Breakdown Information

[Badeye]

Moderators Note: This thread is intending to report a problem and its resolution. If you are seeking help or information to help you resolve a problem you would best be served by initiating a thread on the class A forum proper

After some conversation with Diesel-Lover and others on this forum I thought I would try to start a thread concerning breakdowns on the road. We try to prevent this by good maintenance and driving reasonably but it can still happen. As I observed in a previous post, on a roughly 350 mile northbound drive on I-75 I saw 4 class A MH broken down. All were southbound.

If we should have a breakdown and would post the following information on this thread it could be a resource and reminder for others.

RV particulars:
Driveline (Engine, Transmission):
Miles:
Year:
Break Down Description: (You can add any description of the problem here that you think would help others in understanding the situation and problem.)
Symptoms:
Effect:
Cause:
Outcome:

This is the type of information that is recorded in the aircraft industry and other maintenance activities to track failure trends. It will take a while before we see a lot of value in this. If it continues for a time and sufficient data is available, I will analyze the data and put it into a form that I can send by email to any interested parties. I would suspect that an initial report could be done in about three months or when we have about 100 to 150 cases.

What do you think?

[bisgaard]

RV particulars: National RV Tropical T370 on a Freighliner Chassis
Driveline: Caterpillar C7, Allison MH3000
Miles: 8600
Year: 2004
Break Down Description: Motor stalled while in motion & would not re-start
Symptoms: Freighliner info center on the dash called out loss of communications with the engine, trans, & ABS ECUs (Electronic Control Units)
Effect: No motor, transmision, ABS, or power steering (off or not working)
Cause: Broken wire from battery to relays powering motor/trans/ABS computers
Outcome: Just after cresting the Grapevine on northbound I-5, we lost all power to the coach & came to a grinding halt at the bottom of the Frazier Park Rd exit. The Freightliner dash readout told a tale of lost communications between the various computers that run the show & gave me that sinking feeling I was in for a long evening.

After a call to a very competent Coach Net operator, she had Jim’s Towing of Bakersfield with an appropriate rig to tow me the 60 miles or so to Freightliner’s Bakersfield Truck Center. The tow truck arrived within the 30 minutes allotted by California Highway Patrol for vehicles blocking critical off-ramps.

In Bakersfield, the Freightliner mechanic zeroed in on the relays that feed the transmission/motor/ABS computers & traced the relay’s wire back to the chassis battery where he found a break under the insulation. He popped a new lug on it & we where on our way to Yosemite, only losing one day off our schedule.

It’s a little disconcerting that all it took was a minor electrical break to effectively shut down the motor, transmission, and ABS. And although the airbrakes worked, power steering also stopped when the motor did!

Check your battery connections, it doesn’t take much to completely kill your rig’s systems & possibly leave you muscling it to a stop on a twisting road!

Kudos to Coach Net, Jim’s Towing, & Bakersfield Truck Center for minimizing the pain on this trip

[calibrator]

During this last Easter Break, Gramma and I (Gramps) decided to take our 7 year old grandson (lives with us) to Disney Land as a surprise and reward for doing so well in school. just prior to cresting the Grapevine (I-5 in So Cal) I got a red warning light that said "Engine Warning" followed shortly by a yellow caution light that said "Shut Engine Down Now". Being a professional pilot I regarded the lights and my location and decided to push on at a slower speed looking for a good place to pull over. It's lucky for us that a good wide shoulder was available right away, so I pulled over as the engine quit on it's own. Did I mention this was our first real outing in the Leviathan (gramma does not like the name I gave it so I refer to it as Levi now)After sitting there quietly for a minute to contemplate our fate, I then checked all the fluid levels and looked for leaks. Finding nothing obviously wrong I did what every good pilot will do and tried to restart the failed engine. The restart went well, no warning lights, pressures and temps good. So we pulled back out into traffic and remained in the right lane. About 30 seconds later the lights reappeared and I headed for a Truck Break area. I now knew I had only 30 seconds to shut the engine off or the engine computer would do it for me. We made it into the off ramp for the area before the engine shut down. I waited for a few seconds and restarted the engine and limped at 5mph into the parking area. Called the dealer who gave me info on the closest Cummins repair location (Ventura) and GS ERS. Three hours later a big red big rig tow truck pulled up. Other than a four hour ride in the tow truck to the Cummins lot (no suspension in the back seat area) the rescue went relatively smooth. We spent that Friday, Sat and Sunday in the Cummins lot. We had called them with our problem and they were very accommodating. Gave us the combination to the lock on the gate, had a 50amp hook up and water bib for us to use while we waited for them to open on Monday. We left there Tuesday at 1:00pm headed for Disney Land.

