Buying a Former Rental Class C. How many of us out there?

[IAMICHABOD]

While researching these pages for my next Motor Home I saw a few threads discussing Rentals, most were Pros and Cons but very few posts from people who had purchased one.

I thought it may be a good resource and helpful to hear from these people. The good, the bad, what they liked and what they didn’t. Also if they had any problems, things they changed, if they would recommend this to others or do it again.

Here is my story: I am not a novice, having owned a Class A for more than 15 years and doing the camping thing with my wife and two daughters, I can say “been there done that” But life changes, and I sold everything so I have been away from this for several years. Starting over I lurked here for a while and got a lot of good insight then went looking.

My criteria was: A Class C within by budget, less than 30 feet so I can keep it at home, saving storage $, a rear bed, and a lot of storage space.

What fit that was Winnebago, Fleetwood and a few others, what I found mostly was Jamboree / Tioga 26Q. In the year models 2002 thru 2006. I did my home work looking at NADA and other sites to find the fair prices for the models that I was looking for.

After several months of searching the internet, Craigslist, private ads and Dealerships for a Class C that suited my budget and needs, this is what I found. Of the dozen or so I inquired about.Most were upsidedown in their payments, owing more than they were worth. All were on Ford Chassis, 7 needed tires, all had the original 7 to 10 year old tires, and they all needed repair of the awning and most needed some work inside or out and the maintenance records were sketchy, but most had low mileage. The Dealerships offerings were better but they had a profit margin to maintain so I got older models within my budget or huge up sales that didn’t work for me.

My next step was looking at the rental market for sales. In my area there are 2 large companies that have rental sales, Cruise America and El Monte RV,who also sell Class A RVs.

First up was El Monte RV Their units are production RVs that are made by major manufactures, with TV antennas and hookups inside and out, Ducted A/C and heat, 2 house batteries, a rear ladder and parts are readily available from those manufacture’s. I looked at their web site and it detailed their warranty and what was checked and serviced by their factory trained technicians. The unit I looked at was like new inside, the upholstery on all the seats was new as was the floor mat in the driver’s area, it had a new mattress, still in plastic and a new bedspread. All of the curtains were new also. Newer (2010 mfg date) tires with 98% rubber and the mileage was ninety thousand (90,000).

Then there was Cruise America: Their units that I looked at seemed to be Spartan,no TV antenna or hookups for one,non-ducted A/C,small counter space and only one battery, no rear ladder for inspection and maintenance of roof and built just for them, they were all “refreshed” their words not mine. They offered extended warranties at a huge cost. All had high mileage, one hundred and thirty thousand (130,000) or more and the price range seemed a little high. The sales staff had a take it or leave it attitude and were not very forthcoming when asked about maintenance records and service,they claim to have proprietary info in those records,It doesn't seem to be a problem for El Monte RV.

At El Monte RV I took a test ride; This Unit was a 2006 Tioga 26Q on a Chevrolet Chassis it rode
Drove and handled much better than the Fords that I had driven. It also had more leg room and was quieter. We got back and I asked about the service and maintenance on it, the salesman, Joey, handed me a 28 page single spaced document asked if I wanted some coffee or something to drink and said “read this and if you have any questions I will answer them”.

It detailed everything that was done before and after each rental, the mileage, generator hours and hours billed. Each time it was washed and detailed inside and outside, all fluids were checked and replenished if needed, the holding tanks were washed, LP system was checked for leaks, all torque on wheel lugs were checked, brakes front and rear checked for wear and cracks, pressure in tires, all appliances, generator oil, lights inside and outside, the list goes on and on.

It also listed all oil changes,coolant change,trans service,fuel injector service and cleaning,fuel filters,air filter, new brakes, all repairs and replacements all with date, mileage and time spent in complete detail from day one to when it was pulled from the rental fleet and was refurbished. I have a complete service record on this vehicle.Also the service records on the Onan Generator,all oil changes,air filter and spark plug replacement with hours and date. I negotiated a good deal with them and am very happy with my purchase.

It came with a 1 yr. 12000 mile power train warranty and 30 day on all appliances. It also came with a 28 page maintenance record that detailed everything. Also the original sales packet from Fleetwood with the manual and serial numbers on all appliances,refrigerator, microwave,furnace, AC, water heater, etc. and the manual for the Chassis. I have had no problems with it so far.

(ON EDIT) 5 Years and close to 14000 miles.Just Scheduled Maintenance and new tires,old ones were at the 5 year mark and I wanted new Michelin LTX M/S2s.

