where many Honda ui's both sizes 1000 & 2000 being used to power electronics & appliances & tools. and the difference between the HW 2000i and the Honda 2000ui, is very small, i can just hear the difference.

there was a large sound increase when running my MW or A/C, it will start the A/C compressor if 'efficiency mode' is OFF, but not if Ef is on,

and it just does carry the A/C, after the batteries were charged up, i ran the A/C for several hours, but the 120vac CCF lamps flickered while the A/C was running, they DON'T do this when running the A/C with the Champ or Onan, but the HW showed no signs of faltering.

the CCF lamps did NOT flicker when the A/C was off, only when the A/C was on, i figure the HW is right on the edge, and may not carry the A/C when the temp gets really hot 100+, it was in the mid 80's yesterday afternoon and i was in the sun.

[snarfattack]

How does it compare to the champion for sound levels? There is another thread on here talking about them, and it appears the db levels are about the same.

https://forums.trailerlifedirectory.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/22536733/srt/pa/pging/1/page...

[MrWizard]

got this at Home Depot Sunday evening







inverter
efficiency/Eco mode
1.5 gallon tank
very nicely done glossy manual
2100 watts peak
2000 continuous

so far I'm very impressed, i've been running it today,
vacuum cleaner, MW, even my roof A/C

regular price $499
sale price $299
out the door $326.60

I will do some videos with sound

[professor95]

kenper wrote:
Professor, the HF Genny you are asking about is the one I bought, right down to the typo under the switch where it says 110V-120V. The only thing selectable is the voltage measurement on the guage. This is the one I had to rewire.

Ahhh Sooooo.......... It all now makes sense! I did not realize you were working with a model that had such a different style alternator. The shape of the AVR, location of wires, brushes, etc. are indeeed different from what is considered by most of us old poots to be "3,000 Watt Chinese Genny Standard". I just could not connect the dots as I was "invisioning a Lion while you were looking at a Panther".

We need to keep an eye on you (actually your genny) to see how it performs over the longer term. Much new information with this model to be processed and analyzed.......

[Kenper]

professor95 wrote:

Kenper wrote:




I forgot to ask. If that is the adjuster, can it be adjusted while running or do you have to shut it off, adjust it, then restart it until you get it right?

YES.... The little brass screw will be the voltage adjustment. :B
Again, it is at least a 10 turn pot so changes will come slowly. You must do it with the generator running so you can see what the output voltage is. If the voltage increases, change the direction you turn the screw. Have no lo load on the generator. 125 volts is a nice target with no load. Hold the regulator by its edges. Be careful, there are high voltages under the cap so keep your hands away from the wires!

Let us know in two weeks what the outcome is. I am sure it will resolve your higher than desired voltage issue.

PS - with no regulator installed or a failed/defective regulator voltage will be about 165 to 175 - bad news!

I ended up not having to adjust it. Before I went out of town my wife spent the night in the RV while I was at work. She ran the Gen for about 4 hours. When I got back from vacation I loosened the regulator, started the genny and hooked up my voltmeter. It read 121.5 and has ever since. I guess it just had to break in. ???
Works great now. Thank you for all the help. I will probably hang around to find the best way to mount it on my 5th wheel now.


"Quote" "What gives? Has a Chinese company decided to break tradition and put out a generator that is not a copy of another Chinese copy? Humm, looks that way (other than the engine). Also looks as if this one is switch selectable for either full wattage output at 120 volts or 240 volts."


Professor, the HF Genny you are asking about is the one I bought, right down to the typo under the switch where it says 110V-120V. The only thing selectable is the voltage measurement on the guage. This is the one I had to rewire.

[professor95]

roadyacht wrote:
yes Prof.,
A new string for "fringe" thinking.
I do not know how, yet

OK. It is done and here

Now you need to take it and run with it.....

[rixhog]

Prof,
I would be interested in the alt. energy thread as well. Rick

[roadyacht]

yes Prof.,
A new string for "fringe" thinking.
I do not know how, yet

[professor95]

Jer&Ger wrote:
Just as a note, I was at my local Schuck's Auto today and they have the 3500 Champ on sale for $299 thru this weekend. Maybe someone might be interested....Jerry

An extremely good price. Thank you, Jerry. Hopefully someone reading this can take advantage of the deal.

Last year the CSK group did the same thing to clear out inventory. Then, they turned around and ordered it all back in new stock. Nice for CPE and nice for the customer. June 30 (not December 31) is the end of the fisical year for many companies and left over inventory is not good from a tax prespective. Right now it does not appear that there is a new, updated model ready to replace the current model in these stores. Thus, older models at a sale price will be just as good as newer models at the regular price.

Folks may find similar deals between now and July 1 at other stores and on additional pieces of equipment.

[professor95]

roadyacht wrote:
RE: sterlings of the '30's...those probably might have been full loss lubes, like the Harleys of a few years earlier. In other words, not of the tolerances,low friction metallurgy,faster boiling/cooling mixtures,....you get my point.
Dean Kane, the Mr.wizard of today, has one out there I believe, that runs on the methane produced by dung pits in the primitive wilderness, running l.e.d.s to give light to people that live in huts,along with water purification devices that require extremely limited maintenance.
And how about Winny!a hybrid Adventurer MH!
Yes, I do think low power requirements for lights,solar, collected AND STORED for hydronic heat, and garbage&plant detritus to brew fuel for penurious diesel applications(the original fuel was veg. oil)will come.
And we dreamers will have the first crude examples.
I have duct tape in my tool box.

Stirling engines and alternate energy sources are also an area I am extremenly interested in. But, before we get the hatchet from our moderator to take it elsewhere, why not go ahead and develop a new thread on the subject away from the Chinese generator thread?

If starting a thread is something you are not sure how to accomplish, let me know and I will be more than glad to get it set up. Keep in mind though for the thread to be successful and informative you will need to provide stewardship for keeping the topic focused and interesting.

Go for it!!!!!

[professor95]

oops, pressed the POST key too early. Text deleted and finished in the next post from me.

[roadyacht]

RE: sterlings of the '30's...those probably might have been full loss lubes, like the Harleys of a few years earlier. In other words, not of the tolerances,low friction metallurgy,faster boiling/cooling mixtures,....you get my point.
Dean Kane, the Mr.wizard of today, has one out there I believe, that runs on the methane produced by dung pits in the primitive wilderness, running l.e.d.s to give light to people that live in huts,along with water purification devices that require extremely limited maintenance.
And how about Winny!a hybrid Adventurer MH!
Yes, I do think low power requirements for lights,solar, collected AND STORED for hydronic heat, and garbage&plant detritus to brew fuel for penurious diesel applications(the original fuel was veg. oil)will come.
And we dreamers will have the first crude examples.
I have duct tape in my tool box.

[Jer_Ger]

Just as a note, I was at my local Schuck's Auto today and they have the 3500 Champ on sale for $299 thru this weekend. Maybe someone might be interested....Jerry

[professor95]

ol Bombero-JC wrote:
Prof -
Imagine how many (vehicle) engines would/could be destroyed when (if) the injection system is not properly maintained. ~
JC

Which is exactly why I did not carry the thread further.