Ford Fuel pump rant

[ronaz01]

It's been a while since I've been on the forum and using our rig as well. Financial and personal problems along with my neglect are some problems. I went to start the RV back in April and of course it took a while. It did start and ran but when I tried to start it again it wouldn't I came back a few hours later and after several cranks it started. My neighbor sad fuel pump and I told him that I had it changed once already.

My neglect contributed to the problem and also the bad fuel pumps Ford sells. I researched the internet and other forums and suggestions were to replace filter. I did and the problem existed. It started to get way to hot to work on it so I left it alone for a while and decided to call for quotes at various dealers.

The first time in 2008 it cost me $1500. Some of the quotes I got now are $800+- One dealer told me $1500 and blatantly admitted that the pumps only last 7-8 years!. I told him that I treat my gas and he said it didn't matter I asked how come so much and he told me the pump is $500 and the rest labor. Another dealer told me the pump is only about $150.

I guess I am going to learn how to drop the tank. I have read where it may be possible to cut an access in the floor to be able to get to the pump without dropping the tank. Sorry for the rant.

[ronaz01]

Forgot to say I was teaching my then 19 year old son to operate the RV when the tire blew. Wife and #2 son were on our six in a car. I was telling him if he was to have a blow out what to do. Five seconds later BOOOM! wife on two way radio "you blew a tire" My reply "No S#$t" I told my son to take foot off gas and coast to side of the road. He did well for about 5 minutes of drive time with a full on blowout. Quarter mile down the road was a repair place We limped there and they got us fixed and on our way home.

[ronaz01]

Ron. I had an older 70's plymouth and the mechanical pump went out. I had never changed one before and was anxious about doing it. 30 minutes later I was driving again. I understand the pump in the tank to get the pressure up the distance in needs to run. Manufacturers need to make parts like this last. I am going to look under the bed in mine to see how difficult it would be to add an access port. I have a feeling the water tank is just right there. I changed the fuel filter thinking that was the problem and doing so I had to wrestle around around a frame crossover which the filter was directly above. A foot on either side and I would have had no interference removing the filter. Either the frame was built after filter install or they put the filter in first and then added the frame. I had a blowout on the left rear inner tire. It took the filler tub enad wrapped it around the axle. The repair place unwrapped it and reattached. Whe I got home I wanted to check for damage. Small hole in floor I patched and the tube is bent. I replace when I drop the tank. But. I think a little more structure near the wheel well and the filler neck to protect it wouldn't have hurt anything. Had the tube been ripped from the tank it would have had to be towed. I am also going to see if I can weld something there to prevent or lessen damage incase that should happen again.

[ron_dittmer]

I can understand why the industry mounts the pump inside the fuel tank. In the old days, the fuel pump was mechanical & mounted to the side of the engine. They had an arm that worked like an old water well in a forest preserve park. The arm would be pushed down from a cam inside the engine. When the pump started to fail, you had gas all over the engine compartment.

Inside the tank, if it's leaking, it leaks into the perfect place such that nobody knows about it. Unfortunately tank pumps are terrible to replace when there is no easy access. For most vehicles with fuel tanks under the truck floor, it would be real nice if there was an access panel under the removable carpet. But maybe there are liability issues with Ford Pinto like concerns.

[carringb]

pnichols wrote:
After reading this thread ... it makes me wish that after-market manufacturers would offer replacement gas tanks with dual fuel pumps such that both operated completely independent of each other, with separate electrical circuits and separate feeds into the fuel line going to the engine.

It would be pretty easy to add a 2nd mid-ship tank from a van. Both Ford and the aftermarket have selector valves to pick between the two tanks (and even switch the fuel gauge to the tank in use).

[falconbrother]

Some folks cut an access panel in their floor over the tank to get to the pump.

[pnichols]

After reading this thread ... it makes me wish that after-market manufacturers would offer replacement gas tanks with dual fuel pumps such that both operated completely independent of each other, with separate electrical circuits and separate feeds into the fuel line going to the engine.

[ron_dittmer]

More often than not, when replacing a bad fuel pump, you can get the pump working to drain the fuel tank by slapping the bottom of the fuel tank with a 12-16 inch long 2x4. The jolt will get the pump working again. It is not a permanent fix because it will reoccur when the motor stops on the same bad spot on the armature.

To slap the bottom of the tank safely without any damage to the tank, place one end of the 2x4 against the tank, then slap it as if it was hinged. Make sure you slap a flat part of the tank, not a curved or tumored area. Protruding ribs should be avoided. Indented ribs on an otherwise flat area of the tank is a fine place to slap.