There were a few things that it didn’t have as it was a rental and the ones from private parties did have.
• Power steps, outside Stereo/CD don’t need or want them.
• An Awning, this I wanted and had installed. A Swivel Seat and a new Window in The Door that I installed.
• Wheel Simulators, I like the looks so I had them installed and at the same time had Tire Man valve stem kit put on.
• Replaced the Chinese WFCO with a US Made converter/charger
• It came with mini blinds and not the day/night that most have, these are more practical and have a lot less failure.

• It also came with Stainless Steel sinks,easier to maintain than the cheap plastic ones that come in the noncommercial units.
  

I am very happy with my Rig, it suites my needs and it was in my Budget range, I think I got a good deal.

So if you bought a rental please share your experience here for others to use as a resource.
Or if there are any other questions that have not been covered in these pages, just ask, there are many helpful people on this thread.

[Mocoondo]

RetiringSomeDay wrote:
Quick question to those of you who have bought a CA rental. I was looking at their current line up and noticed the AC is non-ducted. As I live in Florida, I am curious as to how well that would work in our temperature and humidity on the longer model.

The installed air conditioner is more than adequate for the 28A. The thing I would be more concerned with is that most of the current for sale units will be equipped with Carrier air conditioners. The Carrier is a great air conditioner, but parts are now virtually impossible to come by. CA switched to Dometic for a few years with an integrated furnace/ac wall mounted t-stat. CA chose the Coleman Mach for the 2015 build.

I personally feel that the Colemans are the best. The good news is that if a Carrier unit ever fails, the Coleman Mach is a direct replacement. Just bolt it on and go.

[RetiringSomeDay]

Quick question to those of you who have bought a CA rental. I was looking at their current line up and noticed the AC is non-ducted. As I live in Florida, I am curious as to how well that would work in our temperature and humidity on the longer model.

[John___Angela]

We bought an ex-rental. Seems to me it had around 60 to 80K on it. (Can't remember exactly as it was 7 years ago. It now has 180K and going strong. No real problems. It was nicely equipted but no thermal windows and no awning. We have since added everything from flatscreen to awning, inverter, a whack of solar, aluminum wheels, upgraded the suspension b;ah blah. Peeled all the decals off. Painted the bottom in grey rock guard. I like it naked. 🙂 Who needs decals. 🙂 Should be good for another 10 or 12 years.

[Mich_F]

You could just as likely (perhaps more likely) have problems dropping in to a dealers lot and heading out on a long (or any length) trip with a brand new motor home.
To me it makes more sense picking whatever you want and go on a few short test runs/trips to test everything out, before heading out on any long excursions.

[Mocoondo]

donrebyct wrote:
Hi Again,

Would any of you owners take a retired rental class C off the dealer lot and drive to Alaska?

Why would you be concerned driving to Alaska? It's not like you are going to the moon. Chances are, your RV has already been there.

[donrebyct]

Hi Again,

Would any of you owners take a retired rental class C off the dealer lot and drive to Alaska? I'm wondering if it would be feasible and practical, and if I could have the confidence to do this. I'm thinking about, if I bought one, to fly in with necessary personal items and other supplies, and hit the road to Alaska.

Also, what are your impressions, thoughts, and comments about your dealer? I'm thinking mainly of the big three, Cruise America, El Monte, and Camping World.

It sounds as if most, if not all of you, have confidence in the condition of your vehicles. Maybe my thought to pick up and hit the road would be feasible.

Don

[LuvMT]

When we picked ours up we were provided a 3 page list of the items that were reconditioned/replaced during the refurbishment. I double-checked and it appears accurate. I was also lucky enough to receive the repair order records, showing among other things, a complete frontend rebuild (tie rod ends, ball joints, etc). This had been done just two weeks prior during refurbishment also, and showed $800 worth of work from a Ford dealer. There was nothing wrong with the RV when we got it, and it drove great. There was a complete set of BRAND NEW tires on it also, and they were top name brand, not cheapy knockoffs like car dealers put on. I have yet to find anything wrong with it.

As I do with ALL of my used vehicles that I purchase because I cannot be certain what the previous owner did, I took it in and had ALL fluids and filters changed out. I also did the serpentine belt as it appeared original and it is the last thing you want coming off. Sure, you can carry a spare, but I challenge you to replace one on the side of a dusty road in less than a day minimum. They are a royal pain to get to in the E series to say the least. I have not yet done a "tuneup" as it runs great now and if it gets to a point that it isn't running efficient due to worn plugs/wires etc to a point that it is an issue, you will usually get the check engine light to tell you to start replacing things.

