My first solar installation, looking for direction

[Fisherguy]

We have a 27 foot Komfort trailer, so far I've ditched the WFCO converter and mounted a PD9280 under the front sofa and use it to charge the 2 - Crown CR-235 golf cart batteries I just put in, I also installed a Xantrex SW-600 inverter which is wired to an Iota transfer switch to all out AC outlets in the trailer. We use that to watch the 26" LCD TV and the satellite receiver, I like to watch the news and (unfortunately) my wife watches a couple soaps every day so in total I'd say we watch a max of 5 hours TV a day. We might watch the odd football or Canucks game as well. We shut down the inverter when the TV's not on.

The inverter and converter are wired to fuses in a weatherproof box on the trailer tongue with 7 ft of 4ga and from there I have a short piece of 2 ga to the batteries. I also have a Trimetric I use to monitor things and a Honda 2000 watt generator to charge the batteries, the shunt is in another weatherproof box on the tongue, we're in BC, we camp May to Sept right now, normally a 3 week trip in June and 3 weeks in Sept, but that will change next year when we'll be retired; we pretty much only dry camp, no hook ups. We make coffee on the stove in a percolator and make toast on the stove as well.

I'd like to install solar panels on the roof, the trailer was pre-wired with 8ga conductors from the fridge vent to the batteries, unfortunately the route they picked means means it's about a 40 ft run to the batteries. I'd like to be able to use this 8ga if possible, if not I could run heavier gauge down the fridge vent and under the trailer to come up again under the sofa at the front of the trailer where I'd like to mount the controller. Someone suggested I could tap into the existing 4 ga from the inverter to the batteries (through the fuse)

A few months ago I got a quote from NAWS for the following:
2-140 watt Kyocera panels, a Midnight Solar Kid 30 amp MPPT controller, Midnight solar combiner with breakers, Z mount brackets, and misc items totalling $1,025 US including shipping.
I'm not thrilled about Z brackets, have been of people making their own L brackets out of alum angle, I like that idea. I was told to wire the panels in series so I could get away with the 8ga I have pre-wired but I've also heard in series my output would really go down if part of 1 panel is shaded, is that true? Being in series means I need the MPPT.

I'm curios about the Solar Cynergy 120 watt panels, I can get 2 of them for the price of 1 Kyocera, they're made in India though, is anyone familiar with them? They're cheap enough maybe I can put 3 of them up there?
https://www.solarblvd.com/product_in...oducts_id=2714

Some have told me the MPPT controllers are a waste of money, that a person is better off with a PWM controller? Either way I'd like to be able to add a 3rd panel later if I need to.

My fishing partner installed a system similar to the one I got the quote for but he was sold a Morningstar Tristar 30 MPPT controller, he also has 4-Trojan 105's. His system worked great on our last trip, his wife watched a lotta TV while we were fishing and he never needed to run his generator once on the 3 week trip, we had a lotta sun that trip, it was hot and not cold enough at night he needed to run his furnace. I like the sound of that, no generator at all!

I can get a 315 panel for $320 US, it's basically 80" x 40", only place it would fit is on the rear left of the trailer, I figure the back is most likely to be in the shade?

I'd ship to Blaine and go pick it up, do that all the time.

I'm sure the system I was quoted would work well for me buy I'm just wondering if I could get away with something a little cheaper, specially with the lousy exchange rate for the Canadian dollar. I wonder why some panels cost twice as much as others, what controller should I use etc, do I need heavier wiring from the panels to the controller etc etc. Any advice for the first timer?
Thanks in advance
Will

[pianotuna]

Hi,

For the difference in price I'd go with the tristar 60 amp. Two reasons. The 60 has 3 'circuits' that run at 20 amps each, so it is a little more efficient=less heat. When you wish to expand, you won't have to replace the controller.

[grizzzman]

Fisherguy wrote:
Made some cardboard templates the size of the 120 watt panels at Solar Blvd, this is where I'll put them I think, would have room to add another in front of or beside the AC unit:



They told me they're getting some 150 watt panels in next week will be similarly sized to the 120's, asked them to send me more info when they get them in. 3 - 150's would be good me thinks.

Will run new 4ga wiring from the fridge vent to the controller, should be 20 to feet.


Thinking about the Tristar 45 PWM controller with remote or the Xantrex C35 with remote, any opinions on these controllers?

I would suggest the Tristar its much more adjustable. The Xantrex is old tech. Changing voltage is a pain and there are not time adjustments.

[Fisherguy]

Made some cardboard templates the size of the 120 watt panels at Solar Blvd, this is where I'll put them I think, would have room to add another in front of or beside the AC unit:



They told me they're getting some 150 watt panels in next week will be similarly sized to the 120's, asked them to send me more info when they get them in. 3 - 150's would be good me thinks.

Will run new 4ga wiring from the fridge vent to the controller, should be 20 to feet.


Thinking about the Tristar 45 PWM controller with remote or the Xantrex C35 with remote, any opinions on these controllers?

[Fisherguy]

pianotuna wrote:
I would choose panels based on cost per watt. Poly rather than mono.

Decide if it is a battery charger or supplying all energy needs, and size the wattage to meet the goal.

If supplying all needs consider using a 24 volt battery bank.

I'm not expecting the system to make enough power to run everything, I just want it to charge my batteries so I won't have to run the generator, or at least not run it as often.

