What year would you look for?

[mr61impala]

Hello all, we are beginning our search for a used Class C and have 3 questions.

1). In what year did Ford switch from the 4 speed automatic to the 5 speed Torqshift transmission?

2). What years of Ford engines had insufficient spark plug threads?

3). I have heard that Ford Class C motorhomes use only engines with 2 valve cylinder heads instead of the 3 valve heads with the problematic cam phasers commonly found in Class A's, is this true?

Thanks in advance.

[mr61impala]

I'm not interested in a diesel. I have an acquaintance who is a 19 year mechanic at Bruce Walter's Ford in Pikeville Ky., he strongly advised me against either the 6.0L and 6.4L Ford diesels warning of reliability issues and expense of repairs. It seems neither engine has the customary number of head bolts, the 6.0L is likely to develop expensive EGR issues and the 6.4L is likely to develop expensive turbo issues. His recommendation was to find a 2 valve V-10 gasoline engine.

At this point I am thinking 2008 and up E450 would be best, but a good deal on a 2005-2007 would be worth a 2nd look.

Thanks for all the help!

[pnichols]

As I understand it, 2005 cutaway van chassis year is when the computer controlled 5 speed (6 speeds internally) TorqShift transmission began to be offered. What you get with this tranny is more than just one (or two) more gears. I'd recommend getting a 2005 or later chassis under a Class C if going with the Ford V10 hardware.

By the way, the V10 on our Class C has been superb. I haven't noticed any pulling power loss in our mountain touring up to the highest we have traveled - 9600 feet. As a couple of bonuses .... it's cooling system far surpasses that on any truck I've owned, and it idles quieter than any generator so we idle it sometimes for really stealthy first-hour RV charging using it's 130 amp alternator to supply up to 50 amps into the coach's AGM batteries. However, we do have the E450 chassis with the more aggressive rear differential ratio and we are not afraid to use it's high RPM band to tap it's horsepower .... since it's designed for it anyway.

Also, if getting a Ford chassis based Class C over 24 feet, make sure it's the E450 chassis instead of the E350 chasis .... so as to get the better differential gearing, increased brake size, and wider rear track width for more laterally stability on curves and in cross winds.

[mr61impala]

Thanks for all of the good education, you guys are a wealth of knowledge!

[Gooding__R]

The 6.4 was a totally different monster from the 6.0. I had a 6.0 and it was the worst engine I had ever owned. The 6.4 I have now has a 6 speed trans and a Propane injection system. We have never used the Propane because it has all the power we have never needed. Getting ready to venture out on our next around the States tour in 3 weeks. See you on the Mountains.

[ron_dittmer]

Gooding. R wrote:
Shop around and see if you can find a Diesel class C. I had the V-10 and it was so sick on HP and torque it would change gears going up and overpass. We were very displeased with the V-10 version. Shopped around and found a 2009 Coachmen Concord with the 6.4 diesel and there is a thousand times difference in the performance and the fuel mileage is 1/3rd better. Not to mention the life of the engine. Can't imagine why they even put gas engines in a vehicle that large.

Interesting.

Though we would all agree with your point on "shifting behavior at over-passes" this is quite the opposite of what I typically read for the E-series chassis. The V10 is a top performer in regards to power (yes at high rpms) but the 6.0L diesel has been very disappointing and also quite temperamental in the reliability department. Since you mentioned 6.4L diesel, I wonder if that is something else altogether different.

[ron_dittmer]

Hopefully our resident expert CarringB will step in, but I believe you get past all the gremlins and get the Torqshift transmission when buying a 2006 E-Series chassis, but maybe even a 2005 model year.

We have a 2007 E350 which has an external transmission filter & pan-with-drain-plug. Too bad Ford cut cost and got rid of the easy trans maintenance.

If you get a 2008, you get the current-day more capable suspension & brakes, but retain the earlier dash board design. 2009 to current-day is virtually unchanged.

Given the weight of our actual RV house & contents is nicely proportioned to the capability of the chassis, there are no concerns of over-loading. But that is RV/rig dependent.