I do not like to brag too much about the deals Cruise seems to give on RV's that just a couple of years ago MSRP'd at 4 times what I paid, because if EVERYONE bought their RV's the deals would not be near as good as they are now. But I do cringe when I see people drive off a dealer lot in the same basic rig as mine but have paid $20000 plus more than I did. When you talk to them they say "at least mine wasn't abused by a bunch of renters, that is why I dished out 10's of thousands more." I always wonder how they know the previous owners of the rigs they bought didn't do the same. And WHAT kind of private party refurbishes the rig and puts all new tires and other parts on it prior to trading it? NONE.

[Mocoondo]

donrebyct wrote:
I'm wondering what type of additional maintenance may be required on a retired rental, especially one of the high mileage units from Cruise America (currently minimum of 120K miles).

I would assume the unit would have new or very good tires, any known problems fixed on the truck and/or camper, etc. But, I'm thinking about things like hoses and serpentine belts. Are these normally replaced by the seller?

Thanks in advance for any comments or suggestions.

Don in AR

I would just continue on with the manufacturers recommended maintenance schedule and address mechanical issues as they arise. High mileage does not mean prone to defects.

[gotsmart]

donrebyct wrote:
I'm wondering what type of additional maintenance may be required on a retired rental, especially one of the high mileage units from Cruise America (currently minimum of 120K miles).

I would assume the unit would have new or very good tires, any known problems fixed on the truck and/or camper, etc. But, I'm thinking about things like hoses and serpentine belts. Are these normally replaced by the seller? To my knowledge the answer is: if it is a safety issue then it is serviced, otherwise no.
....

Thanks in advance for any comments or suggestions.

Don in AR

When I bought my Cruise America rental in 2011 I was told by the salesperson that CA puts new tires on the RV when it is taken out of the rental fleet and put up for sale. My tire are dated 2010.

Expect to do the 100,000 mile maintenance service, and then some. Here is a link to a post of mine the contains several links to the work that I had done on the motorhome. Some of the links include price information.

On 9 May 2013 I had the all 10 spark plugs and all 10 plug boots replaced for about $350 USD. Note: this did not include the coil packs - which are about $75 each. Coil packs only need to be replaced as they fail. Here is a link about the spark plugs.

[donrebyct]

I'm wondering what type of additional maintenance may be required on a retired rental, especially one of the high mileage units from Cruise America (currently minimum of 120K miles).

I would assume the unit would have new or very good tires, any known problems fixed on the truck and/or camper, etc. But, I'm thinking about things like hoses and serpentine belts. Are these normally replaced by the seller?

I have a 94 Falcon class B on a Dodge with about 90K miles. It runs good, for the most part. But, to prep it for our planned trip to Alaska this summer, I've been advised to change all of the hoses, serpentine belt, give it a complete lube job, and a bunch of other things. This is in addition to stuff already fixed on the truck: new front brakes (after caliper freeze coming down a mountain), new shocks, new tires, and now a new battery. The coach is another story.

I don't want to get into another RV that will nickel and dime me to death before or during my long trip.

Thanks in advance for any comments or suggestions.

Don in AR

[LuvMT]

Mocoondo wrote:

KristinU wrote:

Schooner wrote:

One of the rental companies claims to have sold 120,000 former rentals and if there were problems specific to them, it would be showing up.

Very true. Lots of opinions out there on "I'd never buy a previous rental" but few owners, which I believe is why IAMICHABOD started this thread.

10 pages long and I don't recall reading any posts saying they were hosed and wished they hadn't bought one. I'm sure they're out there, but unhappy owners are out there with brand spanking new units as well.

You will generally find that most of the people who talk negatively about retired rental units have never owned one and therefore have no clue about what they speak of.

You will rarely hear someone say, 'I bought this ex-rental unit and really got screwed. I'll never do that again.....'