[Fisherguy]

paddywanpeep wrote:

To someone doing his fist system I can tell you it's not THAT simple, there's hundreds of each kind of controller and prpbly a thousand different panels of various types, wire sizing, mounts, switches, breakers and fuses, connectors, not simple at all,

I appreciate Barry's help and advice, yours, not so much.

Sorry I have to disagree. I also was a first timer...if its thats difficult for you then maybe you should not attempt this project. Also I dont really care if you like what I said, I was talking to you anyway.

Maybe get a starter tent, then a popup etc... while you are at it

"I was talking to you anyway". :S

I'm asking for advice on my solar setup, if you don't have anything constructive to contribute why not just run along smart guy!

[pianotuna]

I would choose panels based on cost per watt. Poly rather than mono.

Decide if it is a battery charger or supplying all energy needs, and size the wattage to meet the goal.

If supplying all needs consider using a 24 volt battery bank.

[Fisherguy]

To someone doing his fist system I can tell you it's not THAT simple, there's hundreds of each kind of controller and prpbly a thousand different panels of various types, wire sizing, mounts, switches, breakers and fuses, connectors, not simple at all,

I appreciate Barry's help and advice, yours, not so much.

[paddywanpeep]

High potential here for a big change in situation, needs, and circumstances between next September's 3 week trip (this time with solar) and next year's who knows what when retired (as stated in the OP)

IMO (worth the usual 2 cents), it is time for a "learner set" of solar and then get the "real set" next year or later once the "real situation" is more clear. (The OP might even get a new RV so nailing down a bunch of new panels now would be regretted if that happened.)

It would be handy if the learner panels could be part of the real set later. One 24 or two 12s? Later with two 12s, they could be in series and that in parallel with a new 24. Or be part of a full set of four 12s. Lots of choices.

The big thing IMO is just get a cheapo controller off eBay for now to run the initial learner set this Fall, and then get the more expensive controller later on, when more is known.

I would say get the Solar30 for now, which does have a read out display for amps and volts. Part of the "learning" is to compare what is showing on the solar for amps with the Trimetric for amps, so you can get a feel for how much is battery and how much is load (Trimetric only shows battery, so subtract that from "solar amps" and that is your load amps)

So IMO go for a portable arrangement of panels, not nailed down on this RV, get the eBay controller, and then ponder the whole thing over the winter coming up and then decide on what's next.

What in the world is a 'learner set'? Solar is not that difficult so dont make it out to be more than it is, solar panels to a controller to batteries, done.

[time2roll]

Kid 30 looks MPPT and plenty of great features.
Priced just under the Tristar 30 amp MPPT.

[Fisherguy]

$160 + 118 (US) for the remote display at NAWS.
Manual says it Does equalize.

Tell me, what's the difference between this and the Midnite Solar Kid 30 amp they wanted to sell me?

The Tristar would work well with the panels mentioned above, 300 - 480 watts, 12volt panels?

I like this combiner box:

[time2roll]

45 amp Tristar does it all. Excellent controller.
270 must be Canadian? Since you have a monitor, consider skipping the display.

[Fisherguy]

Ya but my batteries are on the tongue, you guys in the 5th wheels sure have it easy when it comes to this kinda thing, somuch room to play with in the basement.
My 8ga goes down the fridge vent, across the stove to the undersink area, then back over to and up the firdge vent, out where the microwave is, then up into the ceiling and diagnally across to the furthest possible point in the trailer, down the wall, through the floor then over to where the factory DC fuses are under the underbelly then out to the batteries. If I was to use it I'd take cut and splice straight from the fridge vent to the microwave cupboard, that would shorten it by at least 10 feet, then at the front left where it goes down through the floor I'd take it and extend to the area under the sofa where the PD and inverter live, put the controller there.

What you think of the 45 Amp Tristar? With the remote it's about 270 but would leave room to grow..? (Don't think it equalizes though..?)

[BFL13]

My #8 from roof to battery box where the controller goes near there, is about 45 ft one way (you count two ways so that is 90 ft). It took the 130w's 8.2 amps with no loss, so it would also do the 230's or near that where the Vmp is about 8 amps or so with no real loss to an MPPT controller.

With a mid- kitchen instead of a rear kitchen trailer, the OP's distance must be less than ours by at least 10 ft.

Two 120w 12s in series or a single 240w or so, and the $102 (US) Eco W and you are good to go. When you can get a decent MPPT for that, you don't save much by going to PWM on the controller. Be different if you went to the $300 or twice that MPPTs out there, but you don't have to do that. And the Eco-W has the two adjustable voltages for Vabs and Float while the Solar30 has just the one adjustable voltage that is for both.

We do everything with a single 255w panel and the 20a Eco- W. But we have the 255 in a tilted tracker contraption, so it would be like maybe 355 flat depending on location and time of year.

[Fisherguy]

Didn't see that link but I bought my Trimetric in 2010. He mentioned the possibility of 25% off the 2030 but he said he'd think about it. You think that would be a good deal still, is the 2030 combo THAT good?


That might be sound advice Barry, but I doubt I'd have any better grasp on this solar stuff after a whole winter of reading the threads here than I do now! This is even more confusing than the converter threads! :?


Also had some interesting advice regarding the 40ft of 8 ga I have, I think I can shorten that by 10 feet BTW but running some 4ga isn't that big a deal, just hafta pull the fridge out (again), I had to change the cooling unit a couple years ago.

Thanks guys
Will