Too Heavy for E's Tires..either LRF/LRG or 17.5 tires

[wantabe351]

...On a Cat Scale my Montana axle weight is 12,655lbs with 7k axles(axle tag) but a tire limit of 6750lbs...My tires are the Goodyear Marathons 235/85-16e's....now after the third tire going bad.. last week was my third tire..tread is deformed from belt elongation...2011 Montana3400L with W/D and a Gen is heavy but not over weight(limit of 15,650lbs)..so when i get home Im going for all new tires I want a LRG tire but its hard to find a good tire,but going to a 17.5 rim/tire there a about 7 good brands to choose from..Now Herecules has a LRF and Kenda has a LRG and both are 235/85-16. the rims on the 5er are rated for 110psi so the rims i have will work.....any thoughts

[Tireman9]

As we all know it is the air that carries the load. Basically the more air volume (larger tire) and higher inflation pressure the higher the load capacity.

Now as we also know it is Heat that kills tires the faster rubber is "bent" through deflection the hotter it gets. A tire of size S and Load L at inflation pressure P will run hotter if it is run at speed 75 mph i.e. more bends per minute than when run slower say at 65 mph.

Now it is possible to vary L and/or P to achieve the same temperature when a tire is run at 75 as when at 65.

I do not understand the apparent confusion about these basic engineering principles.

If a tire company wants to provide a special 'non-standard" tire for a small special part of the tire market by using a "non-standard" set of Load, Pressure and Speed then I see no reason to be confused. I would think RV owners should be glad that a tire company made an effort to provide more options to the RV owner.

[Me_Again]

fj12ryder wrote:

Francesca Knowles wrote:
FYI:

Though perhaps reputed otherwise, the G614 is in fact a trailer tire, just without the dread "ST" label.

Even Goodyear itself only specifies it for trailer use. Try to get it to come up for any other application at this Goodyear tire selector link and you'll see what I mean. It is speed rated to 75, as are LT's. Plus it has that magic "LT" thing goin' on in the name...somewhere...

A triumph of marketing, eh? 😉

That's like the Sailun tire, listed as an LT tire, but "For Trailer Use Only" molded into the sidewall. Go figure. I have them and they seem to be fine so far.

If following the industry standard load ratings for LT tires is magic, so be it. However both the G614 and Sailun S637 LT235R85R16G follow industry standard weight ratings for passenger carrying tires, unlike the junk ST tires with inflated ratings that manufacturers stick unknowing trailer buyers with.

Geostar and Kenda both make poly ply carcass LRG tires in this same LT235/85R16G size. Both of these also follow industry load rating standards for LT tires and have service descriptions. Thus are not restricted to trailer service.

Chris

[fj12ryder]

Francesca Knowles wrote:
FYI:

Though perhaps reputed otherwise, the G614 is in fact a trailer tire, just without the dread "ST" label.

Even Goodyear itself only specifies it for trailer use. Try to get it to come up for any other application at this Goodyear tire selector link and you'll see what I mean. It is speed rated to 75, as are LT's. Plus it has that magic "LT" thing goin' on in the name...somewhere...

A triumph of marketing, eh? 😉

That's like the Sailun tire, listed as an LT tire, but "For Trailer Use Only" molded into the sidewall. Go figure. I have them and they seem to be fine so far.

[Me_Again]

MNRon wrote:
Me Again - Checked my poor memory by just looking at the tires...again 🙂

They are RH, and the date code is only 1yr old, not 3. So hopefully I've got quite a few miles and years still ahead of me, and also hopefully Carlisle got it right this time.

Lots of people are hanging their hats on this Nylon overlay, and we still read a lot about Tow Max(added the overlay in recent years) and Marathon failures. Both of these are more widely used on RV trailers, as they are standard fair from Tredit. http://www.tredittire.com/Radial-Tires-C8.aspx

So best of luck with them and keep us informed.

Chris

[MNRon]

Me Again - Checked my poor memory by just looking at the tires...again 🙂

They are RH, and the date code is only 1yr old, not 3. So hopefully I've got quite a few miles and years still ahead of me, and also hopefully Carlisle got it right this time.