Another point to note is that we did have to add heavy duty stabilizer bars and more to get "Ideal" handling. The 2007 and older E350's were not equipped with any rear stabilizer bar, let-along a thick heavy duty one. Ours is all perfect now, but there was some additional investment to get there. Keep in-mind that buying a used rig, a previous owner may have done many such upgrades. That would be a selling feature for sure.

[tatest]

I would not worry so much about 4-speed vs 5-speed for highway performance, as once you are over 30 mph the gearing is the same. 1st in the four speed was split into two gears, a granny and an intermediate gear between 1st and 2nd, so that 3-4-5 on the 5 speed are the same gears as 2-3-4 on the 4 speed. When Ford reduced the size of the Powerstroke from 7.3 to 6.0 liters, it needed a granny gear to keep the same tow ratings in the heaviest applications.

The real advantages of the 5-speed are:

Built slightly heavier.
Engine braking smarts built into controller, active in tow-haul mode.
Actually a six speed. Goes 1-2-3-4-5 in normal acceleration, downshifts from 5th to a 3-overdrive for passing. This gear is slightly higher than 4 (direct) so it can be used to a higher speed before having to shift back up.

The real upgrades to the E-series were implemented in 2008/9 model years when the front axle and brakes were beefed up, front crush behavior improved, and the driveshaft parking brake may have disappeared (not sure about that for E-450).

There were also major improvements in the electronics, bringing a number of functional adjustments out to a monitor panel in the dash. Vans got stability assist as well, but motorhome chassis won't have that.

If you can afford a more recent model, look for the new squared off front end. My 2013 E-350 drives so much better than the 2003 E-450, front end behavior particularly.

[EMD360]

Just off the top of my head and from reading about it, I believe the spark plug problem had a series of improvements such that the older models are more likely to get the threads stripped and blow than the 2000 to 2002 with the problem going away in 2003. Someone may confirm or deny my memory.

[Mich_F]

Gooding. R wrote:
Shop around and see if you can find a Diesel class C. I had the V-10 and it was so sick on HP and torque it would change gears going up and overpass. We were very displeased with the V-10 version. Shopped around and found a 2009 Coachmen Concord with the 6.4 diesel and there is a thousand time difference in the performance and the fuel mileage is 1/3rd better. Not to mention the life of the engine. Can't imagine why they even put gas engines in a vehicle that large.

I'm far from being an expert on the V10, but I would guess your changing gears while going up an overpass, was probably due to your cruise control trying to keep the speed up while climbing the overpass, and not due to HP or torque issues. 😉
I know my 24' 1997 V10 would do that, although I haven't even paid any attention to that in my 31K, as I hardly ever use cruise control.

[Mich_F]

There are a number of reasons for the lack of diesels in class C motorhomes. A while back I saw an article (can't find it now) which covered the different Ford diesels (Fords have for a number of years, pretty much dominated the larger class C market) on why there are so few in Ford class Cs . Some of them were done in by emissions issues. others physically wouldn't fit, while others had issues with cooling, or other problems in a class C.

[Gooding__R]

Shop around and see if you can find a Diesel class C. I had the V-10 and it was so sick on HP and torque it would change gears going up and overpass. We were very displeased with the V-10 version. Shopped around and found a 2009 Coachmen Concord with the 6.4 diesel and there is a thousand times difference in the performance and the fuel mileage is 1/3rd better. Not to mention the life of the engine. Can't imagine why they even put gas engines in a vehicle that large.

[Snowman9000]

The E450 doesn't have room in the engine bay for the 3 valve version.

[Mich_F]

mr61impala wrote:
Hello all, we are beginning our search for a used Class C and have 3 questions.

1). In what year did Ford switch from the 4 speed automatic to the 5 speed Torqshift transmission?

2). What years of Ford engines had insufficient spark plug threads?

3). I have heard that Ford Class C motorhomes use only engines with 2 valve cylinder heads instead of the commonly found in Class A's, is this true?

Thanks in advance.

For what it's worth, I copied each of your first two questions and did a google search, and cam up with answers of 2003, for question # 1 and 1997-2003 for question #2. :B
Those are cab and chassis model years, which could very well be different from the RV model year on those vehicles.
It is true that Class Cs have the 2 valve V10, while Class As have the 3 valve. I believe the difference is 305HP for the 2 valve, compared to 362HP for the 3 valve version.