Well that's the story minus some details of vacationing in Ventura. So here are the particulars:

'02 CC Intrigue 40' TS, TAG
370 ISL, Allison Trans
8400 miles (like new)
ENG WARNING AND SHUT ENGINE DOWN NOW LITES
ENGINE POWER DECLINE AND ENGINE SHUT DOWN
LOW PRESSURE SWITCH FAILED (telling eng comp that there was low oil pressure)
REPLACED $18 SWITCH WITH UPGRADED SWITCH AND WIRE HARNESS (still under warranty, thank God)

Made it home without incidents, had a great time at Disney Land

[mombum]

Changed coaches. RV particulars: 275HP Cummins, 4 sp Allison. '00 Winnebago Journey, 24K miles. Engine starting sometimes erratic (got coach 10 May 05 in Huntsville) thought it batteries since they wouldn't hold a charge. (There were other little irritations too that should not have been present in a coach just off the dealer's lot. Caveat Emptor is alive and well!). Went to Charlotte for NASCAR, 05/30; left there going South on I-77 and stopped for lunch at Cracker Barrel north of Coulmbia, SC. Engine wouldn't turn over, plenty of battery fire.
Spent two days on parking lot (long story) before being towed to Cummins Atlantic in Columbia. Diagnosis: loose ignition switch shorting out starter. Some mentally handicapped employee didn't see the need to tighten the switch at the dealership. Won't be returning to nor recommending them to anyone. Along with my time and anguish I spent $886 including tow. I'm asking for it to be reimbursed but not holding my breath; will keep you informed.

[mrscaintex]

RV particulars: National Tradewinds Founders Edition LTC
Driveline (Engine, Transmission): 350 Cummins Diesel
Miles: 9 k
Year: 2002
Break Down Description/Symptoms:

Break down #1: Starter went out 2 weeks after purchase. The engine would not turn over at all but made a clicking noise. Had towed to Austin and repaired by Freightliner.

Break down #2: 2 months after purchase rv started sputtering while on the highway. Had the pedal pushed all the way to the floor but could not get past 30 mph. It acted like it was not getting any gas. We pulled over and turned off the RV and waited (while trying to decide what to do). We tried cranking it again and it turned over and worked like nothing happened.

Effect: Originally told it was the fuel filter was clogged.
Cause: Unknown if it had caused any other damage.
Outcome: Fuel sensor went out.

We found out the original owners of the RV had to have the fuel pump replaced while in their posession. Don't know if that would have any effect on the fuel sensor or not.

Anyone else who owns a Founders Edition experience any problems?

[Herb40]

RV particulars: 1996 Beaver Monterey
Driveline (Engine, Transmission): CAT 3126 300 hp, Allison 3060
Miles: 40,000 or so
Year: 2003
Break Down Description:
Symptoms: clanging noise from right rear
Effect: MH still drove OK and brakes worked. Slowed down and drove to nearest city (Forrest City, AR). Parked at Wal-Mart (Sunday). Called Good Sam ERS, and agreed to wait until next day for assistance. They sent rep. from White Motor Co. We drove MH to White's shop.
Cause: They found bolt holding right rear disk brake assembly in place had sheared off.
Outcome: White drilled out broken bolt and installed replacement. Bolt and repair kit (shims, etc.) had to be ordered out of Memphis. That took one more day. Total cost: $363.20, plus motel.

[metalmangler]

"...Chassis battery's runs down.

Outcome: Replace battery's (less than a year old, Interstate batterys, would not hold a charge.)"

Batteries less than a year old not holding a charge? That's a symptom, not a cause, even if it caused something else in turn. You'll be doing this in about a year (or less) again, unless you can isolate & correct what causes it.

[GotTheBug]

1994 Coachman Santara
190 Cummins
Hard to start.
Chassis battery's runs down.

Outcome: Replace battery's (less than a year old, Interstate batterys, would not hold a charge.)

Outcome: secondary fuel filter ( the small one) is hard to get to, who ever put it on must have pinched the gasket and was leaking.