So fist get yourself setup by

- disconnect the fuel line at the fuel filter and add a rubber extension hose to a vehicle which is low on fuel, or gas can (s)
- wire up "constant power" to the pump so it will run by itself without the ignition key
- slap the tank with the 2x4. It could take 20 or more slaps. The harder the better as long as you don't dent or otherwise damage the gas tank.

Hopefully the slapping will jump-start the pump and drain all the fuel from the tank.

Slapping also works when stranded, but who carries such a 2x4? It allows you to get to a repair shop without towing the motor home. It is also nice to get out of an area you are not comfortable abandoning your motor home.

It works the same with every vehicle with an in-tank fuel pump. If you have an external pump, you can bang on it too to get you going. But be careful not to dent it.

[Lngbeard]

Found lowering the tank onto lengths of PVC pipe allowed me to roll the tank out from under the coach quite easily.

[BruceMc]

When we purchased our used 2000 Four Winds in 2010, we had intermittent start problems. It was odd - try to start it, and it would just crank. Turn it off and back on/start, it would fire right up.
I suspected the issue might be the fuel pump but as I had a workaround, I didn't do anything about it.
Then once, and only once, it died on us while we were on the road. Fortunately we were on a local road traveling at about 20 mph, so we coasted to a stop, looked at each other, then tried to start it. Fired right up.


Then during my winter monthlies in January 2013, it failed to start. No amount of off/on/crank/off/on/crank would help. First check: when first turning it on, does the pump run for a couple-three seconds?

Your friend's may be like mine was - it had a swollen nylon pump gear, and it would catch occasionally. Apparently the ethanol finally swelled it to the point where it wouldn't rotate at all.

Full story here: Fuel pump replacment

And The pump tear-down, complete with pics.

Hope that helps!

[Lngbeard]

I did the fuel pump replacement in my 2001 E-350 based Chateau sport.
Was unable to siphon fuel as there is a roll over check ball. Tried thru the vent line also and was not able to get a siphon thru that either. Used motor cycle tie downs going from frame rail to frame rail to keep tank level and secure while lowering with jack. Take loose hose clamps for filler and vent line. Lower just enough to reach fuel lines (have fuel line quick disconnect tool ready) and electrical connections. Used brass punch and wooden hammer to remove collar holding fuel pump in the tank. Had old pump out and new one in the tank in a couple minutes. Overall even with full tank it was a maybe a 4 hour job. Only spent around $200 for Napa replacement fuel pump. I think in cool conditions,,making sure there are no ignition sources around, no electric tools, battery disconnected, this can be safely done by a reasonably handy person.

[ronaz01]

I just looked on Amazon for price comparisons for pumps they are any where from $50 to $300. I'm not sure where the one service tech got $500 unless he's trying to increase his take home pay!
I will be researching more. I won't be able to do my own repair right now. Too hot to be crawling under the RV so I will wait until it cooler and can have my son help. In the mean time I will be searching for videos to remove the tank and connections. Thanks for all the advice. It's help full and I don''t feel so alone knowing I'm not the only one with this problem or feel the same way about it.

[pnichols]

A 20% drop in mileage only makes sense if:

1) The E85 is at least 20% less money

AND

2) If it's at least 20% less money .... and if you're an RV'er .... you enjoy stopping your rig 20% more times to refuel.

As far as corn farmes are concerned ... I'd rather be paying less for the cereal that I eat for breakfast.

[maillemaker]

E85 costs less because it doesn't contain as much energy per gallon. No one would buy it and take the 20% drop in mileage if it was the same price as regular gasoline.

Personally, I love ethanol gas. Our minivan burns it, and we use it all the time. It's not a big deal for now as right now the US is a next exporter of petroleum products. And we buy little oil now from the Middle East. But when we were, I like it. I'd rather be paying corn farmers in Iowa than some Shiek in the Middle East. I'll even pay a premium in the form of lower gas mileage for that satisfaction.

Of course right now we are on an upswing of domestic production thanks to fracking but that won't last.

[TyroneandGladys]

Had been going through front tank fuel pumps at the rate of one per year till I changed mechanics. The mechanic in Mesa discovered a very fine silt in the bottom of the front tank which was taking out the fuel pumps. He continued checking things out and discovered the fill hose had some small cracks in it that allowed road dust to get into the tank. If you want the name of the shop PM me and I will give it to you. He also has a modification that dramatically reduces dog house heat.