[Me_Again]

MNRon wrote:
Does anyone else have Carlisle RH LRF tires? They have a ST235/85R16 with 3960 capacity. Our current 5er came with these tires (~3yr old) a few months ago. So far, so good; but I don't have a lot of experience with them.

I wrote Carlisle inquiring about their poor past and they replied the RH tires introduced a few years ago are significantly better than the prior ST tires they had, and they have not seen issues with them. Any unbiased users with experiences good/bad with their RH F tires? If the tires really are good it opens up another option for this often floated question.

Until they have more miles under them, it is an unanswered question. At 3 years old you are at the beginning of the manufacturers stated end of life cycle.

From Carlisle's web site:
– 3 to 5 years is the average life expectancy of a trailer tire,regardless of mileage.

That is a wide spread, which is it 3 years or 5 years? Does a prudent person assume 3 years?

The improvements that they talk about was the addition of a Nylon overlay in the plies. Note: Goodyear added a similar overlay years ago to their Marathon ST tire lineup.

At 44.8 lbs they are still much lighter than say the GY G614 that weighs in at 57.5 pounds. You still have a ST tire that has the inflated ratings basic on the speed restriction. Carlisle has been providing misinformation about the Radial RH and the ST speed restriction to attract the bass boat boys, claiming no speed restriction other than the posted speed limit. I believe they are now correcting the misinformation, sort of!!

Again from their wed site:
– Best practice. Do not exceed 60 mph while towing a trailer.
– Most ST trailer tires have a maximum speed rating of 65 mph.

So where is the jury? Still out and on your trailer. If your tires are 3 years old are you sure the say Radial RH on the sidewall?



Chris

[MNRon]

Does anyone else have Carlisle RH LRF tires? They have a ST235/85R16 with 3960 capacity. Our current 5er came with these tires (~3yr old) a few months ago. So far, so good; but I don't have a lot of experience with them.

I wrote Carlisle inquiring about their poor past and they replied the RH tires introduced a few years ago are significantly better than the prior ST tires they had, and they have not seen issues with them. Any unbiased users with experiences good/bad with their RH F tires? If the tires really are good it opens up another option for this often floated question.

[JIMNLIN]

Me Again wrote:

Francesca Knowles wrote:
FYI:

Though perhaps reputed otherwise, the G614 is in fact a trailer tire, just without the dread "ST" label.

Even Goodyear itself only specifies it for trailer use. Try to get it to come up for any other application at this Goodyear tire selector link and you'll see what I mean. It is speed rated to 75, as are LT's. Plus it has that magic "LT" thing goin' on in the name...somewhere...

A triumph of marketing, eh? 😉

The G614 at 57.5 pounds has little in common with the 35.4 pound GY Marathon. It does not appear to carry a service description like many LT tires do. And the side wall is branded for trailer service only.

Even the Michelin XPS RIB with much has a service description of 115 Q or 120 Q depending on size, when viewed via Michelin RV tire site carries a 75 MPH speed restriction.

Chris

To: goodyear_cr@goodyear.com
cc:
Subject: Contact Us request from www.goodyear.com

Your G614 RST advertising says its a LT235/85-16 G tire. However what does
the RST stand for ?? Some folks say its just another ST trailer tire or
RST = radial special trailer. Thanks
**************************************************************

From: goodyear_cr@goodyear.com on 05/07/2014 02:38 PM

Sent by: Goodyear Tire & Rubber Company Consumer Relations 728 200
Innovation Way Akron, OH 44316-0001 Voice #: 800.321.2136 Fax #:
330.796.6829

Thank you for contacting our web site. RST for "Regional Service Trailer"
is correct.

Jennifer - Consumer Relations

[Lowsuv]

fj12ryder
the trick question is :
Name all of the common tires placarded " for trailer usage only " that are rated for 75 mph .
Not " or more " .
Not " or less " .
There are only two that I am aware of .
The most common is the Goodyear G614 .

[Me_Again]

Francesca Knowles wrote:
FYI:

Though perhaps reputed otherwise, the G614 is in fact a trailer tire, just without the dread "ST" label.