Just bought this unit

[gullbreezer]

to FredC. What Rv do you put those 235/80 tires on? Do you still carry a spare, and what do you cover the spare with? Mine has traveled about 4,000 miles hanging from the frame rails, just behind the fuel tank and in front of the rear axle. It looks like new, and in fact, is.

[mrwebman]

RV particulars: Gulf Stream Tourmaster
Driveline (Engine, Transmission): 300HP Cummins, Allison MD3060
Chassis: Spartan
Miles: 49,000
Year: 1993
Break Down Description: Allison electronic shifter control went blank and the engine would not restart after being shut off.
Symptoms: Self-shifted into neutral when going down the road then the shifter's digital display went blank
Effect: Stranded on the side of Interstate 95 in extremely heavy traffic causing $950 tow job and parts replacement that extended warranty company would NOT pay for.
Cause: The transmission Electronic Control Unit (ECU) became intermittent. It was mostly blank but would occasionally flash. The ECU is powered by dedicated positive and negative wires all the way back to the battery. Those wires were checked, batteries were changed (long shot), the ignition switch was changed (another long shot), the two fuses in the Vehicle Interface Module (VIM) were checked.

I found a place on the internet called TKT Sales and called them. The owner, Ted Keating, was extremely helpful - walking me through checks on the ECU with my voltmeter. Because battery voltage and ignition voltage were present right at the ECU but yet the ECU was blank, I ordered a used ECU from him and it fixed the problem. It cost me $900 versus the $2500 plus $500 programming fee that a local shop wanted for a new one.

If you have an Allison transmission be sure to write this info down now in case you need them beside the road somewhere like I did. His e-mail address is ted@tktsales.com or you can contact him through his website at http://tktsales.com. Tel: (267)716-7332.

And by the way, I have nothing to do with TKT Sale except being a happy customer!

Please note that if you have extended warranty coverage through Interstate StarRV, then you basically have no coverage. They say they would cover my transmission but they will not cover the ECU. They cover the wiring harness but not the ECU. Their contract is worded such that there's probably no way they'll have to pay me for anything.

I also learned something else. If you have a Class A diesel pusher and you have a chassis problem it's almost impossible to get assistance in many places throughout the country. Those RV service centers that you see everywhere will NOT be able to help you - they work on toilets and window shades, etc. And, even if you have an extended warranty, you had better keep about $5,000 or more on reserve for emergency repairs! Our last trip cost us a little over $3700 in repairs, parts, and towing expenses alone!

Cheers,
Dennis

[CA_Traveler]

RV particulars: Holiday Rambler Endeavor
Driveline (Engine, Transmission): 330 Cummins 04 Pegagus Engine, Allison 3000
Miles: 12,000
Year: 2004
Break Down Description: Lost all power on a downgrade, black smoke pouring out of exhaust. Idle OK. Pulled over to side and limped 2 miles to rest stop. Decided it was the Pacbrake and wired the air cylinder open. After this I learned that I could just turn off the Pacbrake and proceed.
Symptoms: Power loss and black smoke
Effect: Safety issue as the first time it happened in heavy Interstate traffic with almost no shoulder.
Cause: The cause is the Pacbrake, either the physical Pacbrake itself or the electronics that controls the Pacbrake or possibly the air solenoid (Pacbrake said this was unlikely).
Outcome: Intermittent problem that Cummins could not find (just tested the Pacbrake). It failed 3 more times in the next 600 miles. Then I added temporary wiring and a voltmeter to isolate to an electronic failure or the air solenoid/Pacbrake and it has not failed in the last 500 miles since adding the voltmeter. Incidentally this is not a Cummins part or warranty item. Monaco installed this part with the full cooperation and agreement of Cummins and Allison but it is a Monaco warranty item.

I also learned that the Cummins Medford, OR shop is not trained to test the Pacbrake. They failed to do a major but very easy test, namely disconnect the air cylinder and physically move the butterfly valve to check for binding. They also billed Monaco for almost 3 hours for a 15 minute test. OK, I'd give them a hour as I repeated all of their tests in under a hour at home.

[Fishreed]

Griff in Fairbanks wrote:
For everyone with a Dodge gasoline, especially older models:

Carry a spare ballast resistor. Most are rectangular white ceramic, roughly 1" wide and 4" to 5" long, with two electrical connectors and a single mounting screw. Unlike voltage regulators and starter relays, ballast resistors are not grounded and may be mounted on nonconducting material such as plastic.