All very true. Let me first say I am not affiliated with Cruise America in any way. I am just a working American who wanted a newer RV for the summer trips for my family. I put 2000 miles a YEAR on the RV, pulling a boat or a Jeep. We have had ZERO problems. We love that it is only a few years old and thus looks and drives like new still. Ours has 150,000 miles on it. I will not say what we paid but we did talk them down from their already LOW price and considering it was near $60,000 when new I feel we got the best dollar value anywhere. Whenever I hear of someone (a friend of mine included) saying they would never buy a used rental I now feel like they are pretty ignorant and do NOT know what they are talking about. There are dealerships in my area that sell the exact same RV's, but with less miles, for TENS OF THOUSANDS more, and they are pre-owned as well! Even if I were to have to replace the 1)engine, 2)transmission, 3)rear axle, as well as rebuild the frontend (latter of which had just been done on mine including ball joints), I would still be THOUSANDS of dollars ahead of the guy who spent 30 grand or more on his same unit. BUT, the chances of all that happening are slim to none. You see, by the time I am done with this RV, I will have put maybe 20000 miles on it. E series chassis routinely go to 300000 miles without issue. I will have a whopping 170000 miles on it when it is time to get rid of it. I will ask a few thousand dollars and go buy another Cruise America RV. The same guy who spent $35000 on the same unit will have maybe 60000 miles his, and it will be just as rotted as mine. Only I am out a fraction of what he is. Am I worried about the miles? Not in the least. Cruise America will not sell complete junk (if they have a unit like this they just sell it for scrap or part it out). They sell decent to very nice units that all come with warranties. Those of us buying these 5 year old units, and that only use them as "recreation" vehicles and not full-timing, are probably the smartest purchasers out there. That said, if my only purchase was for an RV so I could live and travel in it FULLTIME, I would buy new. After all, it IS your home and starting out with something half used up is not smart. However, if you put so few miles a year on a motor vehicle that mother nature will take its toll before mechanical wear and tear ever will, then used Cruise America units are THEE best value, period. Of course, that is the opinion of someone who finally bought one after buying used RV's off of Craigslist for years. 😉 I know there will always be those out there that would not pay one red cent for a used rental ANYTHING. That is fine with me, it keeps costs down!

[IAMICHABOD]

I think the 120,000 number is quite a stretch when you look at the Large National Brands like Cruise America, with the turn over on a 3 year schedule. They started in 1973 and claims to have sold about 25,000.

El Monte started in 1970 and is a smaller company but turns over its fleet every 18 to 24 months as it did in 2007, that is about another 20,000.

They also sell thru their whole sale dealers where they had 1,600 units in their sales fleet in 2010, both Class C and Class A RVs.
The company provides a complete service history along with the original manufacturer’s owner care packet with operating manuals.
That is one reason I bought from them.
Needless to say there are a lot of owners of Ex Rentals out there and most seem to be happy, or we would have heard from them I would think.

[Mocoondo]

IAMICHABOD wrote:

I have also heard that number of 120,000 Ex Rentals sold but I have never seen it in print, so I don't know if it is true but with the amount of rental RVs out there they have to go somewhere when retired. I would really like to know that number. I bet it is huge.

I wouldn't know the exact number, however, I do know that one rental company likes to run their units three years before retirement. Some run their units on a 5 year retirement schedule. One of the larger national brands has about 5,000 units in the fleet on a 3 year schedule. This means that, on average, they retire approximately 1,600 units per year.

[IAMICHABOD]

Mocoondo wrote:

KristinU wrote:

Schooner wrote:

One of the rental companies claims to have sold 120,000 former rentals and if there were problems specific to them, it would be showing up.

Very true. Lots of opinions out there on "I'd never buy a previous rental" but few owners, which I believe is why IAMICHABOD started this thread.

10 pages long and I don't recall reading any posts saying they were hosed and wished they hadn't bought one. I'm sure they're out there, but unhappy owners are out there with brand spanking new units as well.

You will generally find that most of the people who talk negatively about retired rental units have never owned one and therefore have no clue about what they speak of.

You will rarely hear someone say, 'I bought this ex-rental unit and really got screwed. I'll never do that again.....'

It is true that I started this thread to get to the real owners of Ex Rentals and hear their stories and not just hear from the ones that have never owned one and therefore have no clue about what they speak of.

So far I think there are about 26 or so on this thread that have had positive things to say about their ownership, and not one that said 'I bought this ex-rental unit and really got screwed. I'll never do that again.....'

I have also heard that number of 120,000 Ex Rentals sold but I have never seen it in print, so I don't know if it is true but with the amount of rental RVs out there they have to go somewhere when retired. I would really like to know that number. I bet it is huge.

[Mocoondo]

KristinU wrote:

Schooner wrote:

One of the rental companies claims to have sold 120,000 former rentals and if there were problems specific to them, it would be showing up.

Very true. Lots of opinions out there on "I'd never buy a previous rental" but few owners, which I believe is why IAMICHABOD started this thread.

10 pages long and I don't recall reading any posts saying they were hosed and wished they hadn't bought one. I'm sure they're out there, but unhappy owners are out there with brand spanking new units as well.

You will generally find that most of the people who talk negatively about retired rental units have never owned one and therefore have no clue about what they speak of.

You will rarely hear someone say, 'I bought this ex-rental unit and really got screwed. I'll never do that again.....'