Even Goodyear itself only specifies it for trailer use. Try to get it to come up for any other application at this Goodyear tire selector link and you'll see what I mean. It is speed rated to 75, as are LT's. Plus it has that magic "LT" thing goin' on in the name...somewhere...

A triumph of marketing, eh? 😉

The G614 at 57.5 pounds has little in common with the 35.4 pound GY Marathon. It does not appear to carry a service description like many LT tires do. And the side wall is branded for trailer service only.

Even the Michelin XPS RIB with much has a service description of 115 Q or 120 Q depending on size, when viewed via Michelin RV tire site carries a 75 MPH speed restriction.

Chris

[Francesca_Knowl]

FYI:

Though perhaps reputed otherwise, the G614 is in fact a trailer tire, just without the dread "ST" label.

Even Goodyear itself only specifies it for trailer use. Try to get it to come up for any other application at this Goodyear tire selector link and you'll see what I mean. It is speed rated to 75, as are LT's. Plus it has that magic "LT" thing goin' on in the name...somewhere...

A triumph of marketing, eh? 😉

[fj12ryder]

Lowsuv wrote:
G614's are unique in that they are rated for 75 mph .
They are the one exception that is a trick question in the " Tire Wars " threads that occur from time to time around here .
I have LT265/75R16 LRE snow tires mounted on my stock 6.5 " width GM aluminum wheels .
I have been doing that for 17 years now on my last 2 pickups .
It is common practice around here because the factory 245 / 75 are not enough tire .
Works fine .

Unique in what way? They are LT tires and many of those are rated to 75 mph or more.

"They are the one exception..." One exception to what?

[Tireman9]

wantabe351 wrote:
...On a Cat Scale my Montana axle weight is 12,655lbs with 7k axles(axle tag) but a tire limit of 6750lbs...My tires are the Goodyear Marathons 235/85-16e's....now after the third tire going bad.. last week was my third tire..tread is deformed from belt elongation...2011 Montana3400L with W/D and a Gen is heavy but not over weight(limit of 15,650lbs)..so when i get home Im going for all new tires I want a LRG tire but its hard to find a good tire,but going to a 17.5 rim/tire there a about 7 good brands to choose from..Now Herecules has a LRF and Kenda has a LRG and both are 235/85-16. the rims on the 5er are rated for 110psi so the rims i have will work.....any thoughts

Looks like you made the same error most RV owners so. Assuming the load on your tires is perfectly balanced 50/50 axle to axle and also perfectly balanced side to side 50/50 on each axle. In reality your loads are probably closer to 45/55 or at least 47/53 so if you choose the better case one axle has 53% of 12,655 or do the math and we see 6,707 and with one side at 55% we calculate 3,354#.
I find an ST235/85R16 LR-E Power King Towmax that is rated at 3520# Max at 80 PSI Min with a MAX speed of 65 MPH. If your trailer is better balanced than many per example above you only have a 166# margin, which is a long way from the suggested 15% ( 528#)

It is STRONGLY suggested you re-weigh the trailer with everything you normally carry (MAXIMUM LOAD) and follow the instructions HERE to calculate the individual tire load.

Also are you using a Digital pressure gauge that you have tested to be sure it is correct? I have posts on my blog identifying thea approximately 10 to 15% of the gauges I have tested are more than 5 psi off. 5 psi in your tire size is worth 160# capacity.

Note it is not unusual to have one tire carrying almost 1,000# more that the lightest loaded tire so my example above is conservative.

You can learn more about the special problems with multi-axle trailer tire application on my blog post of 11/20/13

[Lowsuv]

G614's are unique in that they are rated for 75 mph .
They are the one exception that is a trick question in the " Tire Wars " threads that occur from time to time around here .
I have LT265/75R16 LRE snow tires mounted on my stock 6.5 " width GM aluminum wheels .
I have been doing that for 17 years now on my last 2 pickups .
It is common practice around here because the factory 245 / 75 are not enough tire .
Works fine .

[tomthyme]

fj12ryder wrote:
No, the G614's are G-rated LT tires and are rated for higher than 65 mph. AFAIK all ST tires are rated for 65 mph.

Great...thanks