The ballast resistor reduces voltage to the coil, thereby increasing sparkplug life. The starting circuit bypasses the ballast resistor, resulting in a hotter spark when starting.

Symptoms of a bad ballast resistor: Your vehicle fires while you hold the key in the start position (because of the bypass) and dies as soon as you let go of the key (because in the run position, current is supplied to the coil through the ballast resistor).

I haven't bought one in a while but I seem to recall that my spares were less than $20.

As an emergency fix, you can connect the two electrical leads together but doing so will shorten the life of your sparkplugs and other ignition components.

I first encountered this problem on my '77 Dodge B200 van, purchased new and well maintained. My 1970 Explorer motorhome, on a 1969 Dodge M300 chassis, also has a ballast resistor but hasn't needed a new one yet.

The bad ballast resistor kept my van from going anywhere and frustrated me because I couldn't figure out what was wrong. (I'm a fairly good mechanic with extensive knowledge of the electrical systems in older vehicles - I can draw most of the typical wiring diagrams from memory.) A friend suggested I check the ballast resistor, saving me the expense of a tow. (I bought him a case of his favorite beer in thanks.)

I've heard of enough similar experiences from other people to convince me to always carry a spare. I haven't heard of any going out while the vehicle is moving although I imagine it's possible. All of the cases I've heard of showed up while trying to start the vehicle, leading me to believe a current spike during shutdown or starting cause the ballast resistor to fail.

Hope this helps someone.

Those new platinium plugs can take a lot of juice. Have you tried a new set of Bosch's plus 4 platiniums?

[metalmangler]

IIAFFI wrote:
Thursday, April 14, 2005 I took my '95 Bounder to our mechanic and asked him to change all the belts on the motor (Chev 454) "I am headed to Vegas thru the desert next week and don't want any surprises". Done.
April 17, 2005 while driving to Vegas from Los Angeles on I15 at Yermo, no power steering, no alternator voltage, etc) pulled off the freeway and (SURPRISE!) found the alternator belt broken. $391 to tow it to Barstow, $120 to replace the belt and a seven hour delay in my trip to Las Vegas -- it was Sunday afernoon and I figure I was lucky to get it fixed even if it did take 7 hours.
I'm contemplating doing NO PREVENTIVE MAINTENANCE FROM NOW ON.

I noticed you've already been told "if it ain't broke--don't fix it." I respectfully beg to differ. To my untrained ear this sounds more like a case of "you get what you INspect--not what you EXpect."

I have read it opined here (by many) that doing the belts on a 454 in a MH isn't an entry-level job. That may be. But, it's obviously a job there's a way to do *right* and several ways to do wrong (while taking somebody's money for it anyway). Might it pay you to acquire the proper tools and educate yourself how to do this one right, yourself? I wish you success in straightening it out--tools in hand or otherwise.

[buchrob]

RV particulars: Safari 38 foot 1996
Driveline (Engine, Transmission): Cat 3126B / Allison 6
Miles: 61800
Year: 1996
Break Down Description: High-pressure injector pump blew an oil system O-ring.
Symptoms: Engine stopped dead by control computer after spraying 19 qts of oil out the back radiator over a leisurely few hours.
Effect: Dead in the water, but no major damage.
Cause: A 29-cent piece of round rubber went bad, causing $3200 worth of expensive diagnostic and preventative work.
Outcome: Back in service, but now paranoid about oil and other fluid levels.

[Billdh435]

I guess the old saying was true in this case; if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

[IIAFFI]

Thursday, April 14, 2005 I took my '95 Bounder to our mechanic and asked him to change all the belts on the motor (Chev 454) "I am headed to Vegas thru the desert next week and don't want any surprises". Done.
April 17, 2005 while driving to Vegas from Los Angeles on I15 at Yermo, no power steering, no alternator voltage, etc) pulled off the freeway and (SURPRISE!) found the alternator belt broken. $391 to tow it to Barstow, $120 to replace the belt and a seven hour delay in my trip to Las Vegas -- it was Sunday afernoon and I figure I was lucky to get it fixed even if it did take 7 hours.
I'm contemplating doing NO PREVENTIVE MAINTENANCE FROM NOW ON.